@Jemimah,
I've been able to reproduce the panic. It appears to be connected with a real power-off shutdown, not a reboot, although the non-deterministic nature of the problem doesn't allow me to swear to this.
I've attached a picture of the resulting screen. In this one, the line with the original panic message has just scrolled off the top.
While wpa_gui does connect to the network with secure wpa, it remains very confusing. It continues to come up with the unplugged eth0 selected. Also, when I select the ath0 adapter, the network drop down only shows 0:. It waits for something I don't understand to display the network with the SSID I want, even though some process is connecting.
I've tried to scan networks and select the one I want by double-clicking. This doesn't go to the existing entry, it creates a new one. After I add the "new" network, there are two entries (or more) on the network drop down. Selecting the first gets me the network I originally wanted. Perhaps the worst characteristic, from a human engineering standpoint, is that when the gui fails it leaves no clue, or misleading clues, as to why.
Puppeee 4.3X
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prehistoric
- Posts: 1744
- Joined: Tue 23 Oct 2007, 17:34
panic message on 900A
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- panic.jpg
- readable screen shot of shutdown panic on 900A running beta 6
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Prehistoric, yep that looks like a kernel panic alright. I'm putting ath5k back as the default, and the people for whom the madwifi driver works, can switch it manually.
I'm working on Pwireless2 to replace wpa_gui. It should be less confusing, though with somewhat fewer features.
That blank network, that means "connect to any open wireless network you find." You can control which networks it picks by adjusting the priorities of your profiles. Wpa_supplicant doesn't really have another way to allow you to select an arbitrary network to connect to. It looks at it's config file and automatically picks the highest priority network.
I'm working on Pwireless2 to replace wpa_gui. It should be less confusing, though with somewhat fewer features.
That blank network, that means "connect to any open wireless network you find." You can control which networks it picks by adjusting the priorities of your profiles. Wpa_supplicant doesn't really have another way to allow you to select an arbitrary network to connect to. It looks at it's config file and automatically picks the highest priority network.
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prehistoric
- Posts: 1744
- Joined: Tue 23 Oct 2007, 17:34
wireless networking features and security
The thing which bugs me about that "connect to any open network" is that some of these networks are definitely hostile environments.jemimah wrote:...That blank network, that means "connect to any open wireless network you find." You can control which networks it picks by adjusting the priorities of your profiles. Wpa_supplicant doesn't really have another way to allow you to select an arbitrary network to connect to. It looks at it's config file and automatically picks the highest priority network.
Begin rant
I left my home network open until I found some clown trying to diddle with the router settings. Now, I run WPA encryption and don't use any of the nearby open networks. People who do regularly get clobbered. (Of course, they're running Windows.)
I don't recall any time during set up of wpa_gui that I told it to connect to open networks. This is a common preference, but it should no longer be the default, there are simply too many people out there at some locations trying to mess things up. If you know the computing environment is reasonably safe, you can allow it to connect. For people who don't know what they're connecting to this can be a pitfall. Give people useful information, and let them choose. Don't make this too automatic.
I have a USB wireless adapter with a 9dbi omnidirectional antenna I can use with a laptop. I can put it on a USB extension cable so it sits by a window while I sit on the couch. When I visit condos or apartments near the major tourist areas, it is no surprise now to pick up 15 usable networks from a single location, as I did last week. With a good reflector, this becomes an excellent directional antenna.
I have no idea how many networks I can find with this combination if I try. More to the point, I have no idea how many people with similar equipment could provide an access point with a signal strong enough to connect to, it could be dozens. The probability that one of these will be up to no good is no longer negligible, at least not in places where you find lots of confused people throwing money around.
Locally, we've had some fairly sophisticated phishing schemes run in tourist areas. I believe, but cannot prove, some are doing tricks with the DNS. This kind of crap will work on any OS, if you can convince people they are securely connected to a site they trust, like their bank. Security companies are now offering their own secure DNS systems.
End of rant
Jakfish, do you get the same result if you rerun xorgwizard? I tried your file device file against my copy of xorgwizard and it seems to detect the touchpad.
Prehistoric, I left that in there as an example since it's not at all obvious how to set it up. You're probably right though that it may not be good to have that enabled by default. I haven't really had to worry about it since I moved out of the city. I do admit to having had a little fun with a cantenna in my last apartment complex, although I've never lived in the heart of Defcon like apparently you do.
Prehistoric, I left that in there as an example since it's not at all obvious how to set it up. You're probably right though that it may not be good to have that enabled by default. I haven't really had to worry about it since I moved out of the city. I do admit to having had a little fun with a cantenna in my last apartment complex, although I've never lived in the heart of Defcon like apparently you do.
Hi, jemimah,
I tried rerunning xorgwizard, I tried a fresh install, no go--there's something incompatible with elantech and the 900.
Should I go back to the earlier beta (whose wifi doesn't work as well as your current version) or will you be releasing non-elantech versions as you go along?
Best,
Jake
I tried rerunning xorgwizard, I tried a fresh install, no go--there's something incompatible with elantech and the 900.
Should I go back to the earlier beta (whose wifi doesn't work as well as your current version) or will you be releasing non-elantech versions as you go along?
Best,
Jake
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prehistoric
- Posts: 1744
- Joined: Tue 23 Oct 2007, 17:34
elantech touchpad and 900A
@Jakfish,
I'm running the standard Puppeee kernels on a 900A. I tried the no_elantech kernel sometime back, but saw no change. What is the symptom of the problem you are having?
Because of the problem I''m having with the internal SSD, (which no one else reports,) I strongly suspect ASUS has changed parts in the middle of a production run for this model. This could also be true of the new touchpads.
I'm running the standard Puppeee kernels on a 900A. I tried the no_elantech kernel sometime back, but saw no change. What is the symptom of the problem you are having?
Because of the problem I''m having with the internal SSD, (which no one else reports,) I strongly suspect ASUS has changed parts in the middle of a production run for this model. This could also be true of the new touchpads.
What I have is a touchpad's inability to do exact work (i.e. close a file). The pointer can't be placed in the middle of a closing X without tremendous difficulty.
You have a 900A, however, which is a different can of worms than the plain ole 900.
For the 900, running the no_elantech kernel is night and day. I have no issues with the touchpad with the no_elantech kernel.
Jake
You have a 900A, however, which is a different can of worms than the plain ole 900.
For the 900, running the no_elantech kernel is night and day. I have no issues with the touchpad with the no_elantech kernel.
Jake
Jakfish, wait for the next release, the networking will get better hopefully. The problem with the touchpad is that the synaptics driver is not loading like it's supposed to. It's definitely not a hardware problem. Try the attached xorg.conf and see if it's fixed.
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- xorg.conf.gz
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prehistoric
- Posts: 1744
- Joined: Tue 23 Oct 2007, 17:34
wireless security
It's only a matter of time until Defcon comes here.jemimah wrote:...I do admit to having had a little fun with a cantenna in my last apartment complex, although I've never lived in the heart of Defcon like apparently you do.
My experience with cantennas is that the name and the original idea of using a Pringles can are big selling points. The Pringles can had poor electrical characteristics. More recent commercial offerings are better, but still nothing spectacular. A large can which once held stewed tomatoes did better in tests. You can get similar gain from commercial flat wall-mount antennas.
My greatest success has been with a cheap USB wifi adapter and the lid of a wok. Unfortunately, I have no pictures of this remarkable device in operation.
After my third call to clean up the same system clobbered over open wireless, I installed a secure wireless link. One end is shown in the attached photograph.
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- wifix800.JPG
- Ingredients:
1 cheap wireless router
1 cheap external antenna
1 baking sheet (ungreased) - (62.83 KiB) Downloaded 321 times
Hi, jemimah,
Yes, I did reboot, and here is the file you wanted.
Yes, I did reboot, and here is the file you wanted.
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- Xorg.0.zip
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theirs a good reason i didn't make a 4.3 pupeee. its very simple stock 4.3 works perfect on most netbooks. when you start striping down the kernel for speed you also start braking compatibly with other netbooks or pcs.
its great someone wanted to pick off where i left off like i did with the old 3x versions. but if your going to do a netbook style you gotta make sure you leave support in. and netbook hardware has been making a change from your standard Intel gma boards to ati and even nivida models. so just neddeding gma drivers is becoming a thing of the past. i never could get dri to work correctly no matter what i did to it new kernel etc.
i will suggest if your going to uses a netbook only kernel you should look to array.org and there netbook kernels. the moblin fast boot kernel your using is only meant for atoms. older model eeepc will not work with it. or anything that does not use a atom.
as for not including a iso well its a simple 1 step to get a iso on a usb device unetbootin. some people use usb cdroms hence why i included it.
sucks your getting stability issues btw.
expect me back for the 5x woof series then i wont have to rely on pets for everything and will have a much easier time building a nice puppy distro for everyone.
its great someone wanted to pick off where i left off like i did with the old 3x versions. but if your going to do a netbook style you gotta make sure you leave support in. and netbook hardware has been making a change from your standard Intel gma boards to ati and even nivida models. so just neddeding gma drivers is becoming a thing of the past. i never could get dri to work correctly no matter what i did to it new kernel etc.
i will suggest if your going to uses a netbook only kernel you should look to array.org and there netbook kernels. the moblin fast boot kernel your using is only meant for atoms. older model eeepc will not work with it. or anything that does not use a atom.
as for not including a iso well its a simple 1 step to get a iso on a usb device unetbootin. some people use usb cdroms hence why i included it.
sucks your getting stability issues btw.
expect me back for the 5x woof series then i wont have to rely on pets for everything and will have a much easier time building a nice puppy distro for everyone.
I hear you Luther. It certainly can be frustrating trying to roll your own kernel. I'm not really trying to build something that does everything for everybody. Mostly, this is just my experiment, and if it doesn't work for people, well, as you said, the stock kernel works pretty well. I initially wanted a kernel that was as light as possible for my machine, just to see if I could do it. I probably can't keep up with the speed at which Asus changes their hardware, and I certainly have no plans to build my own kernel for "all netbooks". I may build the array kernel or the moblin kernel at some point in the future to support a wider variety of hardware. I simply wanted to know what a truly minimalist kernel was like; and I've learned a whole heck of a lot in the process. It seemed wrong in my mind to run beautiful, minimalist, Puppy, with a bloated, everything but the Out house sink kernel, but the preference is aesthetic and certainly not everyone will agree with me.
Building the kernel is not that hard; anyone can grab a copy of the Array config file and give it a shot. The kernel almost never fails to compile, although the trick is figuring out what all the options actually do.
AFAIK the stability problem is simply the madwifi drivers. I wanted to know if they were really better, but obviously not for everyone!
Building the kernel is not that hard; anyone can grab a copy of the Array config file and give it a shot. The kernel almost never fails to compile, although the trick is figuring out what all the options actually do.
AFAIK the stability problem is simply the madwifi drivers. I wanted to know if they were really better, but obviously not for everyone!
Last edited by jemimah on Tue 10 Nov 2009, 05:54, edited 1 time in total.
Jakfish, that log file showed that the Synaptics driver did load with the new xorg.conf I gave you. Can you run Desktop->flsynclient, and mess with the settings and see if you can make it better? I changed nothing between the older versions and this version that should have affected the touchpad, so it's really a baffling problem. Otherwise, I guess I'll just rebuild the non-Elantech kernel for ornery touchpads. I know the Array kernel leaves Elantech off by default for this exact reason.
madwifi worked well on older kernels like in 4.2 and atros chipssets. witch at the time most eees had. but madwifi is no longer needed with the 2.6.30 series kernel. it has a pretty big list of supported wifi chips these days.
newer models are using raillink and intel chipsets for there wifi. intels support linux well but the raillink can give you a headache. kinda like how brodcoms used to be.
im really looking for the 5x series to really take the leash off this distro. its going to have alot better bulding tools and support for packages like debs to build on rather then relying on only gcc and pets.
the smallest possible kernel build is one you make to only have drivers for your hardware alone and nothing else. alot of hardcore users do that in fact the record right now with ubuntu 9.10 is 5 seconds on a i7 custom kernel machine.
i don't know if you have seen express gate that coming on alot of new machines. basically the bios have a mini linux os that's instant on. you can use that wile your main os loads. it has the basics like a full webbroswer Firefox i believe. instant messaging email pretty much a netbook in the bios. then when your main os is ready you can switch to it instantly.so boot times even on a vista bolted linux or win7 box wont really matter. seance you have what you need right away.
newer models are using raillink and intel chipsets for there wifi. intels support linux well but the raillink can give you a headache. kinda like how brodcoms used to be.
im really looking for the 5x series to really take the leash off this distro. its going to have alot better bulding tools and support for packages like debs to build on rather then relying on only gcc and pets.
the smallest possible kernel build is one you make to only have drivers for your hardware alone and nothing else. alot of hardcore users do that in fact the record right now with ubuntu 9.10 is 5 seconds on a i7 custom kernel machine.
i don't know if you have seen express gate that coming on alot of new machines. basically the bios have a mini linux os that's instant on. you can use that wile your main os loads. it has the basics like a full webbroswer Firefox i believe. instant messaging email pretty much a netbook in the bios. then when your main os is ready you can switch to it instantly.so boot times even on a vista bolted linux or win7 box wont really matter. seance you have what you need right away.
Some people mentioned that madwifi is still superior. It seemed about the same on my box so I put it out there to see what the response was. Guess it's only better on a couple of the EEEs.
I'm sort of curious how far into ubuntu you could get in 5 seconds, Is that 5 seconds to the command line? Or 5 seconds to a full gnome environment? I think this kernel will get Puppy to the command line in 5 seconds if booted from a fast drive. It takes a few more seconds to start X and stuff.
I'm not sure how I feel about the OS in the BIOS. The fun for me is customizing the OS. Tinkering with the BIOS though, not so fun. I'd love to have instant-on on my phone and such though. It's kinda hilarious how long phones like Blackberry and iPhone take to boot up.
I have mixed feelings about building puppy from debs. A better packaging system is necessary, but I think it will also lose a lot of the hand-crafted feel it currently has. Like the difference between something that's artisan-made, and something that's mass-produced. Again, a purely aesthetic opinion that I'm sure most people will disagree with me about.
I'm sort of curious how far into ubuntu you could get in 5 seconds, Is that 5 seconds to the command line? Or 5 seconds to a full gnome environment? I think this kernel will get Puppy to the command line in 5 seconds if booted from a fast drive. It takes a few more seconds to start X and stuff.
I'm not sure how I feel about the OS in the BIOS. The fun for me is customizing the OS. Tinkering with the BIOS though, not so fun. I'd love to have instant-on on my phone and such though. It's kinda hilarious how long phones like Blackberry and iPhone take to boot up.
I have mixed feelings about building puppy from debs. A better packaging system is necessary, but I think it will also lose a lot of the hand-crafted feel it currently has. Like the difference between something that's artisan-made, and something that's mass-produced. Again, a purely aesthetic opinion that I'm sure most people will disagree with me about.