@ciento
I think you will find that the majority of the 18,000 to be laid off are from microsoft's new purchase, Nokia company!
Should Studio 13.37 v2 be free? (answered: No)
-
matiasbatero
- Posts: 60
- Joined: Fri 12 Oct 2012, 01:27
- Location: Mar del Plata, Argentina
Hi Lowtech,
It's difficult to make money with opensource selling products, opensource world have their business selling support. There are some aspects for that Studio 13.37 should be free. But there are other factors for that Studio should not be free.
In my opinion, your knowledge is your single source to make money. And i think that people should pay for that, if not, you are devaluing your work.
The important part is, be honest with yourself and recognizes the value of your work and compare it with other projects made by the same effort. If quality and work are approximately similar looking some parameters, and these available projects are free, so your soft should be free too.
Remember: "Evaluate software in money terms is Difficult, Very difficult due their invisibility"
You can ask for some "parameters".. analyze some aspects..Ex:
-Relation beetween number of developers/contribuitors and amount of work done.
-Human resources. ex: ¿Is comparable the knowledge to build the specific characteristics of Studio13.37, with another software.. for ex: Ardour?
-Quality. Difficult to evaluate, but you can do it looking code quality for example.
-Methodology: structure of work, Professionalism.
-Technical: Ex: "Design of GUI for utilities are not equal to the Core, it have value of course, but is not comparable."
-¿Your work is based from other? etc..
At the end of analysis: If there are projects comparable, and some of these are Free. Your soft should be free. If there no comparison, you need to make money with your work.
Some reasons to your favor to make money:
-Your kernel modification seems to get best results to other modifications. And maybe this is for you knowledge.
-Low Latency, is a specific feature (On linux).
Some reasons to be free:
-Kernel modification its very important, but all distro works thanks to
Jack core. Jack is so fundamental and indispensable to work with audio on linux. Without jack, no audio. And Jack is free and opensource.
-All the "linux audio ecosystem" is free and opensource. A lot of software were made with this concept, and projects like yours. can allow to generate more software with better quality. At least, all your work is made to work with free/opensource.
In my humble opinion, i think that Studio 13.37v2 should be free, at least for now.
-Source code available.
-Make money promoting donations.
-Sell your work if you want only in Binary Format.
-Sell support (always)
If your project increases in value with the time. You can work with a team, and make second step.
-Sell binary with latest updates and more special features (Price 1)
-Sell binary with current version features (Price 2)
If Value tends to be very high, and you have a family of products.
And these products are comparable to commercial products.
-> Propietary Software.
---
Your decision defines all. All depends also in your personal interests.
If you have perspectives, what type of perspectives, or some vision.
Sometimes, but it this cases, is better to open a project with the community and open the possibility of grow... sometimes, the benefits for a lot of users is more big that personal benefit. Bet in Free Software world with "propietary aproach" is very difficult and a real challenge. This is not the market for these concept of marketing, 90/95% of software based in that model, unfortunately fall in time and not getting off.
Propietary Multi-Platform specific software, is much more to make money. But this is another topic..
Regards, and sorry for my english.
I hope you have been useful my opinion!
Matías. G.
It's difficult to make money with opensource selling products, opensource world have their business selling support. There are some aspects for that Studio 13.37 should be free. But there are other factors for that Studio should not be free.
In my opinion, your knowledge is your single source to make money. And i think that people should pay for that, if not, you are devaluing your work.
The important part is, be honest with yourself and recognizes the value of your work and compare it with other projects made by the same effort. If quality and work are approximately similar looking some parameters, and these available projects are free, so your soft should be free too.
Remember: "Evaluate software in money terms is Difficult, Very difficult due their invisibility"
You can ask for some "parameters".. analyze some aspects..Ex:
-Relation beetween number of developers/contribuitors and amount of work done.
-Human resources. ex: ¿Is comparable the knowledge to build the specific characteristics of Studio13.37, with another software.. for ex: Ardour?
-Quality. Difficult to evaluate, but you can do it looking code quality for example.
-Methodology: structure of work, Professionalism.
-Technical: Ex: "Design of GUI for utilities are not equal to the Core, it have value of course, but is not comparable."
-¿Your work is based from other? etc..
At the end of analysis: If there are projects comparable, and some of these are Free. Your soft should be free. If there no comparison, you need to make money with your work.
Some reasons to your favor to make money:
-Your kernel modification seems to get best results to other modifications. And maybe this is for you knowledge.
-Low Latency, is a specific feature (On linux).
Some reasons to be free:
-Kernel modification its very important, but all distro works thanks to
Jack core. Jack is so fundamental and indispensable to work with audio on linux. Without jack, no audio. And Jack is free and opensource.
-All the "linux audio ecosystem" is free and opensource. A lot of software were made with this concept, and projects like yours. can allow to generate more software with better quality. At least, all your work is made to work with free/opensource.
In my humble opinion, i think that Studio 13.37v2 should be free, at least for now.
-Source code available.
-Make money promoting donations.
-Sell your work if you want only in Binary Format.
-Sell support (always)
If your project increases in value with the time. You can work with a team, and make second step.
-Sell binary with latest updates and more special features (Price 1)
-Sell binary with current version features (Price 2)
If Value tends to be very high, and you have a family of products.
And these products are comparable to commercial products.
-> Propietary Software.
---
Your decision defines all. All depends also in your personal interests.
If you have perspectives, what type of perspectives, or some vision.
Sometimes, but it this cases, is better to open a project with the community and open the possibility of grow... sometimes, the benefits for a lot of users is more big that personal benefit. Bet in Free Software world with "propietary aproach" is very difficult and a real challenge. This is not the market for these concept of marketing, 90/95% of software based in that model, unfortunately fall in time and not getting off.
Propietary Multi-Platform specific software, is much more to make money. But this is another topic..
Regards, and sorry for my english.
I hope you have been useful my opinion!
Matías. G.
Big shout out to ciento, Jayguitarman, RSH, cthisbear, and the others!
One of the reasons I'm considering giving it away for free is that I remember the good old days, when many thousands of people downloaded earlier versions of my work. For instance, before I set up my own website and turned Studio into a product, Softpedia had downloads for 3.1 at over 3000, and that was a very small percentage of the total - most of the downloads were from Russoodle's server, where (she says) there was a huge amount of traffic from people downloading Studio. I don't know how many users I had, but it was a lot. Sometimes I regret all the BS that went down and wish it could just go back to the way things were before.
Unfortunately, I'm not even sure that giving v2 away for free would generate enough word of mouth to result in that many downloads. In my opinion, the Linux scene sucks now, mostly because all of the channels we used to rely on for information have either stagnated or been sold to corporate interests. Distrowatch's website looks like it's from the 90s, and the owner is a grumpy old man who honestly couldn't care less about 90% of the new distros out there, and hasn't since Ubuntu remixes became a thing ten years ago. He's just going through the motions. Slashdot lost some of their cool editors, and was bought by a job advertising company, Dice Holdings, along with SourceForge!
So I dunno. You guys have almost talked me into selling it, but there's a big part of me that just wants everybody to use it and enjoy Linux.
One of the reasons I'm considering giving it away for free is that I remember the good old days, when many thousands of people downloaded earlier versions of my work. For instance, before I set up my own website and turned Studio into a product, Softpedia had downloads for 3.1 at over 3000, and that was a very small percentage of the total - most of the downloads were from Russoodle's server, where (she says) there was a huge amount of traffic from people downloading Studio. I don't know how many users I had, but it was a lot. Sometimes I regret all the BS that went down and wish it could just go back to the way things were before.
Unfortunately, I'm not even sure that giving v2 away for free would generate enough word of mouth to result in that many downloads. In my opinion, the Linux scene sucks now, mostly because all of the channels we used to rely on for information have either stagnated or been sold to corporate interests. Distrowatch's website looks like it's from the 90s, and the owner is a grumpy old man who honestly couldn't care less about 90% of the new distros out there, and hasn't since Ubuntu remixes became a thing ten years ago. He's just going through the motions. Slashdot lost some of their cool editors, and was bought by a job advertising company, Dice Holdings, along with SourceForge!
So I dunno. You guys have almost talked me into selling it, but there's a big part of me that just wants everybody to use it and enjoy Linux.
Thanks for your input.matiasbatero wrote:-Kernel modification its very important, but all distro works thanks to Jack core. Jack is so fundamental and indispensable to work with audio on linux. Without jack, no audio. And Jack is free and opensource.
-All the "linux audio ecosystem" is free and opensource. A lot of software were made with this concept, and projects like yours. can allow to generate more software with better quality.
But if I created a brand that made money (say, by taking market share from these guys) couldn't I help financially support upstream projects which are currently struggling?
-
matiasbatero
- Posts: 60
- Joined: Fri 12 Oct 2012, 01:27
- Location: Mar del Plata, Argentina
Yes, of course. You can help with money! In that way, its fine. All is allowed in order to help. My response was oriented in terms of (Privative vs OpenSource) model. I thought that your decision was oriented to that, perspectives, vision etc like "build a product and make money with it" or "donate" or "freeware". By the way, was a general opinion. By my side, i don't know if your project gives you a good rentability and how many users you have. Hope so!l0wt3ch wrote:But if I created a brand that made money (say, by taking market share from these guys) couldn't I help financially support upstream projects which are currently struggling?
Your project will be OpenSource? or only Privative?
Regards.
I think a lot of small business success is based on finding needs and desires, and providing the related products and services. Musicians have shown they want very little involvement with the OS, but are willing to mud-wrestle with daw after daw after daw, in search of the muddy grail.
And pay $$$ repeatedly for the priviledge.
The latest Phoronics tests show great progress in linux video performance,
and bitwig is bringing some talented linux audio people out of the shadows.
Uefi has not proven to be much more than an annoyance, and M-soft
is preparing for the worst, 118,000 down, and the survivors quaking
in their cubicles.
0Sex seems committed to sloth-like speed, cutesy icons, and Bloomberg style hardware pricing, so there should be some niches to fill, made affordable by lessening the need for the latest hardware, and waiving the OS markup. Precision targeting of potential customers will be crucial,
find them where they are at ease, and have free time, and fire up a demo that draws them in, before they know what's hit them
And pay $$$ repeatedly for the priviledge.
The latest Phoronics tests show great progress in linux video performance,
and bitwig is bringing some talented linux audio people out of the shadows.
Uefi has not proven to be much more than an annoyance, and M-soft
is preparing for the worst, 118,000 down, and the survivors quaking
in their cubicles.
0Sex seems committed to sloth-like speed, cutesy icons, and Bloomberg style hardware pricing, so there should be some niches to fill, made affordable by lessening the need for the latest hardware, and waiving the OS markup. Precision targeting of potential customers will be crucial,
find them where they are at ease, and have free time, and fire up a demo that draws them in, before they know what's hit them
Would it be possible to code woof to be able to build an audio pup along the lines of studio?
If puppy was setup up as a foundation there could be a bounty system for people coding certain elements. That way you would get some financial reward and the code would be free available (also the whole pup eco system would benefit).
Or a site like the following could be used
https://freedomsponsors.org/
https://www.bountysource.com/
Of course one problem is communicating the advantage of open source to potential customers.
If puppy was setup up as a foundation there could be a bounty system for people coding certain elements. That way you would get some financial reward and the code would be free available (also the whole pup eco system would benefit).
Or a site like the following could be used
https://freedomsponsors.org/
https://www.bountysource.com/
Of course one problem is communicating the advantage of open source to potential customers.
The Nokia refugees will probably be rehired, with fewer hours,stemsee wrote:@ciento
I think you will find that the majority of the 18,000 to be laid off are from microsoft's new purchase, Nokia company!
and lower pay, to help the M get back into the phone sector. The damages now being prepared for by the horde of M-soft temp contractors, while not labelled layoffs, will be far greater, and will save the corporation a fortune, and all rehires will have to pass the obamacare sniff test. Companies just can't afford paying a massive federal bureaucracy on top of the already expensive insurance and medical layers. A company either cajoles obama for an unequal exemption, or restructures it's workforce to dodge compliance, or some combination of the two.
It's spelled C-a-m-p-a-ig-n C-o-n-n-t-r-i-b-u-t-i-o-n-s
The M has 100,000 low-tier, and temp employees, who will be
booted off the gravy train, and they are grabbing their fiscal ankles,
as we speak.
Sell it--
Sell the upgrade. Free old version with a splash screen explaining and offering a better one at your site.
And I know you weren't asking but--
Old version w/splash will increase your downloads and visibility. Put that, and your new version explanation, on front page.
I know that site theme. Very nice. But you will need a better SEO plugin, social media. Site hard to find. Add "Studio Linux" the keywords and your site description "studio on a usb stick" to the front page.
Free isn't the only thing that generates buzz- but you can create buzz around your product. Yes, it is a linux distro. But it's really a studio on a stick, and you can generate buzz on that alone.
OK I'll shut up now
EDIT: I once did a respin; it got noticed on Distrowatch, and a few thousand downloads.
Never made a dime. If you have, you already know something about what you're doing.
And I know you weren't asking but--
Old version w/splash will increase your downloads and visibility. Put that, and your new version explanation, on front page.
I know that site theme. Very nice. But you will need a better SEO plugin, social media. Site hard to find. Add "Studio Linux" the keywords and your site description "studio on a usb stick" to the front page.
Free isn't the only thing that generates buzz- but you can create buzz around your product. Yes, it is a linux distro. But it's really a studio on a stick, and you can generate buzz on that alone.
OK I'll shut up now
EDIT: I once did a respin; it got noticed on Distrowatch, and a few thousand downloads.
Never made a dime. If you have, you already know something about what you're doing.
OK! This has been up for 10 days, and it's time to close the poll. The results are (in order of appearance):
FOR: cthisbear 8-bit RSH puppyluvr ciento mcewanw stemsee Deacon
AGAINST: l0wt3ch starhawk matiasbatero darkcity
The yeas have it, 2 to 1.
So there will be another commercial release of Studio 13.37. Stay tuned to this channel for further details.
FOR: cthisbear 8-bit RSH puppyluvr ciento mcewanw stemsee Deacon
AGAINST: l0wt3ch starhawk matiasbatero darkcity
The yeas have it, 2 to 1.
So there will be another commercial release of Studio 13.37. Stay tuned to this channel for further details.
Implied Warranty
You will need a disclaimer releasing all contributors from implied warranty.
-
technosaurus
- Posts: 4853
- Joined: Mon 19 May 2008, 01:24
- Location: Blue Springs, MO
- Contact:
$9.99? if you want audiophiles to take it seriously -> $499.99 with a $99.99 sale price and a 50% discount for students.
If you have original code/whatever included with it, one model that I have seen to raise funds is to have a kickstarter style campaign to release code, artwork, multimedia to the public domain once $XXX is reached.
If you have original code/whatever included with it, one model that I have seen to raise funds is to have a kickstarter style campaign to release code, artwork, multimedia to the public domain once $XXX is reached.
Check out my [url=https://github.com/technosaurus]github repositories[/url]. I may eventually get around to updating my [url=http://bashismal.blogspot.com]blogspot[/url].
-
stemsee
Checkout github woof-ce kernel kit. Using fatdog style initrd and vmlinuz and kernel-modules.sfs (zdrv_*.sfs) Shinobar's initrd is better; is the easiest way to upgrade kernels!l0wt3ch wrote:My kernels are often updated, but I don't advertise it because there's no easy way to upgrade,
Also note some recent MBs do not boot off of usb-3.0 dongles in usb-2.0 sockets but are readable after boot... in case!
Thanks. Pricing is a good question. I'm going to change the price of the download version to something a bit higher, but less than half the price of the usb version. I actually really like your suggestion, and imagine you're right, but...technosaurus wrote:$9.99? if you want audiophiles to take it seriously -> $499.99 with a $99.99 sale price and a 50% discount for students.