Light-Debian-Core-Live-CD-Wheezy + Porteus-Wheezy

[mcewanw]

Thought: Logout by menu item then pops up a login Gui.? Instead of dropping to the console...

Yes, that would be much better. I am logged in as root at the moment, but I have a feeling a normal user is also at present able to drop down to a root console or to use Ctrl-Alt-F1 to do so, which is an error of course, since gives normal user full root access rights.

# Q: What options do we have for admin guis to setup the system and control users.?

That is something which traditionally was never well-catered for in Linux. Most typical Linux system admins preferred doing all system admin at the commandline, and to a large extent still do. Problem is, there is so much to set up and admin in a multiuser system that it is hard to cater for every possibility. Most systems nowadays do have a few admin wizards/control centres of one sort of another though - I remember Redhat pioneering a few such. Nevertheless most sys admins still do most of the work by scripting or the commandline, because it is the fastest and easiest in the end.

However, having said that, DebianDog is not only catering for ex-windows refugees in terms of intended user-friendliness, but also as a possible step up (being full multiuser) for Puppy users. In one sense it is good not to have a gui control-centre because not having one encourages users of DebianDog to learn more commandline and more about their system. But, realistically, a control-centre for the most common multiuser control tasks would be very nice. Better maybe not to put everything into one such tool though - have more than one with buttons to start up the others?

[saintless]

Hi, all.

Fred, Sergey.
It gets better and better I think it will be possible to make one iso DebianDog-486 with two boot choices.
1. Debian boot
2. Porteus boot
I'm not sure 100% if we can load initrd.xz and initrd.img with separate commands but I will test it in the next days.

Just to explain quickly /live/01-filesystem.squashfs symlink to /live/debian/base/01-filesystem.xzm works and boots Porteus-DebianDog I guess the opposite works also but not tested yet.

=====================================
Edit: OK it is solved. Renaming initrd.xz to initrd2.img works and boots Porteus-DebianDog.
I have small issue with h3v:

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root@debian:~# /opt/apps/h3v/hv3-linux-nightly-08_0203
couldn't find procedure Tkhtml_Init
    while executing
"load /opt/apps/h3v/hv3-linux-nightly-08_0203/lib/libTkhtml3.so"
    ("package ifneeded Tkhtml 3.0" script)
    invoked from within
"package require Tkhtml 3.0"
    (file "/opt/apps/h3v/hv3-linux-nightly-08_0203/hv3_main.tcl" line 19)
    invoked from within
"source [file join [file dirname [info script]] hv3_main.tcl] "
    (file "/opt/apps/h3v/hv3-linux-nightly-08_0203/main.tcl" line 6)
root@debian:~# 

Much to test and work on yet

=====================================


Now I have too much to test from Terry and William and to modify the way programs needed sudo for user work. I will make most of them to open terminal with prompt for puppy password. It will be better than a message with instructions to open terminal and type command.

Terry, William,
I will work on your changes and suggestions today and report back.

Dancytron,
Keeping root puppy way working system is main target for me also.

Toni

[saintless]

# Toni; I fixed ArcDrop, but we need to decide how to address the user access problem.
The Paths need "", not '' as William said, and the path like this: "/home/$USER/xxxx"

No, I think the path should be "${HOME}/xxx" as I have in the modded arcdrop I attached in my previous post, otherwise arcdrop won't work for user root, since the home directory of user root is simply /root. ${HOME} (or $HOME) simply means home directory of the user no matter who they are, which is what you want.

Thank you, William, Terry.

Terry, the moded arcdrop from William works fine for root and user. I will use the attached file from William.
Please, keep in mind my scripting/programming skils = 0
I need much help in this area.

Toni

[saintless]

And here is WallPapers that I fixed to work with users. TEST
Make a new file: /home/puppy/wallpapers.lst with different pics in it than the one in /root
This way users can login and have their own wallpaper set for each desktop. Nice.!

Very nice, Tery
But testing shows after creating separate wallpapers.lst in /home/puppy it works for puppy, but after reboot wallpapers does not work for root anymore. It uses /root/desktop.jpg only. I will test it more to see if it is something related with live-rw save file.

Toni

[saintless]

Hi, all.

Changes in user account regarding needed sudo programs.
1. All messages after click changed to open terminal action and prompt for password.
2. I think it is not enough to type user password for programs like:
Frisbee - changing network wired and wireless settings - asks for root password.
Create-live-rw-save-file - asks for root password (it is possible there is already save file in use and it saves changes for all accounts. It is not up to user to decide to create save file).
RemasterDog - script asks for root password..
Gparted - it asks for root password anyway by default for user accounts.

Toni

[saintless]

I think I found something.

I am 98% sure that in order to change the console font by use "dpkg-reconfigure console-setup", I had to install the missing dependency kbd (which I think is a dependency of console-setup which was already installed).

I am still using the same version I was using before, the second ISO made specifically for Porteus.

I'll try it in a clean version and come back and edit this post.

********
edit::

Okay, tested it on a clean version. What I said above is not quite right. You can adjust the console font, but very few of the fonts work out of the box.
When you go and install kbd, it wants to uninstall console-tools.

Once you do that, then "dpkg-reconfigure console-fonts" works with all (or at least more) of the font choices.

Hi, Dancytron.

This is from debian-packages-info:

`console-tools' was developed from version 0.94 of the standard `kbd' package, and integrates many fixes and enhancements, including new kbd features up to 0.99.
You will probably want to install a set of data files, such as the one in the `console-data' package.
For command-line compatibility with kbd, you may want to install the kbd-compat package.

Maybe installing console-data will do the same trick as uninstalling console-tools and installing kbd

Toni

[saintless]

Thought: Logout by menu item then pops up a login Gui.? Instead of dropping to the console...

Yes, that would be much better. I am logged in as root at the moment, but I have a feeling a normal user is also at present able to drop down to a root console or to use Ctrl-Alt-F1 to do so, which is an error of course, since gives normal user full root access rights.

I agree, William. Any ideas how to do it? Now it is enough to logout from puppy user and to type exit and you get in root account.

# Q: What options do we have for admin guis to setup the system and control users.?

Terry, I think we should not make the work of system administartor easier. Seems it is easy for the administrator to use command line for this and it is better not to give GUI in not experienced hands like mine and most puppy linux users. It could make only troubles. This is my opinion.
Here are the steps to create user account from command line:

Code: Select all

adduser toni
type user password and confirm.
usermod -a -G sudo toni  (adds toni to group sudo)
usermod -a -G audio toni (adds toni to group audio - needed for alsamixer and xhippo access).

We need to do some more things manual regarding wallpapers and low-ram-settings from the start menu but I will write about this later. Still not sure I do it the best way.

Toni

[mcewanw]

Yes, that would be much better. I am logged in as root at the moment, but I have a feeling a normal user is also at present able to drop down to a root console or to use Ctrl-Alt-F1 to do so, which is an error of course, since gives normal user full root access rights.

I agree, William. Any ideas how to do it? Now it is enough to logout from puppy user and to type exit and you get in root account.

I've never studied the Debian boot process, and don't know if you have modified that in DebianDog. Have you changed anything from how Debian Live boots up and ends starting X? It would be useful to know how your system boots up - you may well have described that somewhere, but I haven't been concentrating on that so any pointers would be useful.

I'll have a look at inittab and also the rc scripts that causes to run. Also, I'll check out that login as user squashfile you posted to see how things are being arranged, but there may be other parts of the process you are using I haven't picked up on. By the way, what is the default root password now? I think you changed that and I can't find the post.

EDIT: Okay, I know the root password now - you haven't changed it.

[saintless]

Hi, William, thanks
root password is marina
You can see it appear on boot with the password for puppy as well just befor X starts. It is added as information in /etc/motd to make it appear on boot.
By default debian-live-standard-cd boots to comand propmpt and you need to login with user and password
It has only username: user and password: live
After login as user with password live I create password for root:

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sudo passwd root

Then I logout and login as root:

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sudo login

type root and password.
Now the user account is deleted and created new user puppy with password puppy.
To make possible to boot to X as root the changes in 01-v3.squashfs are:
1. /etc/inittab - commented respawing lines 2,3,4,5,6 (to save 3 Mb RAM usage) and first respawing line changed as you see it with root instead of user name.
2. Added the last section with startx in /etc/profile

This is all changed from debian-live-standard regarding boot and login proccess.

I will also look for some solution about logout to login prompt.
Toni

[saintless]

William, I've changed a little bit more in resapwing section after checking. Here is the original debian-live-standard /etc/inittab:

Code: Select all

# /etc/inittab: init(8) configuration.
# $Id: inittab,v 1.91 2002/01/25 13:35:21 miquels Exp $

# The default runlevel.
id:2:initdefault:

# Boot-time system configuration/initialization script.
# This is run first except when booting in emergency (-b) mode.
si::sysinit:/etc/init.d/rcS

# What to do in single-user mode.
~~:S:wait:/sbin/sulogin

# /etc/init.d executes the S and K scripts upon change
# of runlevel.
#
# Runlevel 0 is halt.
# Runlevel 1 is single-user.
# Runlevels 2-5 are multi-user.
# Runlevel 6 is reboot.

l0:0:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 0
l1:1:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 1
l2:2:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 2
l3:3:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 3
l4:4:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 4
l5:5:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 5
l6:6:wait:/etc/init.d/rc 6
# Normally not reached, but fallthrough in case of emergency.
z6:6:respawn:/sbin/sulogin

# What to do when CTRL-ALT-DEL is pressed.
ca:12345:ctrlaltdel:/sbin/shutdown -t1 -a -r now

# Action on special keypress (ALT-UpArrow).
#kb::kbrequest:/bin/echo "Keyboard Request--edit /etc/inittab to let this work."

# What to do when the power fails/returns.
pf::powerwait:/etc/init.d/powerfail start
pn::powerfailnow:/etc/init.d/powerfail now
po::powerokwait:/etc/init.d/powerfail stop

# /sbin/getty invocations for the runlevels.
#
# The "id" field MUST be the same as the last
# characters of the device (after "tty").
#
# Format:
#  <id>:<runlevels>:<action>:<process>
#
# Note that on most Debian systems tty7 is used by the X Window System,
# so if you want to add more getty's go ahead but skip tty7 if you run X.
#
1:2345:respawn:/sbin/getty 38400 tty1
2:23:respawn:/sbin/getty 38400 tty2
3:23:respawn:/sbin/getty 38400 tty3
4:23:respawn:/sbin/getty 38400 tty4
5:23:respawn:/sbin/getty 38400 tty5
6:23:respawn:/sbin/getty 38400 tty6

# Example how to put a getty on a serial line (for a terminal)
#
#T0:23:respawn:/sbin/getty -L ttyS0 9600 vt100
#T1:23:respawn:/sbin/getty -L ttyS1 9600 vt100

# Example how to put a getty on a modem line.
#
#T3:23:respawn:/sbin/mgetty -x0 -s 57600 ttyS3

And original /etc/profile:

Code: Select all

# /etc/profile: system-wide .profile file for the Bourne shell (sh(1))
# and Bourne compatible shells (bash(1), ksh(1), ash(1), ...).

if [ "`id -u`" -eq 0 ]; then
  PATH="/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin"
else
  PATH="/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/local/games:/usr/games"
fi
export PATH

if [ "$PS1" ]; then
  if [ "$BASH" ] && [ "$BASH" != "/bin/sh" ]; then
    # The file bash.bashrc already sets the default PS1.
    # PS1='\h:\w\$ '
    if [ -f /etc/bash.bashrc ]; then
      . /etc/bash.bashrc
    fi
  else
    if [ "`id -u`" -eq 0 ]; then
      PS1='# '
    else
      PS1='$ '
    fi
  fi
fi

# The default umask is now handled by pam_umask.
# See pam_umask(8) and /etc/login.defs.

if [ -d /etc/profile.d ]; then
  for i in /etc/profile.d/*.sh; do
    if [ -r $i ]; then
      . $i
    fi
  done
  unset i
fi

[mcewanw]

I'm just heading off to bed, but it will indeed probably be something to do with the respawning line autologging in root. I note in the user puppy squashfs file you uploaded, you autologin puppy user - then when logging out it isn't a root console just a puppy one. I wonder when booting as root user and then logging out it could be arranged to somehow not respawn as root, but instead just be at login username stage?

[dancytron]

This is from debian-packages-info:

`console-tools' was developed from version 0.94 of the standard `kbd' package, and integrates many fixes and enhancements, including new kbd features up to 0.99.
You will probably want to install a set of data files, such as the one in the `console-data' package.
For command-line compatibility with kbd, you may want to install the kbd-compat package.

Maybe installing console-data will do the same trick as uninstalling console-tools and installing kbd

Toni

Okay, I'll try that sometime today and report back.

[fredx181]

Hi Toni, Hi Sergey

Fred, Sergey.
It gets better and better Smile I think it will be possible to make one iso DebianDog-486 with two boot choices.
1. Debian boot
2. Porteus boot
I'm not sure 100% if we can load initrd.xz and initrd.img with separate commands but I will test it in the next days.

That's just great!
Just checking, will this still include my additions then for porteus, savefile-create, obshutdown etc...?

I have good news too:
Because I wasn't satisfied at all with the disadvantages of combining debian kernel and porteus live system I've been working at modifying initrd.xz.
The modprobe lines in linuxrc by sfs are modprobing all kernel modules in lib/modules, these are over 700.
This is were the high memory usage comes from.(and the slow boot)
So I replaced it with modprobing only whats needed to access drives.
Now memory usage is only just a little higher compared with porteus kernel.
Also hdd is sda now.
Here is new initrd-3.2.0-4-486.xz:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByBgCD ... sp=sharing

Sergey, here is porteus-wheezy2-deb-kernel.iso for testing and see what it's like with the REAL debian kernel.
Compared to previous porteus-wheezy it has more applications.
Size is larger, also because of debian-kernel.
It has thunar right-click activate/deactivate module.
EDIT:
Can you send my thanks to sfs?
BTW, Multiuser support is not really implemented yet, I'll have to learn more about it first.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByBgCD ... sp=sharing

Good luck

Fred

[saintless]

Hi, Fred
Great news about the lower ram usage. I will test the new initrd and report back.

Just checking, will this still include my additions then for porteus, savefile-create, obshutdown etc...?

Yes, but with some changes. I will put them in small 02.sfs in /live/debian/base. Chroot link to busybox is included in 01-v4 (not ready for upload yet) and yad is also installed there.
I will report later or tomorrow with more results.
Toni

[saintless]

Sergey, here is porteus-wheezy2-deb-kernel.iso for testing and see what it's like with the REAL debian kernel.
Compared to previous porteus-wheezy it has more applications.
Size is larger, also because of debian-kernel.
It has thunar right-click activate/deactivate module.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByBgCD ... sp=sharing

Fred, do you want this one uploaded on the site or it is just testing for Sergey and others?

[sklimkin]

Hi All!

Fred: Sergey, here is porteus-wheezy2-deb-kernel.iso for testing and see what it's like with the REAL debian kernel.

Thanks Fred, it's very handy.

Who knows why such a difference in memory usage: top--vs--htop (192 MB--vs--48 MB, see screenshot):

Sergey.

[fredx181]

Hi Toni

Fred, do you want this one uploaded on the site or it is just testing for Sergey and others?

That depends if you add it or replace it, in last case better not, because I'm not sure yet if it's just as reliable as the previous one with the porteus-kernel.
btw, I have plenty of space on my google-drive, not gonna remove anything.

Fred

[saintless]

Hi, Fred
I have more than enough space. Added to Porteus-Wheezy folder:
http://smokey01.com/saintless/Porteus-Wheezy
and direct download link:
http://smokey01.com/saintless/Porteus-W ... kernel.iso

[fredx181]

Hi Sergey

Who knows why such a difference in memory usage: top--vs--htop (192 MB--vs--48 MB, see screenshot):

What htop shows is about the same as top:used 192252 minus buffer+cache

[sklimkin]

Hi Fred!

Already testing Porteus-Wheezy2-deb-kernel.iso
Sorry slightly renamed Your ISO-image for brevity.
Fred, you take requests from users?
I would like to see in its composition: grandr, mc ...
Now remember what else ...
But this is not a problem - I've added my module 02-sfs-tools.xzm
THANK YOU!
see screnshots:

Fred: What htop shows is about the same as top:used 192252 minus buffer+cache

Then I'll still be using 'top'

Sergey.