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 Forum index » House Training » Bugs ( Submit bugs )
Fan does not turn on - Precise 5.7.1 - HP Compaq nx6120
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gruer

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Tue 05 Nov 2013, 09:14    Post_subject:  Fan does not turn on - Precise 5.7.1 - HP Compaq nx6120
Sub_title: Computer heats because to fan will not turn on
 

Dear friends,

I've just installed the Precise Puppy 5.7.1 on my HP Compaq nx6120 laptop, but when the grub options are shown the fan stops.

I know that the fan is working (hardware) because it is turned on when the computer is started, but it turns off (and remains this way) as soon as the grub options are displayed.

I've already searched the internet foruns and tried a couple of alternatives without results, because these options where designed for Ubuntu or other distributions, but not specifically designed for Puppy.

Thanks in advance if you could help me!

Regards!
Alexandre.
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rjbrewer


Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 4422
Location: merriam, kansas

PostPosted: Tue 05 Nov 2013, 13:50    Post_subject:  

I have a Dell D810 with the same processor.
The fan only needs to run if the laptop is actually getting hot.

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Hogweed

Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Posts: 96

PostPosted: Tue 05 Nov 2013, 15:56    Post_subject:  

Agree with answer above

On the old laptop of similar vintage I'm using now the fan virtually never goes off under Windows. It's off most of the time under Linux. Try playing a few youtube videos full-screen at decent resolution and the fan will come on if needed.
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nubc


Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 1090
Location: USA

PostPosted: Wed 06 Nov 2013, 01:05    Post_subject:  

Pentium M class processor runs very quiet, often at very reduced speed. Some P4 Dell desktops have what is called a "leafblower mode" (fast, roaring fan) when first booting up, and then the OS begins to load and things quiet down dramatically. I dunno, maybe it's the BIOS or Windows kernel that kicks in.
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Hogweed

Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Posts: 96

PostPosted: Wed 06 Nov 2013, 08:47    Post_subject:  

The fan in a Compaq nx6120 is not supposed to run constantly. It should not normally be running after leaving the bios from a cold boot.

If the fan is running constantly in one of these laptops when cpu is idle then there is something wrong. Some bios/motherboards spin the fan up during startup but it is then normal for it it switch off immediately the O/S starts to boot.

If you search the HP website for nx6120 technical support it actually tells you that the fan running constantly indicates a fault condition.

The support page also suggests if you have fan running constantly issues to make sure your bios is updated to latest version. Apparently an early bios on that model did have fan control issues.
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Keef


Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 639
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Wed 06 Nov 2013, 09:09    Post_subject:  

I've got a nc6120 (not entirely sure what the difference is between a nx and an nc...) and the fan is generally off or very quiet. Sometimes it runs at full blast at the grub screen, but returns to normal once the OS is booting (what Hogweed said). I wouldn't worry.
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gruer

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu 07 Nov 2013, 11:57    Post_subject: Fan does not turn on - Precise 5.7.1 - HP Compaq nx6120  

Thank you guys for the replies. It is very nice to count on this community.

I'll monitor the points that you highlighted. A BIOS update will also be fine.
Only once the laptop reached 100º Celsius (212º F) and the fan still was not triggered, that's why I decided to post the issue here. But most of the times it does not exceed 60º Celsius (140º F).

Regards!
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nubc


Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 1090
Location: USA

PostPosted: Thu 07 Nov 2013, 12:05    Post_subject:  

Power management issue. Power management passes out of BIOS/kernel control and into userland, then fan cuts off. Solution: Transfer power management control to userland. I just vaguely remember having to append LILO's boot parameters for APM, after disabling both APM and ACPI in BIOS. There is competition (between BIOS and kernel) for power management control during boot, and as a consequence, control is abandoned (fan stops), unresolved and unclaimed, so you have to prevent the competition and reassert control later in the boot process, in the bootloader. Generally, I suggest you disable both APM and ACPI in BIOS (if possible), and append grub (menu.lst) for APM. If the fan is abnormally cutting off, staying off and not doing its job, there is the serious risk of overheating the processor. In my case, I was dealing with a full-sized desktop where fan behavior (shutting off and staying off after POST) was easily observed. I seem to recall the computer ran a Pentium II/III processor, and dated from a time when ACPI was just introduced to replace APM, meaning there were bugs to work out.

Power Management: APM vs ACPI
http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Battery-Powered/powermgm.html

Are both APM and ACPI available as options in BIOS? If so, did you try each option exclusively? What are your power management options?

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gruer

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu 07 Nov 2013, 13:02    Post_subject:  

Fine nubc, I'll check this information at night and will post here as soon as possible.
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Keef


Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 639
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Thu 07 Nov 2013, 15:19    Post_subject:  

On my nc6120, there doesn't seem to be any BIOS options for ACPI or APM.
There is though an option to have the fan on all the time when on AC. Changed mine to off, and found that the fan did not seem to come on at all, and CPU temp started to rise. Rebooted and changed it back. Fan mostly runs very quietly and CPU hovers around the 55c mark.
It is always on AC as very limited battery life.

EDIT - Tried the CPU scaling tool and got temp down to mid 40's.

Quote:
-BIOS-
Date : 11/21/2005
Vendor : Hewlett-Packard (www.hp.com)
Version : 68DTD Ver. F.0C
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rjbrewer


Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 4422
Location: merriam, kansas

PostPosted: Thu 07 Nov 2013, 21:01    Post_subject:  

A handy way to keep track of temperature:

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?search_id=1037122542&t=57480

_________________

Inspiron 700m, Pent.M 1.6Ghz, 1Gb ram.
Msi Wind U100, N270 1.6>2.0Ghz, 1.5Gb ram.
Eeepc 8g 701, 900Mhz, 1Gb ram.
Full installs

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gruer

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri 08 Nov 2013, 07:16    Post_subject:  

Hi guys, I've checked the energy options and my nx6120 it is exactly like Keef told about his nc6120. No way to configure it alternating between the discussed options, only one option exists regarding if the fan will be turned on when on AC.

I guess the tool suggested by rjbrewer will be very handy, but have no idea what to do to solve the issue permanently.
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ally


Joined: 19 May 2012
Posts: 856
Location: lincoln

PostPosted: Fri 08 Nov 2013, 07:43    Post_subject:  

I have a couple of lenovo's that are plugged into a docking station so permanently on ac, I found that removing the battery reduces temp by about 5 degs

battery not being used anyway so whip it out......

Smile
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Hogweed

Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Posts: 96

PostPosted: Fri 08 Nov 2013, 14:39    Post_subject: Re: Fan does not turn on - Precise 5.7.1 - HP Compaq nx6120  

gruer wrote:
Thank you guys for the replies. It is very nice to count on this community.

I'll monitor the points that you highlighted. A BIOS update will also be fine.
Only once the laptop reached 100º Celsius (212º F) and the fan still was not triggered, that's why I decided to post the issue here. But most of the times it does not exceed 60º Celsius (140º F).

Regards!


Believe it or not 100 C is still actually within the Pentium M 730s normal expected operating spec. 60 C isn't the slightest problem. The processor can run indefinitely at 100 C. It also autoclocks itself down to prevent getting any hotter than 100 C.

There's no need for the fan to be running at 60 C but I would expect it to be running at 100 C, However it shouldn't be harmful if it isn't and you never see a temp above 100.

If you configure a scaling tool to keep the temp to say 40 C you are running the chip well below its design rating, That chip was designed to run fast and hot. It's also designed to run without a fan at all if there is sufficient passive cooling. Should the processor somehow find itself hotter than 100 C it will assert "PROCHOT#" at which time the system should take action such as increasing cooling or shutting down in an orderly manner. At 125 C the processor will assert "THERMTRIP#" and shut itself down.

http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Pentium_M/Intel-Pentium%20M%20730%20RH80536GE0252M%20%28BX80536GE1600FJ%29.html

http://download.intel.com/support/processors/mobile/pm/sb/30526202.pdf

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gruer

Joined: 05 Nov 2013
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri 08 Nov 2013, 15:42    Post_subject:    

Once more I'd like to thank you all. After reading the article on APM x ACPI I tried some combinations changing the menu.lst file.

The fan is now running when turning APM=on and ACPI=off.

The problem: apparently the sensors interface is not working anymore Sad
Both the native Hardinfo and CPUtemp applications do not show the temperatures. I guess this behavior is related to turning off the ACPI.

But it seems to be better this way as now I can feel the heat being exausted. No pain no gain Smile

Have a great weekend!
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