The manufacturers used to be able to force most people to buy a new computer every two to four years. That's changed for me and I suspect most of us Puppy users.
So, I wonder, how old is your computer? How old would be too old?
My primary desktop dates from 2009 and is a Pentium Dual-Core e5200 (2g ram, two 500g disks).
My family has several other computers around the house, all are early dual-core dating from about 2005 or 2006 (AMD 64x2 3800, AMD 62x2 4200, each with 1G ram).
My laptop is a Pentium 4, maybe 10 years old (1G ram with 40G disk).
When do yours date from and what do you have?
How old a computer is too old ? What do you use ?
I have several systems, but probably the one that's most relevant here hails from 1999 and is about the limit for Puppy in terms of "just good enough to run something".
That would be a Dell Latitude CPi D300XT which has well earned its nickname as "The Infernal Dell".
Specs:
Pentium II 300MHz CPU (slower than a one-legged sloth on weed)
128MB RAM (would love to double that but EDO RAM is insanely expensive)
20GB HDD (upgraded from a 4gb CF card)
CD-RW/DVD-ROM "Combo" drive out of a ThinkPad (jerry-rigged into a Dell C-Series Bay Module)
Weird NeoMagic-brand graphics (really, Dell? really? Did you HAVE to go with something that hates VESA?)
Internal ISA soundcard (Crystal somethingorother)
The battery lasts at least five minutes. I've never scientifically tested it.
Ports include serial (COM) and parallel (LPT), one extraordinarily slow USB port (I think it might actually be a USB 1.0 port; if I'm wrong it's USB 1.1), a VGA connector, the usual three audio ports, and a PS/2 port for keyboard or mouse (if you have a splitter cable you can have both at once!). It also has a dock connector -- IIRC I got rid of the dock but I might still have it somehow. (I don't think it worked anymore anyways.)
The OS on there right now is pUPnGO 2012 FreeOffice Edition. It's actually pretty snappy -- which is no small feat. Even Puplite5, my usual go-to Puplet for really slow systems, runs intolerably sluggishly on this thing.
Why do I have the system, and why do I care about it or want to use it? I have this --probably stupid-crazy-- vision that, if I could demonstrate that a 15yr old computer was still viable technology with a little TLC and some small futzing, that people would listen, try it, be amazed -- and buy a lot fewer "new" computers. This would be incredibly awesome for the planet as a whole -- less pollution, less eWaste, less production waste, etc. (Probably electrical use would go up some -- these older systems do tend to be power hogs, particularly if there's a Pentium 4 in the mix -- but I think that the other benefits outweigh the costs of a few extra watts coming down the pipe.) If it caught on in a huge way, it would even possibly drive some of the nastier companies (M$, Best Buy, etc) out of business, which quite honestly I'd love to see happen.
Worth noting -- The Infernal Dell has a 65w rated power adapter; my netbook (on which I'm typing this, since my main system is down with an odd form of computer flu at the moment) has a 36w rated power adapter. As pointed out in the above paragraph, power usage will go up with this idea, so it's not all sunshine and roses. But it IS an idea.
That would be a Dell Latitude CPi D300XT which has well earned its nickname as "The Infernal Dell".
Specs:
Pentium II 300MHz CPU (slower than a one-legged sloth on weed)
128MB RAM (would love to double that but EDO RAM is insanely expensive)
20GB HDD (upgraded from a 4gb CF card)
CD-RW/DVD-ROM "Combo" drive out of a ThinkPad (jerry-rigged into a Dell C-Series Bay Module)
Weird NeoMagic-brand graphics (really, Dell? really? Did you HAVE to go with something that hates VESA?)
Internal ISA soundcard (Crystal somethingorother)
The battery lasts at least five minutes. I've never scientifically tested it.
Ports include serial (COM) and parallel (LPT), one extraordinarily slow USB port (I think it might actually be a USB 1.0 port; if I'm wrong it's USB 1.1), a VGA connector, the usual three audio ports, and a PS/2 port for keyboard or mouse (if you have a splitter cable you can have both at once!). It also has a dock connector -- IIRC I got rid of the dock but I might still have it somehow. (I don't think it worked anymore anyways.)
The OS on there right now is pUPnGO 2012 FreeOffice Edition. It's actually pretty snappy -- which is no small feat. Even Puplite5, my usual go-to Puplet for really slow systems, runs intolerably sluggishly on this thing.
Why do I have the system, and why do I care about it or want to use it? I have this --probably stupid-crazy-- vision that, if I could demonstrate that a 15yr old computer was still viable technology with a little TLC and some small futzing, that people would listen, try it, be amazed -- and buy a lot fewer "new" computers. This would be incredibly awesome for the planet as a whole -- less pollution, less eWaste, less production waste, etc. (Probably electrical use would go up some -- these older systems do tend to be power hogs, particularly if there's a Pentium 4 in the mix -- but I think that the other benefits outweigh the costs of a few extra watts coming down the pipe.) If it caught on in a huge way, it would even possibly drive some of the nastier companies (M$, Best Buy, etc) out of business, which quite honestly I'd love to see happen.
Worth noting -- The Infernal Dell has a 65w rated power adapter; my netbook (on which I'm typing this, since my main system is down with an odd form of computer flu at the moment) has a 36w rated power adapter. As pointed out in the above paragraph, power usage will go up with this idea, so it's not all sunshine and roses. But it IS an idea.
that's cool
Starhawk, I couldn't agree with you more about encouraging people to use the computer they have rather than always buying a new one. It's true that some older PCs use more electricity (tho not always), but if you add the costs of producing a new one plus disposing of the old one, I'd bet that in most cases keeping older equipment in service is cost efficient. Pretty cool that you're proving that with a P-II!
Cheers.
Cheers.
I think it is not only the manufacturers, but Microsoft as well that forces this upon us. With each new iteration of Windows, MS is great at saying how this one is faster, but, the minimum specs of the machine required are often much higher. Of course its faster if you do it on a faster machine.The manufacturers used to be able to force most people to buy a new computer every two to four years. That's changed for me and I suspect most of us Puppy users.
I started using Linux is 2007. I had to do an upgrade on my system one time due to capacitor plague killing the MOBO on that machine. Other than that unfortunate event, I have had no slow down, or need to upgrade my hardware.
As a linux user, rather than upgrade the hardware, it is like having a whole new system when you change / upgrade the OS. I'm sure this can go on for years and years, something a WinLUser can't do.
As a side note, at work I have WinXP on 3 machines. For ten years, only 1 has been connected to the internet. It was getting slower and slower and slower with every MS update. The other machines are actually quite fast. Very good, for ten year old Win Hardware. As soon as I turned off the MS Updates and did a good cleanup, the slower computer picked up the pace. I would bet all of my MS shares that "Security Updates" are designed to slow things down to make new hardware "needed". Of course this benefits the hardware manufacturers who sell new hardware, and MS who sells a copy of Windows with every machine sold.
Now, OT over, my oldest machine that I have run Puppy on is a Celeron 600 with 192MB of ram. Runs fine for most things. Pretty sluggish with youtube and other media intensive stuff, but fine for basic computing. Actually is run with a raid card with 2x 1TB hard drives in it as a fileserver.
For modern multimedia computing and web surfing, you do need fairly modern hardware. For emails, word processing and other basic things, that all works fine on hardware from the 90s!
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bark_bark_bark
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Tue 05 Jun 2012, 12:17
- Location: Wisconsin USA
The oldest system that I have that runs:
Some 98/99 HP Paviilion with an intel celeron, 64MB RAM, 10GB IDE Hard Disk with Windows 98 SE (HP OEM) and a CD-ROM drive.
The oldest I have that barely ever runs:
IBM Tinkpad with an Intel 80386SX (I think), 24MB RAM (i think), 280Mb hard disk, monochrome screen, and MS-DOS 6.21/Windows 3.1 (IBM OEM).
Some 98/99 HP Paviilion with an intel celeron, 64MB RAM, 10GB IDE Hard Disk with Windows 98 SE (HP OEM) and a CD-ROM drive.
The oldest I have that barely ever runs:
IBM Tinkpad with an Intel 80386SX (I think), 24MB RAM (i think), 280Mb hard disk, monochrome screen, and MS-DOS 6.21/Windows 3.1 (IBM OEM).
....
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Dewbie
The Puppy box is a Compaq Deskpro EN (PII/350/6.4G HDD/320MB RAM--March 1999).
The test box is an IBM Aptiva (AMD K6-2/300/6.4G HDD/256MB RAM--July 1998).
(RAM was added to both, and I haven't taken the Aptiva online yet.)
benali72 wrote:
The test box is an IBM Aptiva (AMD K6-2/300/6.4G HDD/256MB RAM--July 1998).
(RAM was added to both, and I haven't taken the Aptiva online yet.)
benali72 wrote:
Indeed...when they're not in use I unplug 'em.I'd bet that in most cases keeping older equipment in service is cost efficient.
Next stick I am going to use to prod/poke a Kapok/ Nan Tan circa 1992
Netbook, (starhawk knows what I am talking about) to see if it can be used somewhat.
P66hz, 12MB Edo ram, 50MB Hard drive (I will probably up it to a 2 gig if this works)
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=kolibri
The only thing that bothers/makes me go hmmmm, is Kolibri minimal requirements say 100hz
processor but ram passes at 8MB. Edit: Blank drive no format. Got 3 dotted lines of Starting Up, Then froze. Formatted drive and installed dos6.22. No change on freeze.
If that don't work (which it did not) . Maybe poking it with
http://www.menuetos.net/
will work better. Just whittling/learning in my spare time
http://tinypic.com/useralbum.php?ua=aTo ... 5mUQ%3D%3D
Edited with
Netbook, (starhawk knows what I am talking about) to see if it can be used somewhat.
P66hz, 12MB Edo ram, 50MB Hard drive (I will probably up it to a 2 gig if this works)
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=kolibri
The only thing that bothers/makes me go hmmmm, is Kolibri minimal requirements say 100hz
processor but ram passes at 8MB. Edit: Blank drive no format. Got 3 dotted lines of Starting Up, Then froze. Formatted drive and installed dos6.22. No change on freeze.
If that don't work (which it did not) . Maybe poking it with
http://www.menuetos.net/
will work better. Just whittling/learning in my spare time
http://tinypic.com/useralbum.php?ua=aTo ... 5mUQ%3D%3D
Edited with
Code: Select all
$ inxi -b
System: Host: Biker Kernel: 3.7.10-antix.2-486-smp i686 (32 bit)
Desktop: IceWM 1.3.7 Distro: antiX-M11- Jayaben Desai 01 May 2011
Machine: Mobo: IBM model: 2628TWU Bios: IBM version: KXET33WW (1.06 ) date: 09/05/2001
CPU: Single core Pentium III (Coppermine) (-UP-) clocked at 1000.00 MHz
Graphics: Card: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI Rage Mobility P/M AGP 2x
X.Org: 1.12.4 drivers: ati,mach64 (unloaded: fbdev,vesa) Resolution: 1024x768@87.0hz
GLX Renderer: Gallium 0.4 on softpipe GLX Version: 2.1 Mesa 8.0.5
Network: Card-1: 3Com 3c556B CardBus [Tornado] driver: 3c59x
Card-2: Ralink RT2561/RT61 802.11g PCI driver: rt61pci
Drives: HDD Total Size: 20.0GB (27.4% used)
Info: Processes: 98 Uptime: 14 min Memory: 272.1/500.7MB Client: Shell (bash) inxi: 1.9.6
A working computer is not too old!
My current Linuxbox is made from scratch, with a Compaq Evo D300 mainboard from 2001 with built-in net connection, P4 1.8GHz processor, Matrox MGA G550 MPA graphic card, built-in USB1 plus a USB2 card, Ensoniq ES1371 audio card, an extra 3Com 3C905B network card, Sony stone-age 8x/4x/32x CD R/W (slow, but silent), Dell DVD ROM (fast but noisy), 756 Mb SDRAM, 30Gb Seagate harddisk full of Debian and a 1Gb swap partition, Key Tronic 105 key norwegian keyboard and Logitech M-C48 mouse with scroll wheel. I use the quietest power supply I found, and also a VERY quiet CPU fan, no internal beeper/speaker.
I currently run LupuPlus_5.2.8 from a live CD. I have never run puppy any other way than live CD/DVD!
I have 17-18 old PCs, mostly PII and PIII machines, plus lots of complete mainboards, and 6-7 old Macs. They all work! I have never used Windows, only Mac and Linux (but I have one Winbox).
I cannot remember which computer is my oldest, but it is one of these Macs:
Macintosh SE/30 from 1989/90 with 16 MHz Motorola 68030 processor, 8 MB Ram, 40Mb harddisk, 9" built-in B/W screen, and with original carrying bag - yes, it was 'portable'! A SE/30 with 4 MB RAM and a 80 MB hdd cost a whopping US$6,369 in 1989, sell for $150-450 today.
Macintosh IIsi from 1990, my workhorse for many years, with 20 MHz Motorola 68030CPU, a giant 240 Mb HD with 90 Mb still unused (!), 17 Mb RAM, 12" 8-bit color display. Price between $3,770 and $4,570 in 1990.
Both the SE/30 and IIsi could also use my lovely 8-bit greyscale Portrait display, a sensation when it came in 1989, for the first time you could view a whole page in real size, 680x870 pixels. Price US$1,050 in 1989.
WYSIWYG - WhatYouSeeIsWhatYouGet.
What still impresses me: the surprisingly complete office suite Claris Works, only 690Kb installed! Perfect puppy size!
tallboy
My current Linuxbox is made from scratch, with a Compaq Evo D300 mainboard from 2001 with built-in net connection, P4 1.8GHz processor, Matrox MGA G550 MPA graphic card, built-in USB1 plus a USB2 card, Ensoniq ES1371 audio card, an extra 3Com 3C905B network card, Sony stone-age 8x/4x/32x CD R/W (slow, but silent), Dell DVD ROM (fast but noisy), 756 Mb SDRAM, 30Gb Seagate harddisk full of Debian and a 1Gb swap partition, Key Tronic 105 key norwegian keyboard and Logitech M-C48 mouse with scroll wheel. I use the quietest power supply I found, and also a VERY quiet CPU fan, no internal beeper/speaker.
I currently run LupuPlus_5.2.8 from a live CD. I have never run puppy any other way than live CD/DVD!
I have 17-18 old PCs, mostly PII and PIII machines, plus lots of complete mainboards, and 6-7 old Macs. They all work! I have never used Windows, only Mac and Linux (but I have one Winbox).
I cannot remember which computer is my oldest, but it is one of these Macs:
Macintosh SE/30 from 1989/90 with 16 MHz Motorola 68030 processor, 8 MB Ram, 40Mb harddisk, 9" built-in B/W screen, and with original carrying bag - yes, it was 'portable'! A SE/30 with 4 MB RAM and a 80 MB hdd cost a whopping US$6,369 in 1989, sell for $150-450 today.
Macintosh IIsi from 1990, my workhorse for many years, with 20 MHz Motorola 68030CPU, a giant 240 Mb HD with 90 Mb still unused (!), 17 Mb RAM, 12" 8-bit color display. Price between $3,770 and $4,570 in 1990.
Both the SE/30 and IIsi could also use my lovely 8-bit greyscale Portrait display, a sensation when it came in 1989, for the first time you could view a whole page in real size, 680x870 pixels. Price US$1,050 in 1989.
WYSIWYG - WhatYouSeeIsWhatYouGet.
What still impresses me: the surprisingly complete office suite Claris Works, only 690Kb installed! Perfect puppy size!
tallboy
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True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.
