PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement <CLOSED>

[Q5sys]

Hi all,

I am trying to make sense of this thread, trying to understand the dynamics of the situation.... I am not interested (at this point) in taking sides or casting blame here.

That said, an accusation has been made that gcmartin is editing his post(s) in this thread apparently to alter the content and tone of what he said --in response to feedback from others. Given what others have said about the confusion as to who created the PhatSlacko 5.5 re-mix, this seems to be a valid concern. However, if that is the case, then it seems to me that earlier posts by gcmartin should be stamped as having been edited x number of times...

Is it possible to edit one's posts surreptitiously after others have posted in the thread? What is going on here?

Respectfully,
Monsie

Yes it is possible to edit your post without that little "edit" line showing up.
That feature of the forum seems to get turned on and off. I'm not sure why. It seems to only get turned on after there has been an issue of threads getting edited after.
I dont know why its not on all the time. I can only guess there is some resource reason.
Example below.
See the difference between these to:
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-edit.png
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-original.png

Here is another example from this thread previously. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 124#694124
You'll see that I commented about my edit to the post... but the 'edit line' did not show up, even though there was another post after.
It seems however that it was just turned on since my post prior to your post now shows an edit line.



EDIT: added example.

EDIT2: addded 2nd example

EDIT3: Testing to see if the edit-line option is on.

[James C]

Hi all,

I am trying to make sense of this thread, trying to understand the dynamics of the situation.... I am not interested (at this point) in taking sides or casting blame here.

That said, an accusation has been made that gcmartin is editing his post(s) in this thread apparently to alter the content and tone of what he said --in response to feedback from others. Given what others have said about the confusion as to who created the PhatSlacko 5.5 re-mix, this seems to be a valid concern. However, if that is the case, then it seems to me that earlier posts by gcmartin should be stamped as having been edited x number of times...

Is it possible to edit one's posts surreptitiously after others have posted in the thread? What is going on here?

Respectfully,
Monsie

Yes it is possible to edit your post without that little "edit" line showing up.
That feature of the forum seems to get turned on and off. I'm not sure why. It seems to only get turned on after there has been an issue of threads getting edited after.
I dont know why its not on all the time. I can only guess there is some resource reason.
Example below.
See the difference between these to:
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-edit.png
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-original.png

Here is another example from this thread previously. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 124#694124
You'll see that I commented about my edit to the post... but the 'edit line' did not show up, even though there was another post after.
It seems however that it was just turned on since my post prior to your post now shows an edit line.



EDIT: added example.

EDIT2: addded 2nd example

You edited twice yet yet your post doesn't have the edit line? Curious.

[Q5sys]

You edited twice yet yet your post doesn't have the edit line? Curious.

I know with PHPBB3 forum the edit line only shows up IF someone else posts after you. But its not on by default board wide. Its an option in the Admin Control Panel which can be turned on and off.
I'm unsure of its exact implementation in PHPBB2 forums.
It may need to be turned on for specific threads. I have no idea. All I know is that in the last thread where this became an issue (the PAE thread)... it wasnt on until I made a comment to the mods about posts getting edited... then it suddenly was on for that thread.

It is my belief that it should be turned on board wide as default setting... to prevent this very problem.

[James C]

If I'm following along correctly with this thread I'm either too stupid to have read the first post correctly and just missed any mention of 01micko and a link to Phat Slacko...which led to my posting the link to the original Phat Slacko thread or I'm dishonest about the fact that the first post has been edited.I just would like some clarification as to what I'm apparently being accused of.

[Q5sys]

If I'm following along correctly with this thread I'm either too stupid to have read the first post correctly and just missed any mention of 01micko and a link to Phat Slacko...which led to my posting the link to the original Phat Slacko thread or I'm dishonest about the fact that the first post has been edited.I just would like some clarification as to what I'm apparently being accused of.

I believe the accusation is that gcmartin is saying that he did credit 01Micko in his original post and had a link, and that you, myself and Jamesbond are all lying when he say that he edited his original post to add that.

I think that's what he's saying since he is stating outright that he never edited his first post other than to 'clarify' what was already there.

But I'm certain the accusation will change again... like everything else in this thread apparently.

[James C]

But, you have done something in the Slacko community. I can draw attention to, both, this and another dismal effort to derail 01Micko’s contribution in PAE distro offerings by using a beta copy of his and proclaiming no value, when this very community has shown over and over that there is value in both perceived and actual system performance and behavior. That very effort by you appeared to be aimed at diminishing the value of his work there, too.

I did not attempt to derail any PAE offering. So you're lying there. I made a thread and posted a multitude of tests regarding PAE vs NON-PAE kernels and performance impact. Stating factual tests does not mean Im derailing anything. I have no problem with PAE, it has its place, I do not however feel that PAE should be the default version. 01Micko apparently agrees, since the primary download of versions of Slacko are NON-PAE. The PAE version is an option choice for people. Furthermore I didnt use a beta copy of any of his work. So you're lying there too. I tested offical releases, and posted them for everyone to see. And 01Micko commented in that thread. If he felt I was attacking his work he would have been in his right to state so. He did not, in fact he made the comment that he was going to reference my work so users could decide for themselves. See This thread and this post.

I'm fairly comfortable in saying that 01micko is not really bother by any criticism of PAE..... since I'm probably the most anti-PAE member of this forum.Remember my favorite quote from Linus Torvalds.......

PAE really really sucks.

http://www.realworldtech.com/forum/?thr ... stid=76973

People can disagree without things turning personal.

[James C]

You edited twice yet yet your post doesn't have the edit line? Curious.

I know with PHPBB3 forum the edit line only shows up IF someone else posts after you. But its not on by default board wide. Its an option in the Admin Control Panel which can be turned on and off.
I'm unsure of its exact implementation in PHPBB2 forums.
It may need to be turned on for specific threads. I have no idea. All I know is that in the last thread where this became an issue (the PAE thread)... it wasnt on until I made a comment to the mods about posts getting edited... then it suddenly was on for that thread.

It is my belief that it should be turned on board wide as default setting... to prevent this very problem.

This forum appears to suffer from quite a few glitches......things may be turned on but only work occasionally.

[Q5sys]

People can disagree without things turning personal.

Apparently to some people, if you disagree with some application of technology you're not only attacking their work, but you are attacking them personally.

This is why I prefer the academic mindset of peer review. It's not personal, its about the subject.

[gcmartin]

Let's get things straight because Q5sys continiuues to attempt his own twist.

My Opening POST TODAY mentions Q5sys, directly. Its about what I percieve to be a discredit to the work of 01Micko.

i call no one stupid or liar. I have had this post around for awhile. Q5sys continues to try to back away or disguise what I found offensive. And he also doesn't seem to understand the title, or the theme as he continues to make attempts to discount the contribution by arguing about what information is available for public review.

This is his problem. This is what I refer

I haven't lied or dismissed anyone else here. On opening day this thread was opened and made clearer. He objects in such a way as to dimiinish 01Micko work. I find his objections to be his method of diminishing that work. This thread is about that contribution. It was titled and themed around that contribution.

His effort is not about timing or posting. Its about diminishing!!!

Maybe no one else is going to point this out to him. But, I do!

I stand by my claim!!!

[Q5sys]

Gcmartin,
You can continue to make claims over and over, but the facts presented in this thread can be clearly viewed by everyone.
I've made a statement that I'm willing to apologize to 01Micko if he feels I have insulted him or his work. So far YOU are the only person saying that I'm taking away from 01Micko's work. I hope 01Micko will make a statement as to his opinions on this issue, but thats a choice that he has to make.

1) I have made no negative comments about 01Micko or his work.
2) You continue to insist that I have.
3) I have asked you to show me where I have.
4) You refuse to show me where I have insulted 01micko or his work.
5) You continue to claim I am insulting 01Micko and his work while providing no proof.

Instead of showing me where I've insulted 01Micko... you decided slander me with false claims... which you refuse to provide proof for.


Just like in the PAE thread, you make claims over and over and you refuse to back up them with proof.

However, there are multiple people in this thread who have commented about your actions regarding editing posts and changing what you've posted. By insisting that you have not added this information, you are calling Myself, JamesC, and Jamesbond liars.

Lastly you still have not given a reason why you created a thread for another developers work when a thread already existed to promote that release.

[gcmartin]

Glad to see you extend an Olive Branch.(assuming you know what that means and you dont take offense to that, even) with an "inferred" apology. I hope it is also genuine on your part.

So to you, I extend an OLIVE BRANCH.

I hope there are some lessons learned. I know that I have to be especially diligent in insuring that good meaning is STRONGLY passed on when praising anyone's contribution in this forum. That extends to everyone.

I look forward to seeing you in the future. As always I will try to help when I can. Should we do so, let's agree to work on both Title or Theme of the OP, and derail things as has happened here. I accept my portion of that derailment, but it started before I revisited the thread.

This is the last post to this thread as I am going to EDIT IT AS CLOSED, so you can see. Please dont be offended since "That is still an OP's right to post such".

With your apology to 01Micko, I hope we part agreeing that at the very least, he has produced a very good effort for our community benefit.

Peace be with you.

[Q5sys]

Glad to see you extend an Olive Branch.(assuming you know what that means and you dont take offense to that, even) with an "inferred" apology. I hope it is also genuine on your part.

So to you, I extend an OLIVE BRANCH.

I hope there are some lessons learned. I know that I have to be especially diligent in insuring that good meaning is STRONGLY passed on when praising anyone's contribution in this forum. That extends to everyone.

I look forward to seeing you in the future. As always I will try to help when I can. Should we do so, let's agree to work on both Title or Theme of the OP, and derail things as has happened here. I accept my portion of that derailment, but it started before I revisited the thread.

This is the last post to this thread as I am going to EDIT IT AS CLOSED, so you can see. Please dont be offended since "That is still an OP's right to post such".

With your apology to 01Micko, I hope we part agreeing that at the very least, he has produced a very good effort for our community benefit.

Peace be with you.

I have not 'inferred' an apology at all.
And currently I have not apologized to 01Micko, because I do not feel I have insulted him or his work in any way. IF 01Micko comes on this thread and say that I have offended him or his work, I will apologize to him. But until he tells me that I have offended/insulted him... I am not apologizing for something I have not done!

Furthermore I still desire you to apologize to those which you have called liars. I'm not asking you to apologize to me, because I realize you have a personal issue with me and will offer no such apology.... You've made your feelings towards me very clear in your PMs to me in the past.

[01micko]

Never mind!

Seems I'm late to the party.. too late to buy popcorn?

Seriously, I don't feel attacked or offended. I believe GC has the best of intentions, though sometimes it is not 100% clear. I do believe he is the BIGGEST fan of PHATSlacko and may have been a bit over enthused.

Been a lot of drama lately .. I look at it as a bit of "fun", no offence to anyone intended.

Cheers

Appendix: I try to stay neutral in PAE discussions. I try to provide both. A sister distro to PHAT is coming soon, with very similar features under the hood (non-PAE) but in a small iso. Stay tuned.

[gcmartin]

Somehow Q5sys, you really dont get it or don't want to acknowledge you get.

Shame.

[James C]

Moving on along now.......

[Q5sys]

Seriously, I don't feel attacked or offended.

Thank you for being clear on that. I look forward to your next release. Hopefully the conversation will remain in the thread you create.

[Q5sys]

Somehow Q5sys, you really dont get it or don't want to acknowledge you get.

Shame.

Well you made the claim that I was attacking 01Micko and talking down about his work. He made the statement that he does not feel attacked or offended by anything I said.

Looks like you were wrong about my statements attacking him and his work.

Clearly I am not the one that 'doesnt get it'.

[ggg]

So, this thread is closed?

[starhawk]

gc, I had not until now seen your post with my name in shouty red type. I am neither amused nor impressed. However, I do think you are WAY out of line. I also think you have your head in the clouds -- in fact, I've thought that for some time.

You know quite well that there is debate as to how useful PAE is. I know you're aware of it, because I've seen the thread and you have posts in it. I am on one side of the PAE debate, because I am affected by it. As it seems, you are on the other. I've kept quiet about it, mostly because --unlike you-- I do not take much pleasure in 'rocking the boat'.

Also, you know (because I've made plenty of indications about this on the forum) that I cannot afford most of the technology that you talk about, and moreso that I have little interest in it. I have technology that works fine for me, as long as things such as PAE don't throw a wrench in it.

I remember quite clearly, once, asking you to take a look at a Puplet I was working on (now abandoned, for very good reasons) and you refused on grounds that it had no webserver capability. While my social life is not as active as some, or even most, people -- I know my share of folks, and not one of them would have a use for a webserver. In fact, I can think of only one person I know who would even recognize what that term even means!

You will note that I have not since repeated my mistake of asking you to look at my work. There's a reason for that, namely that there's no point.

Further, you know --since you are the one doing it-- that very often a new thread appears in this forum, proposing that Puppy take up some new direction regarding some futuristic technology. I can't say how successful that tech is -- but what I can say is, frequently your thread is the only mention I've heard of it, ever, and the only mention I do hear of it afterwards, ever.

You might also note that I have only occasionally attempted to point out to you the facts in the preceding paragraph. I stopped because you were too bullheaded at the time to listen to what I said -- and I didn't want to start a conflict. As I pointed out, above, I don't like to 'rock boats'.

Now, if you have as much experience and knowledge as you claim, I would --as politely as I can-- request that you use it to help us Puppians with our present concepts and goals. If you really must bring up those newfangled fads, then perhaps you should use your claimed abilities to produce a Puplet that has the features and compatibilities you request.

Remember what Puppy is and is not. Puppy is not one person. Puppy is a group of people who contribute what they can for the common good of the community. If all you have is ideas about some flashy new technology that might be really cool, that's fine -- but please be honest about it, and don't be mad at us for pointing it out. If you really are, as you claim, "here to help" then for Pete's sake HELP! I'm sure that there are many regular posters who would be glad to borrow your brilliance if you offer.

I'm actually one of those people -- I would LOVE a few little things that are missing in one Puppy build I'm working on, and if you are --as you have claimed-- quite intelligent, knowledgeable, and experienced, and NOT just someone holding up a sign that says "hey look at this guys it's cool" -- then PLEASE let me know and I'll tell you what I'm looking for. Fair warning: it's on dusty old tech.

On the other hand, if you are not that sort of person after all -- that's OK. Really. Just be honest about it. You don't have to leave, you don't have to be all huffy -- but you should be honest. Honesty's important, for a reason! (Also please do not PM me again trying to paint someone else as a problem when that is not the case. If you do, I'll be glad to forward it to Flash.)

Lastly, something I will say exactly once. (I hope you're listening.) If you do not at all like what I'm saying, that's fine -- just don't read it. Do what I do when I see your threads about these technological fads you are proclaiming as the next thing to take over the planet. Smile wanly (maybe even smirk a bit), shake your head gently, and move on to the next thing of interest. You're not a mod, so you're not obligated to read everything in the forum -- so, if you don't want to, don't. It's that simple. If you don't want to respond to this post, you don't even have to do that. (That said, if the compulsion to reply is simply too strong to resist -- please make sure that you've read and understood my post sufficiently before doing so. Asking questions helps.)

[Q5sys]

So, this thread is closed?

No its not. Gcmartin is not a mod so he cant close a thread. He simply marked it as closed hoping people would ignore it.
You can be sure that he's probably already sent a PM to Flash (a mod) requesting it to be closed and/or deleted completely.

So I'm sure that in short time it'll disappear into the vault of nothingness so that no one can see gcmartins behavior. Once he feels he has lost control over a thread he wants it deleted, so that no one else can see what has been said. He's even stated in this thread that as the OP he feels he has control over it. very anti-communnity mindset if you ask me.

Starhawk,
Well spoken. If you ever need someone to bounce ideas off of for a project, feel free to send me a PM. Although it'd probably be better if you made a public post on the forum so that everyone could see it. You'd probably get more responses that way. There are plenty here who will gladly pitch in and offer our skill and knowledge to help another out.