Fatdog64-611 Final (Updated 12-14-2012)

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jamesbond
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#226 Post by jamesbond »

Anniekin wrote:
kirk wrote:This is also included in the devx sfs.
so if we have devx, we dont need slacko 32 sfs?
kirk was referring to the "readelf" utility. devx doesn't have 32-bit libs, you still need 32-bit sfs for that.
Barbol wrote:
jamesbond wrote:It is a trade-off between security and usability.
I was wondering about that.. how does allowing read-only access for all other users impacts security in fatdog? have any effect on the spot user?
The whole point of running network programs as "spot" is so that if these programs are broken and get controlled by someone else, they can only see what "spot" can see - which isn't hopefully not much (mostly the Downloads folder and at most the boot partition). If you allow "all other users" to read off your other partitions, there isn't much security in that anymore - a malware running as "spot" can now uploads anything in your other partition too :?
On another note, I'm really surprised if you tell me that Ubuntu will fail to boot because of this :shock: (I haven't used Ubuntu for years now).
Somehow it affects the greeter, so the X session cannot be started. I was only able to login as root in the console (but the root account is disable by default in ubuntu).
I am speechless :?
mini-jaguar wrote:But I just "downgraded" to 6.0.1 and now it works like a charm, boots up and shuts down lightning fast.
610 and 611 has the same kernel so yeah going back to 610 is unlikely to help. 601 on the other hand has a different kernel.
You can also try the Fatdog UEFI iso I posted in another thread - it has another 3.4.24 kernel, and see if it can shutdown properly.
610/611 shutdown is slower, because I added "spindown disk" and wait 2-seconds after that before it really shuts down. I reckon it is worth the wait to ensure that any disks (=of the spinning platter type) will save their internal caches to the disk and shutdown gracefully before power is removed. Before that, every time I shutdown with USB disks connected, I heard a very alarming noise and I always worried whether it didn't get the chance to save its internal cache.
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smokey01
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#227 Post by smokey01 »

prozgui is a pretty nice download accelerator.

I wish I could work out how to make it use multiple servers to get the same file.

2byte
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#228 Post by 2byte »

EDIT: Wow, this bug is fixed within hours!

Over the weekend I installed Fatdog on a usb stick to have as an emergency repair system for our new office computers which run Ubuntu 12.04. This morning, simply booting Fatdog and looking at the HD contents ruined two fresh, fully configured installations before I realized the problem was Fatdog itself. I wish I had seen the previous posts about this before hand, it would have saved a lot of grief.

This is not good, it’s bad, very bad. A live system should never alter the HD contents except through user action.
Last edited by 2byte on Tue 08 Jan 2013, 06:07, edited 1 time in total.


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rcrsn51
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#229 Post by rcrsn51 »

2byte wrote:This morning, simply booting Fatdog and looking at the HD contents ruined two fresh, fully configured installations. ...A live system should never alter the HD contents except through user action.
To help fix this problem, you need to specify exactly what "looking" meant.

Did you just browse the Ubuntu filesystem?

Did you open any files? With what program did you open them?

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Terryphi
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#230 Post by Terryphi »

2byte wrote:Over the weekend I installed Fatdog on a usb stick to have as an emergency repair system for our new office computers which run Ubuntu 12.04. This morning, simply booting Fatdog and looking at the HD contents ruined two fresh, fully configured installations before I realized the problem was Fatdog itself. I wish I had seen the previous posts about this before hand, it would have saved a lot of grief.

This is not good, it’s bad, very bad. A live system should never alter the HD contents except through user action.
It may have been a coincidence but I also found Linux Mint was unbootable after perusing files in it using Fatdog and copying one file from Mint to Fatdog. All repair methods failed and I had to reformat the partition and do a new installation of Linux Mint. My Fatdog installation was conventional frugal, not on a usb stick.
[b]Classic Opera 12.16 browser SFS package[/b] for Precise, Slacko, Racy, Wary, Lucid, etc available[url=http://terryphillips.org.uk/operasfs.htm]here[/url] :)

2byte
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#231 Post by 2byte »

@rcrsn51

Looking = Mounted the partitions & looked at the partition contents with Rox. That's all. Didn't open a single file. On the other machine I ran gparted and looked at the disk layout. Did not make any changes.

Basically all I was doing was making sure Fatdog would boot to a desktop on these brand new machines.

EDIT: I am building 3 more of these Ubuntu systems & I have the basic disk backed up with clonezilla ( a life saver BTW ) so if any changes are made to Fatdog in the next week or so to address this I would be happy to test it.


jamesbond
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#232 Post by jamesbond »

2byte wrote:This is not good, it’s bad, very bad. A live system should never alter the HD contents except through user action.
Agreed.
It may have been a coincidence but I also found Linux Mint
Bug confirmed. It is not a co-incidence. My UbuntuStudio 8.04 and 64Studio installation both refused to start graphical login after Fatdog touched their partition. They did boot into console, however "gdm" (the graphical login manager) refused to start.

For those affected, the quick fix is to mount the partition (e.g /dev/sda2 on /mnt/sda2) and then issue "chmod 755 /mnt/sda2" and then unmount, and don't mount again until you apply the following pet.

EDIT: The previous fix isn't working. This one will.
The attached pet should fix this: permission will not be changed when running as root (this is the default when running live). If one runs as non-root, however, permission will still be changed (out of necessity to grant access to them) - I will assume that one who runs as non-root knows what one is doing.

Second post updated.
Attachments
fatdog-mount-helper-fix.pet
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2byte
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#233 Post by 2byte »

@jamesbond

The bugfix pet works here at home. Will test it further on the new machines at work but I don't expect any problems.

I appreciate the instant fix. A person couldn't ask for anything better.


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Terryphi
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#234 Post by Terryphi »

Are the isos going to be updated? Fatdog64 should not be allowed out in its current state.
[b]Classic Opera 12.16 browser SFS package[/b] for Precise, Slacko, Racy, Wary, Lucid, etc available[url=http://terryphillips.org.uk/operasfs.htm]here[/url] :)

mini-jaguar
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#235 Post by mini-jaguar »

jamesbond wrote:.
You can also try the Fatdog UEFI iso I posted in another thread - it has another 3.4.24 kernel, and see if it can shutdown properly.
Well, it shuts down properly much more often than 610 or 611, not all the time, and sometimes even shuts down properly after making the save file (which 610 or 611 never seem to do). So improper shutdowns happen maybe only 40% of them time.

It also does not allow me to open the menu.lst file, which is on an NTFS+ partition, and never, ever, loads up the save file if I put the save file in a folder.

So it's even less usable than 610 and 611.

gcmartin

#236 Post by gcmartin »

Edited for clarity: This post refers to issue seen n filesystem rights.
Hi @Jamesbond. Thanks for looking into what we share on the permissions bug.

The root & non-root decision process may not necessarily be a good one. I do understand what your efforts intend, But that circumvention would allow someone who, coming from 32bit Puppy/Windows/Apple/Linux distro, to miss this understanding.

Maybe there is another way.

And, in the meantime, should the older method be put back into play, as consideration. Up until now, this issue did not exist. Now, it does, and potentially, non-aware and unsuspecting users can accidentally lose out. Further, even those who may have used FATDOG610+ for months could accidentally bomb the system unexpectedly should they not remember or know.

Just an idea for consideration in this positive and revolutionary distro in Puppyland.
Last edited by gcmartin on Mon 14 Jan 2013, 01:45, edited 1 time in total.

Barbol
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#237 Post by Barbol »

I may have found a minor bug in the fatdog's menu. I have an install with grafical login and Openbox WM, where the main menu option "Quit X server" doesn't do anything. It works correctly with console login..

Barbol

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Anniekin
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#238 Post by Anniekin »

gcmartin wrote:The root & non-root decision process may not necessarily be a good one.
its the easiest way for a puppy distro author to set up restrictions on internet activity. if there's an older method i do not know of it. the multi user .pet? its easy to manage users with terminal commands like adduser or useradd

bruno
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bug fix pet

#239 Post by bruno »

Is the mount-helper-fix pet also needed for 601?

spandey
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#240 Post by spandey »

Has anyone tried browsing Linuxmint files from Lucid 5.2.8 ? I get the same problem.

jamesbond
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#241 Post by jamesbond »

Barbol wrote:I may have found a minor bug in the fatdog's menu. I have an install with grafical login and Openbox WM, where the main menu option "Quit X server" doesn't do anything. It works correctly with console login..
When you run graphical login it is *not* possible to Quit the X server. Quitting the X server has the same effect as "restarting" X server. If you want access to your console, press Ctrl-Alt-F2 - but the X server is still there, you can switch back to it by pressing Ctrl-Alt-F4 anytime. I have updated the terms to be clearer for future releases.

Regarding unprintable characters in filenames, I remember that you can also try editing /etc/codepage and replace that with 850 or 860.
This will change the codepage used to mount FAT filesystems, without changing the console keymap. If your problem happens with other filesystems - then the codepaget thingy won't fix it.
gcmartin wrote:Maybe there is another way.
Such as?
bruno wrote:Is the mount-helper-fix pet also needed for 601?
Yes, if you have that problem. If you don't have any other Linuxes installed, then it is not necessary (=the problem won't affect you).
spandey wrote:Has anyone tried browsing Linuxmint files from Lucid 5.2.8 ? I get the same problem.
No idea. Lucid uses a totally different script to perform the mount/un-mounting. You should ask playdayz :)
Fatdog64 forum links: [url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=117546]Latest version[/url] | [url=https://cutt.ly/ke8sn5H]Contributed packages[/url] | [url=https://cutt.ly/se8scrb]ISO builder[/url]

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Anniekin
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#242 Post by Anniekin »

fatdog 610 rox-filer 'open as text' doesn't work

Gobbi
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#243 Post by Gobbi »

Yes, there are files that Rox-filer can't open in that way...
You could get a hint on what's in those files if you look in Properties...

Barbol
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#244 Post by Barbol »

jamesbond wrote:When you run graphical login it is *not* possible to Quit the X server. Quitting the X server has the same effect as "restarting" X server.
Oh, I thought it will quit X as same as in autologin or console mode. But it doesn't restart de X neither, from /usr/share/lxpanel/profile/default/panels/panel:

Code: Select all

name=Quit X server
action=killall xinit
image=mini-x
and from command line:

Code: Select all

# killall xinit
killall: xinit: no process killed
Regarding unprintable characters in filenames, I remember that you can also try editing /etc/codepage and replace that with 850 or 860.
Thanks for remeber this!! I tried editing /etc/codepage but changes dissapeared after rebooting, and it doesn't seem to make any differrence. I can see the characters, but the filename appears in red with the legend "This filename is no valid UTF-8. You should rename it". By the way, I was playing a little with Xdialog boxes for a script the last days, and having problem with spanish characters too. If I edit script the from within the virtual terminal (with vi or mp) I get boxes where the special character goes in the Xdialog window. But if I edit it with geany I have no problem, the chars appeared as spected. And if I create a file with spanish chars in the terminal, then it shows in red in Rox's with the same "no valid" legend. It seems like X and terminal emulator uses different charmap, is it posible?

gcmartin

#245 Post by gcmartin »

Anniekin wrote:
gcmartin wrote:The root & non-root decision process may not necessarily be a good one.
its the easiest way for a puppy distro author to set up restrictions on internet activity. if there's an older method i do not know of it. the multi user .pet? its easy to manage users with terminal commands like adduser or useradd
Sorry to @Anniekin and anyone else who saw the post that my quote was taken from. I should have been more clear.

That post is addressing issues seen when FATDOG boots on a PC that has other Operating Systems already installed, where rights on drive folders are changed in such a way as to incur problems when trying to boot those existing OS after FATDOG is shutdown.
This is what couple of us are drawing attention to.

Sorry for any confusion. The word "root" in Linux can refer several different things, in context. Sorry.

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