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 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
How to install Puppy in Asus laptop with UEFI BIOS? (Solved)
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dcg

Joined: 13 Dec 2006
Posts: 28

PostPosted: Thu 29 Mar 2012, 22:32    Post subject:  How to install Puppy in Asus laptop with UEFI BIOS? (Solved)
Subject description: K73E-BBR7 laptop
 

I bought an asus laptop, and while attempting to change boot sequence to
load puppy I notice it has UEFI bios. I read a little about it and it seems that Microsoft has figured a way to gum up the works for other OS. Some linux distributors have written directly to M$ complaining about this situtation. If anybody can advise me on whether I'll be able to run puppy on this without a lot of hassle if not I'll take the laptop back, because I have been and want to continue using Puppy.Thanks Kindly ... dcg

Last edited by dcg on Sun 08 Apr 2012, 22:12; edited 1 time in total
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Monsie


Joined: 01 Dec 2011
Posts: 633
Location: Kamloops BC Canada

PostPosted: Sat 31 Mar 2012, 04:10    Post subject: UEFI bios in new laptop  

Hi dcg,

Okay... I will be the first to respond here to what is certainly a controversial topic --one that is filled with a lot of fear, uncertainty, and doubt.

First, please research this new specification. There is the Wikipedia article right here and also a good news article over here and there are certainly other good news stories which discuss this new technology while cutting through some of the hype.

The bottom line appears to be that while Microsoft requires the new secure UEFI boot feature for it's Windows 8 certified computers, the OEM or hardware vendor can add additional keys which allow other operating systems to load in a dual or multi-boot scenario. Exactly how that is done, I don't know, but I suspect (it makes most sense to me) that the key would contain critical information regarding the operating system kernel, so that one wouldn't have to get a custom UEFI for each and every distro out there. I have also read that secure UEFI boot feature can be disabled by the OEM if you don't want to run Windows 8 at all. So, you should check with your retailer, and/or with Asus about this and find out where you stand with your particular laptop.

Hope this helps,
Monsie

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dcg

Joined: 13 Dec 2006
Posts: 28

PostPosted: Tue 03 Apr 2012, 23:49    Post subject: UEFI (SOLVED) Asus K73E-BBR7
Subject description: Asus laptop and linux
 

Thanks Monsie. After going into setup I found a boot option that allows for
UEFI to be disabled and I had no trouble loading puppy 5.2.8. I didn't mean
to be an alarmist with the UEFI stuff.Thanks Kindly.....dcg
. P.S. I might mention I was able to load Puppy 5.2.8 and go online, but with
Puppy 5.3.1, I was unable to find a driver to go online so I am using 5.2.8 and
very Happy

Last edited by dcg on Sun 08 Apr 2012, 22:30; edited 1 time in total
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Monsie


Joined: 01 Dec 2011
Posts: 633
Location: Kamloops BC Canada

PostPosted: Wed 04 Apr 2012, 01:49    Post subject: UEFI bios in new laptop
Subject description: Asus laptop and linux
 

Hi dcg,

That is excellent news Exclamation

My thoughts are that this topic may be of some value in future as forum members contemplate upgrading to a new computer. Hopefully, a search will easily find it...

Would you please edit your post to mark the Subject heading as "Solved". Also, it would be very useful if you would note the model name and/or number of your Asus laptop in the Subject description.

Thanks,
Monsie

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Burn_IT

Joined: 12 Aug 2006
Posts: 898
Location: Tamworth UK

PostPosted: Wed 04 Apr 2012, 09:18    Post subject:  

I bookmarked this a long time ago when these BIOSs were first mentioned.You (and a lot of other people) might find it useful.

http://www.clunk.org.uk/forums/hardware/39557-uefi-bios-error-post-codes.html

I also think that MS are shooting themselves in the foot if they do insist on it remaining active. Plus the second hand machine market will either collapse or be the biggest bunch of Hackers alive.

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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10522
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 04 Apr 2012, 09:52    Post subject: Re: UEFI
Subject description: Asus laptop and linux
 

dcg wrote:
Thanks Monsie. After going into setup I found a boot option that allows for
UEFI to be disabled and I had no trouble loading puppy 5.2.8. I didn't mean
to be an alarmist with the UEFI stuff.Thanks Kindly...... dcg


That would be cool to know more about how one does such things.

As I remember it is only possible if the OEM allow such to be done.
So the model number of ASUS would help future buyers to know
what to look for?

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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10522
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 08:03    Post subject: Re: UEFI bios in new laptop (solved) K73E-BBR7
Subject description: asus laptop (can puppy be installed regardless of UEFI
 

dcg wrote:
I bought an asus laptop, and while attempting to change boot sequence to
load puppy I notice it has UEFI bios. I read a little about it and it seems that Microsoft has figured a way to gum up the works for other OS. Some linux distributors have written directly to Msoft. complaining about this situtation. If anybody can advise me on whether I'll be able to run puppy on this without a lot of hassle if not I'll take the laptop back, because I have been and want to continue using Puppy.Thanks Kindly ... dcg


Which Asus did you buy? What model name and number does it have?

Oops sorry suddenly I notice that in the title you have added
K73E-BBR7 So I will look for Asus K73E-BBR7
Here is one link that I found using google.
Typically they don't mention UEFI which tells me that many other
Laptops will not either tell in advance. One will only know after
buying the product if it can be used for linux.

That is why I asked so persistently insisting to get an answer.
Sorry if I came through as a grumpy old man Smile
[url]
http://laptopstops.com/notebook/asus-k73e-bbr7-laptop-reviews-specs-price-video-review.html[/url]

It is interesting to test using these keywords.
"Asus K73E-BBR7" UEFI

or this on "Asus K73E-BBR7" EFI
gives different result.

EFI has existed for many years? but UEFI is Rather new?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Extensible_Firmware_Interface
Quote:
The Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a specification that defines a software interface between an operating system and platform firmware. UEFI is meant as a replacement for the BIOS firmware interface, present in all IBM PC-compatible personal computers.[1][2] In practice, most UEFI images have legacy support for BIOS services. It can be used to allow remote diagnostics and repair of computers, (or security exploits) even without another operating system. [3]

The original EFI (Extensible Firmware Interface) specification was developed by Intel. Some of its practices and data formats mirror ones from Windows.[4][5] In 2005, UEFI deprecated EFI 1.10 (final release). The UEFI specification is managed by the Unified EFI Forum.

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Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
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Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 08:30    Post subject:  

Another possible fix for the UEFI BIOS is replace it with an open-source BIOS. I don't know if the open-source BIOS has advanced far enough to do that. See this thread.
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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10522
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 08:43    Post subject:  

Thanks for that very important link Flash.

Suddenly the model number disappeared?

My naive worry. Why would they allow that one that easily change to something that works? I mean the UEFI is there to protect and if one
just can exchange it to something else then that protection is over ridden?

Would they not try to avoid such tricks like it is done on some smartphones
you have to jail break and that is a very difficult thing until somebody has
actually cracked it and that is only what some very dedicated specialists
are able to do and not on every phone either? Am I wrong?

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Burn_IT

Joined: 12 Aug 2006
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Location: Tamworth UK

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 10:06    Post subject:  

Well that is sort of the point.

The likes of MS don't want to be held legally liable for any nasties you get.

So they lock it up tight so that YOU have to break the contract to install ANYTHING that they haven't approved.

None of it is to protect the USER,; it is all to protect the supplier.

It wouldn't surprise me if MS and such actively (but secretly) encourage the jailbreaks. That way they can charge even more for repairs.

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nooby

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Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 11:42    Post subject:  

It would be very consistent with how they see things.
I agree that they try to put the "blame" on the Hardware
or OEM to make the decision but these are dependent
on Ms to get enough volume on the market so it is likely
that several of them will make it as restricted as they can
without losing out among the competition.

And to change from one bios to another. Can not the bios
be password locked to the OEM and you need to get their
permission to unlock them in same way as smartphones
are locked to the Operator?

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Burn_IT

Joined: 12 Aug 2006
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Location: Tamworth UK

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 12:13    Post subject:  

I would be well p*£.. annoyed if I needed to get into the "BIOS" to fix something and it was passworded by the OEM and he'd gone away for the weekend/holidays. !!!!!
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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 13:30    Post subject:  

Yes hopefully I am too pessimistic but how else can they protect the "Unified"
EFI. They have "Certificates" with Keys. Those "Keys" are unique.

Only the OEM knows it. So if they chose to not give you the keys.
How can you then get into BIOS and instead reload another free BIOS
or to install Linux or anything else.

No key to unlock it means you are locked out to change anything?
Or else there would be no security? Okay maybe it is only the Ms
that they want to secure. Would it be secure if one can install anything?

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Burn_IT

Joined: 12 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Mon 16 Apr 2012, 15:03    Post subject:  

Would you be able to sell or accept a car that has the engine locked into 1st gear because otherwise it would not be safe.

There are such things as ROM blowers if it comes down to that.

The solution to the security problem is for MS etc. to write secure code in the first place, not to sell half tested code written in a hurry by some 9 -to-5 junior who is being pressured by a salesman to produce anything as long as it looks flashy.

I used to work on a big project management package used in many major worldwide engineering projects back in the 80's. I only once had a bug found in software that I had written for that package. Some of it is still in use even now.

Our code had to co-exist under MVS/MSP and VM with everything else the client wanted to run.

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Sky Aisling


Joined: 27 Jun 2009
Posts: 882
Location: Port Townsend, WA. USA

PostPosted: Mon 02 Dec 2013, 23:16    Post subject: How to install Puppy in Asus laptop with UEFI BIOS? (Solved)
Subject description: secure boot feature of UEFI
 

Here's some reading material about the secure boot feature of UEFI

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/01/windows-8s-locked-bootloaders-much-ado-about-nothing-or-the-end-of-the-world-as-we-know-it

http://www.eightforums.com/windows-8-news/13235-ms-new-secure-boot-locked-bios-arrives.html

http://idiallo.com/blog/2013/07/laptop-for-win8-like-mac-for-os10
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