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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Additional Software (PETs, n' stuff) » Unsorted
dpupmaker.sh v1.9 -- compiles source tarballs into Dotpups
Moderators: deshlab, Flash, GuestToo, Ian, JohnMurga, Lobster
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GuestToo
Puppy Master

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Tue 03 Jan 2006, 06:45    Post subject:  

this is a perfect example ... the dotpup system was created to address these exact issues ... so that i would not have to explain over and over and over again on the forum how to unzip a tar.gz package, how to chmod the permissions, how exectuables in the working dir need the path to begin with ./ (or type bash an-executable) ... etc etc etc

the dotpup system was never intended to be a package manager ... it was intended to be simple and easy to use and familiar to newbies who have installed Windows programs using an install-this-program.exe file (click to download ... click to install)

of course, dotpups are extremely flexible and can easily use any package management tools that are made available ... but it was never intended that package management tools be built into the dotpup system

i deliberately chose zip rather than gzip to compress the packages, because servers are often misconfigured and treat gzip files as text files, which can be confusing when a newbie clicks a tar.gz file and the browser shows a page of gibberish text characters

the dotpup system was targeted at newbies, but i think a simple and easy to use installer is a good thing for more advanced Puppy users too
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jmarsden


Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 263
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Tue 03 Jan 2006, 18:17    Post subject:  

GuestToo wrote:
this is a perfect example ...
the dotpup system was never intended to be a package manager ... it was intended to be simple and easy to use and familiar to newbies ...
the dotpup system was targeted at newbies, but i think a simple and easy to use installer is a good thing for more advanced Puppy users too

True, but in this case if a newbie is installing dpupmaker.sh, then they are installing something they have no use for anyway! So making it a neatly packaged and easy to install dotpup just "sends the wrong message" about what this script is.

The application (script) being discussed here is not for newcomers. Really, truly, it's not! It is a quick and still-fairly-dirty command line tool for developers. If it ever expands into a fully-fledged app, complete with a GUI wrapper and man pages (or .info files or similar documentation) etc., then at that stage, wrapping that app into an easily installed bundle (i.e. creating a package containing it) would IMO probably be appropriate.

At this early point in its lifecycle, I want dpupmaker.sh to be just a script, something that is played with by developers. People who can handle the idea of playing with scripts, who can perhaps even read the script to see how it does what it does and suggest improvements... does that make sense? I'm not being elistist, just practical -- at present, my shell script is not likely to be useful to someone, unless they have spent some significant time at a shell prompt already.

However, if someone else (perhaps a strong dotpup advocate such as yourself Wink ) feels that they want to package up dpupmaker.sh right away and distribute dotpups of it (and support the newcomers who install it and have trouble using it??), then that's OK with me. The script is released under GPL, so of course anyone is free to take it and use it within the limits of that licence.

Sumary: You are right, ARAN's issues are a good demo of why simple "just click it" installers are useful to newcomers. But, dupmaker.sh is unlikely to be of any use to them.

Jonathan
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klhrevolutionist


Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 1124

PostPosted: Tue 03 Jan 2006, 19:20    Post subject: ok  

I will supply feedback as soon as I see something draws my attention.

As of lately there has not been an application that has come out, or I have found that interest me. So when I do come across something draws me in. You will be the first to know.

_________________
Heaven is on the way, until then let's get the truth out!
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ARAN

Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Tue 03 Jan 2006, 20:16    Post subject:  

I want only to say that i have just developed something very interessting thing based on your Script Johnathan.

Its a Rox Application which understand Drag and Drop functionality.

For creating DotPups now the Puppy user dont need any more to use the Shell.

They can only drag and drop the needed source files over the "Dot-Pup Maker" Icon and the hole Building Process beginn automaticly to work.

In the next days i will try to create a DotPup Package of this RoxApplication which extract your
Script in the needed Folder maked it Exuctable Copy the Drag and Drop Rox Application in the RoxApp Folder make the AppRun File in the Folder exucatble and copy the Icon to the Puppy Desktop automaticly.

I will post it here in this Forum Thread.
Here are some Screen Shots
PuppyScreenShot2.png
 Description   
 Filesize   39.23 KB
 Viewed   1650 Time(s)

PuppyScreenShot2.png

PuppyScreenShot3.png
 Description   
 Filesize   56.18 KB
 Viewed   1659 Time(s)

PuppyScreenShot3.png

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jmarsden


Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 263
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Tue 03 Jan 2006, 20:41    Post subject: Re: ok  

klhrevolutionist wrote:
I will supply feedback as soon as I see something draws my attention.

As of lately there has not been an application that has come out, or I have found that interest me. So when I do come across something draws me in. You will be the first to know.

OK. Until then... which app were you thinking of when you asked for the extra --strip and --enable-fast-install options to ./configure? I'd like to test that app to see if the current script will handle that sort of thing correctly (it should do). Even if the app is not all that interesting, it would still be a useful test of dpupmaker.sh Smile

Jonathan
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jmarsden


Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 263
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Tue 03 Jan 2006, 21:03    Post subject:  

ARAN wrote:
I want only to say that i have just developed something very interessting thing based on your Script Johnathan.

Its a Rox Application which understand Drag and Drop functionality.

For creating DotPups now the Puppy user dont need any more to use the Shell.

Cool -- this sort of GUI wrapper around dpupmaker.sh is something I have already thought about. I was expecting it to be created rather later, after the script itself has had a lot more testing and real-life use from the command line.

Well done! I am somewhat concerned that making it that easy to install and use may tempt non-developers to try and use it, and that could lead to an explosion of time-consuming "support requests". For example, have you actually successfully used dpupmaker.sh to build xmms-recorder yet? If so, I expect you had to build and install a couple of other things first, right? And how did you know what those pre-requisites were... it often takes some degree of extra knowledge to build medium or large applications successfully.

Quote:
In the next days i will try to create a DotPup Package of this RoxApplication ...


Go for it! Do make sure the user can see the text output from the script, and to test the exit status of the script (0 means it seems to have worked, 1 or any other non-zero value means it failed. Otherwise the user will not know that they just created a bad or incomplete dotpup!

If you want to just post the Rox app here (not yet Dotpup-ified), ideally with a sentence or two on how to install it into Rox, that would be good too. Or start a separate thread in this forum for your GUI tool, maybe?

Jonathan
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ARAN

Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 03:34    Post subject:  

I have just send you a .tar archive of the Rox Application per Private Mail to you.

The Application is not yet finished.
I am searching for a way to open a Bash Terminal Screen and run after this in this window your Skript.
Thats my idea for telling the User what is the actuall status of the dot pup making.
After the ending of the dotpup making the script should then get the Handle of the Bash Window and close after the end of the Process the Window Automaticly.

At the moment the script build the DotPup only quite.
The user dont see the messages of your script.

To try this Application extract it in the Folder
"/usr/local/apps"
and make shure that the File "AppRun" inside the Folder is set as executable by "chmod +x ...."

This drag and drop application is based on this tutorial here.
Maybe it can be for you be also helpfull.

http://rox.sourceforge.net/phpwiki/index.php/Tutorials/Start
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 03:50    Post subject:  

I had some problems opening terminal-windows in Puppy.
However it works, see this program that runs wget:
http://www.murga.org/~puppy/viewtopic.php?t=4274&highlight=opera

A solution that works fine for me, is using the "real" XTerm:
http://www.murga.org/~puppy/viewtopic.php?t=3630&highlight=yacas
It also has a nice option "-hold", that avoids it is closed automatically after a command is executed.

However, Alucard reported problems with it:
http://www.murga.org/~puppy/viewtopic.php?p=30074#30074

But I don't know what happened there exactly.
I will try to replace it with the way the opera-installer runs rxvt.

Mark
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jmarsden


Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 263
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 04:36    Post subject:  

ARAN wrote:
I have just send you a .tar archive of the Rox Application per Private Mail to you. ...
I am searching for a way to open a Bash Terminal Screen and run after this in this window your Skript.
OK.

First, I suggest discussion of this ROX App would be better if it happens in a separate thread (topic) so it is separate from discussion of dpupmaker.sh itself?

Second: A design suggestion: the GUI app does not really need to open a terminal window... or any kind of shell window. Instead, it just needs some kind of text viewer widget, that displays the combined stdout and stderr streams produced by executing dpupmaker.sh. And some sort of "Yes it worked" or "Oh dear, it didn't work" alert dialog when the script completes, depending on the exit status of the script. This way the user gets the feedback and info they need, but they can't do anything potentially damaging, such as accidentally type commands into a root shell your GUI opened for them ... !

I am a complete beginner at GTK+ stuff, but I think that the GtkTextView widget type would be appropriate for the text viewer?
There's a tutorial on it at http://www.bravegnu.org/gtktext/ -- in C, but can be fairly readily translated to the Python GTK+ bindings that ROX Apps in the tutorial you pointed to seem to use, I think. Or use the GTK2 bindings of whatever programming language you prefer.

Please note that I have not tried out any of this with ROX at all, it is just an idea I am hoping someone else will explore!

Jonathan

Last edited by jmarsden on Wed 04 Jan 2006, 05:20; edited 2 times in total
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 04:46    Post subject:  

you could even use leafpad as a viewer.

Here is a viewer using Gtkdialog, save as gtk_edit and make it executable:
Code:
#! /bin/bash

export MAIN_DIALOG='
 <vbox>
  <frame Edit>
    <edit>
      <input file>gtk_edit</input>
      <output file>new-file</output>
      <variable>EDIT</variable>
      <width>350</width><height>150</height>
    </edit>
    <hbox>
      <button>
        <label>Save as new-file</label>
        <action>Save:EDIT</action>
      </button>
      <button help>
      </button>
    </hbox>
  </frame>
  <hbox>
   <button ok></button>
   <button cancel></button>
  </hbox>
 </vbox>
'

gtkdialog2 --program=MAIN_DIALOG


Mark
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jmarsden


Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 263
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 05:16    Post subject:  

MU wrote:
you could even use leafpad as a viewer. ...
It seems unnecesary to use an editor as a viewer. I think the gtkdialog2 idea would be fine from a shell-script based ROX app, or the Python approach in the tutorial ARAN pointed at would be fine too, if the ROX app is being done in Python.

Since we don't really want or expect the user to edit the output of the underlying script (it makes no sense), wouldn't GtKTextViewer be more appropriate than GtkEdit ? Or am I just demonstrating how poor my knowledge of GTK2 truly is ...?!

Jonathan
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 05:26    Post subject:  

http://dotpups.de/tests/gtkdialog-0.59.8.tar.gz

This includes example-scripts for all (?) currently supported Dialogs.

You don't need to compile it.
Just in the examples, replace "gtkdialog" with "gtkdialog2".

Puppy uses 2 versions of gtkdialog for backward-compatibility, but everybody is encouraged to use gtkdialog2, which is gtkdialog-0.59.8.

There also is "Xdialog" in Puppy, but I don't know all the widgets.
grep Xdialog /usr/sbin/*
gives examples. Or see here: http://xdialog.dyns.net/ , it has a "textbox" you could use.


Mark
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ARAN

Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan 2006, 19:18    Post subject:  

@ Mark !

Tank you very much for your very interessting and helpfull links about GTKDialog.

@ Jonathan

What for installed tools does your Script expect to be installed on the PC exactly.
I have seen that it checks for mingw and maybe gcc.
Does it need also other Programms ?

I will open a new Thread for questions and answers how are not related to your dpupmaker.sh Skript.
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jmarsden


Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 263
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan 2006, 01:15    Post subject:  

ARAN wrote:
What for installed tools does your Script expect to be installed on the PC exactly.
I have seen that it checks for mingw and maybe gcc.
Does it need also other Programms ?
It needs whatever the ./configure script within the tarball needs to build the package being built! Other than bash, tar, which, make, touch, sleep, mkdir, rm, cat, cut, sed, md5sum, zip and mv, the script itself doesn't use anything directly. [[ well, and the ./configure script it expects to find in each tarball, of course! ]]

But -- you can see that just by reading my script anyway Smile

I think it might help you (or anyone!) to build a working GUI for dpupmaker.sh, to first read about the GNU autotools suite, and how these tools are used to create source code tarballs that build in a standard way, and install, on a wide variety of different systems. The knowledge gained by taking the time to do this will also be useful for manually running ./configure to build packages.

There is an online browseable copy of the book GNU Autoconf, Automake and Libtool by Gary V. Vaughan, Ben Elliston, Tom Tromey and Ian Lance Taylor, at http://sources.redhat.com/autobook/ . This is a great introduction to this set of tools. Definitely recommended.

There is also a decent little tutorial for those creating programs using this set of tools at http://inti.sourceforge.net/tutorial/libinti/autotoolsproject.html which has a handy list of links to other related documentation.

That combination (and a little experimentation!) should be enough for any moderately experienced software developer to understand and use these tools, and therefore to understand what dpupmaker.sh is automating. Google will also find the online manuals for each tool, if you want or need more detailed information about them.

Jonathan

Last edited by jmarsden on Thu 05 Jan 2006, 22:08; edited 1 time in total
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ARAN

Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan 2006, 19:24    Post subject:  

Thanks a lot for the very interessting Links Jonathan and the very helpfull answer.
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