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During slideshow screen went black
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disciple

Joined: 20 May 2006
Posts: 6463
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri 15 Jan 2010, 01:23    Post subject:  

Maybe you could post a list of the programs that are running in the background, so we can see if there is anything unusual, that might be causing this.
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trio


Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1943
Location: अनुमोदना

PostPosted: Fri 15 Jan 2010, 10:55    Post subject:  

Quote:
The "No Blankscreen 1.0" feature was not located under any menu item. I also could not find anything that even resembled it under any of the sub menu's. Please be more explicit as to where that feature is located.


run:
Code:
fixmenus


and restart window manager after install? Rolling Eyes

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Barq's

Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Fri 15 Jan 2010, 20:36    Post subject: Battling with the Black screen  

Disciple

Quote:
Maybe you could post a list of the programs that are running in the background, so we can see if there is anything unusual, that might be causing this.


I do not know how to do this. How do I obtain a list of running programs?

trio

You just went over my head, so I guessed that RUN: fixmenus means open a consule window and type fixmenus and hit enter (did that) as far as restart windows manager...I guessed that meant restart JWM (did that) Nothing changed. What was I really supposed to do here?
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trio


Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1943
Location: अनुमोदना

PostPosted: Fri 15 Jan 2010, 20:40    Post subject:  

well, that's how you do it. If I remember correctly menu item should be under desktop group. Anyway, what puppy are you on?

Another way is to run:

Code:
noblankscreen

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npierce

Joined: 28 Dec 2009
Posts: 858

PostPosted: Fri 15 Jan 2010, 21:12    Post subject:  

Okay, it looks like there are at least a couple of problems happening here, and the combination of their symptoms makes it hard to see either problem clearly.

One problem is the "No Analog Signal" problem, which is probably related to DPMS. But since your screen is now blanking before you get the "No Analog Signal" message, we need to deal with this new problem first.

Your new problem would not be related to DPMS, nor do I think it is related to the "xset s off" in your startup script. If DPMS or the screensaver built into the X server kicked in, you would not still see a cursor on the screen.

Have you recently removed some images or increased the rate at which the images change?

How many image files are in the directory?

Do the images change at the rate of once every 5 seconds? (This is probably the case, since it is the usual rate, and it is not something that you can change in Puppy Screensaver Setup.)

Try the following 3 commands. Note that you will need to use your Esc key (as you do from the screensaver) to exit. Note also that there is a period just before the slash at the end of the second command. Your first image should appear with a pair of numbers in the lower right-hand corner -- for instance "1/246". What numbers do you see?

Code:

pushd /usr/local/PuppyBasicScreensaver02/resource/slideshow/
slideshow -name -sort n+ -recurse ./
popd
 


If the second number is less than 300 or so, your new problem may be related to the screensaver itself.

Finally, when the screensaver goes blank with the cursor still on the screen, or when it "freezes" on one image, what happens when you click the right mouse button?

Depending upon the answers to these questions, I may have a possible solution.
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Barq's

Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Sat 16 Jan 2010, 05:38    Post subject: Next Steps  

I am running 4.2

I'm in a rush to get out of town and will not return until Sunday. I will run the tests and post results of what I learn then.

Have a good week end

Thank you
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Barq's

Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Tue 19 Jan 2010, 03:29    Post subject: latest round of tests  

in the consule window I ran; noblankscreen and noblackscreen twice each
Results "command not found" all four times

Three are six images in the background folder, I have not removed any nor have I increased the rate at which the images change, however, I did slow it down to once every 15 seconds (see http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?search_id=1664567019&t=41187). I have timed the rate and it seems to hold it pretty well, although I also made them random and every now and then the same image will be selected multiple times in a row and it will remain on the screen for some multiple of 15 seconds.

I then ran
pushd /usr/local/PuppyBasicScreensaver02/resource/slideshow/

It returned; /usr/local/PuppyBasicScreensaver02/resource/slideshow ~

I then ran slideshow -name -sort n+ -recurse ./

The numbers in the bottom right corner were 1/240

I do not know what that means.

I then ran popd

and it returned
~
#

As for the last question regarding what happens when I right click after a freeze...I will test that tomorrow as it is very late and I am having great difficulty keeping my eyes open tonight.
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npierce

Joined: 28 Dec 2009
Posts: 858

PostPosted: Tue 19 Jan 2010, 11:10    Post subject:  

Barq's wrote:

. . . it is very late and I am having great difficulty keeping my eyes open tonight


Good morning, Barq's,

Eye's rested?

Thanks for sending the results of your testing.

The "1/240" in the bottom right corner indicates that slideshow is displaying the first of 240 images.

Why 240? Why not 6?

Apparently the sceensaver does not have the ability to loop built into its code. It does, however, have the ability to seek-out images in subdirectories. (That's what the "-recurse" inside mod_slideshow.pbas is for.) The soft link named "loop" in the /usr/local/PuppyBasicScreensaver02/resource/slideshow/ directory has the value "../". This, in effect, makes /usr/local/PuppyBasicScreensaver02/resource/slideshow/ a sub-sub-directory of itself, and a sub-sub-sub-sub-directory of itself, and a sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-sub-directory of itself, and a . . . Well, you get the picture.

So slideshow thinks that you have many more than six images.

But why 240? Why not an infinite number?

Unfortunately, that looping cannot go on forever. For me, anyway, (and apparently for you as well) the slideshow code gives up after 39 times. This means that all of the images in the directory are displayed 40 times. If I have six images in the directory, slideshow will think I have 240. If it displays one every 5 seconds, that will take 20 minutes. Then the slideshow stops on the final image.

(It is lucky that the slideshow code eventually gives up, or else it would spend infinity building its list of images, and never display any.)

Note that if you previously ran at the default "-advance" rate of 5 seconds, the screensaver would stop after 20 minutes, which is also, coincidentally, the default delay before DPMS kicks in and blanks the monitor.

Now that you slowed things down to change the image every 15 seconds, the screensaver should run for an hour before stopping. Of course, if DPMS or something else causes the screen to go blank first, you won't see it running that long.

This does not explain why, last Thursday, it was stopping for you after only ten minutes. Is it still doing that today?

Puppy 4.3.1 has a file called DarkGrey.jpg in the /usr/share/backgrounds/ directory. Is that one of the images you were using last Thursday?

What to try now?

Go ahead, as you were planning to do this morning, and see what a right-click does after a freeze. It is supposed to display the previous image. More right-clicks will continue to display previous images. Left-clicks will then display the next image (until, of course, you get to the last image). (Mouse clicks can also be used while the screen saver is running, but will stop the timer that advances the images. Press 't' to start it again.)

Don't forget to disable DPMS, before letting the screensaver kick-in, as you have done before with:

xset -dpms

or

xset dpms 0 0 0

(As you have already noticed, restarting the xserver enables DPMS, so don't restart it. If you find that one of those two commands works for you, you may add it to your startup script.)
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Barq's

Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2010, 04:39    Post subject: More Black  

npierce

Thank you for the explanation of what is going on, it does raise another issue that I will elaborate on at the end of this missive.

I ran the tests as follows;

with dpms enabled I waited for a black screen (Note: the cursor went away this time) then without moving the mouse I right clicked and the screen saver reappeared. multiple right clicks kept changing the picture shown.

I let it sit and run for several hours, when I returned the screen was black and the cursor gone but a right click brought back the images.

With dpms disabled I waited about two hours (it appeared to hang on a dark gray screen with the cursor still present) and again the right click brought the images back. However, the images ceased to cycle after that.

I'm going to let it run all night with dpms disabled and see what it is like in the morning.

Now I have a question about how this screensaver really works. You mentioned that it cannot actually loop through the pictures endlessly. One of my reasons that I am so interested in a slideshow screen saver is to install this on and i-opener and use it as a picture frame in our church where it would sit and scroll through pictures of the holy land for weeks on end. If I understand your discription for how this woks, I would have to have extreme numbers of pictures with very long cycle times in order for this to approximate such a feat and even then I would have to reboot every so often since i-opener keyboard does not have an ESC key.
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disciple

Joined: 20 May 2006
Posts: 6463
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2010, 05:26    Post subject:  

Quote:
I would have to have extreme numbers of pictures with very long cycle times in order for this to approximate such a feat

Or lots of copies of them, or possibly you could get them to display more times by an arrangement with symlinks - I don't know how the 40 loop limitation works.

Or you could modify the program to loop endlessly; I would have thought this would be fairly trivial. Or you could persuade someone else to modify it - surely you have some Basic coders in your church Smile?
BTW has anyone pointed out this limitation to MU (who I think wrote the program)?

Or you could install an alternative screensaver program that doesn't have this limitation - maybe xscreensaver?

Or you could install another slideshow program that isn't necessarily a "screensaver"... you're just using this computer for displaying pictures, aren't you? So it doesn't need to autostart after a certain period of inactivity, does it?
IIRC qiv can loop endlessly. Even if you don't get a program that does, you can write a shell script that will run it endlessly. Try running this in a terminal
Code:
while $notest; do echo hello; echo goodbye; done

I could be wrong, but I think it will go on forever. So I think you should be able to use a similar command to run any program repeatedly forever. e.g. if you're using qiv,
Code:
while $notest; do qiv [whatever_your_qiv_arguments_and_options_are]; done

I haven't looked at it, but I'm guessing puppyscreensaver calls a separate program to play the slideshow, so you should be able to call that program directly.

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disciple

Joined: 20 May 2006
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2010, 05:43    Post subject:  

disciple wrote:
you should be able to use a similar command to run any program repeatedly forever

Sorry, not any program... obviously whatever puppyscreensaver is using doesn't exit when it gets to the end of the slideshow, so you'd want to find something that either does that, or can loop continuously itself.

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disciple

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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2010, 05:44    Post subject:  

I read that GQview has a repeat preference for its slideshow.
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npierce

Joined: 28 Dec 2009
Posts: 858

PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2010, 18:51    Post subject:  

Barq's wrote:

With dpms disabled I waited about two hours (it appeared to hang on a dark gray screen with the cursor still present) and again the right click brought the images back. However, the images ceased to cycle after that.


Okay, well it looks like you have made it past the twenty-minute DPMS barrier anyway. Good. That's one problem resolved.

And the fact that a right-click will take you back through the images indicates that the slideshow is still alive and has not crashed, but apparently reached the end of its list of images.

It seems like the "dark gray screen with the cursor still present" is one of your images, which happens to be the last one displayed. Is one of your images dark gray, such as DarkGrey.jpg?

Anyway, you are correct in your understanding that, as it is, this screensaver may not be easily used for your need of running "for weeks on end."

So what are your alternatives?

My advice is to take disciple's advice. Although all of his suggestions are good, his last one would be my favorite.

I installed gqview-2.0.4 (on Puppy 4.3.1), tried it out, and it looks like it might be just what you need. After installing it, you may start it in full-screen slideshow mode with the following command:

gqview -s -f /usr/share/backgrounds/

While running, pressing 's' will toggle the slideshow mode, and pressing 'f' will toggle full-screen mode. You will need to exit full-screen mode to choose your repeat, random, and delay preferences (Edit -> Preferences). Note that before your new preferences will take effect, you may have to press 's' once or twice to restart the slideshow mode.

GQview has a fairly good user guide at http://gqview.sourceforge.net/docs/index.html

Should you decide to continue with PuppyBasicScreensaver02, you could, as disciple has pointed out, add some symlinks to convince slideshow that you have more images. For instance, the following two commands would double the number of images, and so double the length of time it would run.

cd /usr/local/PuppyBasicScreensaver02/resource/slideshow
ln -s /usr/share/backgrounds/ backgrounds002

That would raise the number of images from 240 to 480. Similarly creating backgrounds003 would give you another 240, for a total of 720. But you would have to create hundreds of these symlinks to get it to run for a week or more. And it is possible that you might run into other limitations. So this is not the ideal solution.

You would be better off with one of disciple's other suggestions, like finding someone to modify slideshow (the program that the screensaver calls for its slideshow module). Or perhaps the author of slideshow, Jeremy Stanley (http://www.xmission.com/%7Ejstanley/mail.html), would be willing to add this feature. Or perhaps MU (on this forum), who I think is the person who created this screensaver, would have an idea.

But the quickest solution for you is probably to try another program. As mentioned earlier, I think GQview, as suggested by disciple, would serve your needs. But the other programs mentioned by disciple might be as good or better -- I've just not tried them.

Let us know how you make out.

Good luck.
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npierce

Joined: 28 Dec 2009
Posts: 858

PostPosted: Thu 21 Jan 2010, 17:43    Post subject:  

Barq's wrote:

. . . i-opener keyboard does not have an ESC key.


If your Pizza key isn't doing anything useful, you can turn it into an ESC key. First, execute this command:

Code:

ls /root/.Xmodmap


If the result is "No such file or directory" it is safe to execute these two commands:

Code:

echo "keycode 115 = Escape" > /root/.Xmodmap
xmodmap /root/.Xmodmap


That's all: you now have an ESC key. This will survive X server restarts. If you later decide you don't like it, simply remove /root/.Xmodmap and restart the X server.

disciple wrote:

BTW has anyone pointed out this limitation to MU (who I think wrote the program)?

Yes, although the limitation is actually in the slideshow program, which his screensaver uses as a module, and which I believe was written by someone else.
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Barq's

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PostPosted: Fri 22 Jan 2010, 03:47    Post subject: Re-grouping to go at it again  

et. al.

The over night run was frozen on the grey screen with the cursor still present.

Quote:
Puppy 4.3.1 has a file called DarkGrey.jpg in the /usr/share/backgrounds/ directory. Is that one of the images you were using last Thursday?


Yes, I also have an image called LightGrey.jpg in the same folder which I was using and it hung on that one once as well.

Quote:
Or you could modify the program to loop endlessly; I would have thought this would be fairly trivial. Or you could persuade someone else to modify it - surely you have some Basic coders in your church


I just did some research into what it would take to learn visual basic and came to the obvious conclusion that modifying this program is way over my head, in fact I would wager it was probably written in "C" or something like that. I'm not a code warrior and unfortunately our congregation is very tiny and that seems to be a talent which is not present therein.

Quote:
you could install an alternative screensaver program that doesn't have this limitation - maybe xscreensaver?


I was trying to avoid xscreensaver because this board blasts it for being an overly bloated pig (or something to that effect) and the i-opener is only a 200 Mhz machine.

Quote:
you could install another slideshow program that isn't necessarily a "screensaver"... you're just using this computer for displaying pictures, aren't you? So it doesn't need to autostart after a certain period of inactivity, does it?


I'm actually installing this on two machines, only one of which is being used as a picture screen and even it has a secondary function, that being to host an application called e-sword for the occasional student to study scripture from multiple different bibles in a comparative fashion. Consequently it would be best if the users did not need to know how to turn on and off the slideshow.

Quote:
IIRC qiv can loop endlessly. Even if you don't get a program that does, you can write a shell script that will run it endlessly. Try running this in a terminal
Code:
Code:
while $notest; do echo hello; echo goodbye; done


I could be wrong, but I think it will go on forever. So I think you should be able to use a similar command to run any program repeatedly forever. e.g. if you're using qiv,
Code:
Code:
while $notest; do qiv [whatever_your_qiv_arguments_and_options_are]; done


I haven't looked at it, but I'm guessing puppys creensaver calls a separate program to play the slideshow, so you should be able to call that program directly.


I was about to say that this was over my head but I would play with it and see what i could make happen. But then I noticed your next post basically retracts this statement, so I will not try this.

Quote:
So what are your alternatives?

My advice is to take disciple's advice. Although all of his suggestions are good, his last one would be my favorite.


I will try and get GQview up and running as my backup plan. But my preference is the tiny slideshow screensaver for the reasons stated above.

Quote:
you could, as disciple has pointed out, add some symlinks to convince slideshow that you have more images.

however
Quote:
You would be better off with one of disciple's other suggestions, like finding someone to modify slideshow


I will attempt to contact both of the parties suggested and see if either would be willing to make the modifications.

Quote:
If your Pizza key isn't doing anything useful, you can turn it into an ESC key.


That sounds sweet!

I will be out of town (and thus off-line) again this weekend, leaving early tomorrow, but I will have access to the i-opener one evening and will see if I can turn the pizza key into an ESC key.

I will report back when I am able to get back on-line (which should be late Sunday evening).

Thank you
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