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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Additional Software (PETs, n' stuff) » Unsorted
Distributed Puppy Repository Format
Moderators: deshlab, Flash, GuestToo, Ian, JohnMurga, Lobster
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Do you think this would be a good addition in puppy?
Definetly Yes
66%
 66%  [ 8 ]
I suppose
16%
 16%  [ 2 ]
Could use a bit of work done on it
16%
 16%  [ 2 ]
Probably would be best for a puplet
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
No, I prefer the standard system for distributing packages
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 12

Author Message
J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 16:35    Post subject:  Distributed Puppy Repository Format
Subject description: well, it's not a program, but can help with distributing programs
 

well, there were some people that liked my idea for a format to be used for a Puppy Distributed Repository, which was what i recommended when the fate of the canadian hosting site puppylinux.ca's fate seemed to have been up in the air, as a way to easily distribute packages throughout the internet over many different mirrors, but being able to reach them with a single text document.

an example of a string in a repository file would look like this.

{abiword} {gnome office word processor} {office} {j-bob-server} {puplet:bobpup03} {puppy:411,410} {preferred:puplet} : [direct:http://jbob.surge8.com/packages/office/abiword.pet] [torrent:http://jbob.surge8.com/torrents/office/abiword.pet.torrent]

the first part is the package name, the second is the description, the third is the category.

the fourth part is the name for the mirror which hosts the package, the fifth part is the desired puplet for the package to be used on, but this could be replaced with either a * for any, or removed if the package manager will allow it.

the fifth is the version of puppy it is recommended for. the sixth is the direct download link, and the last part is the torrent link.

hope this get's put into consideration, because i think this could be a great addition to puppy.

- J-Bob

p.s. i know this is a long post, but it's like this to get the info needed for those who want to use it, to be able to use it.

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prit1


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 538
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 17:31    Post subject:  

I already posted something similar on Caneri's thread also.

We need to also look at
- where and how this file will be maintained?
- will there be a gui to access or update this?

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J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 17:41    Post subject:  

prit1 wrote:
I already posted something similar on Caneri's thread also.

We need to also look at
- where and how this file will be maintained?
- will there be a gui to access or update this?


well, the idea is that each individual person running a mini-mirror, will manage a much smaller version of this file, and around every two weeks or each month, they would send me their mini-lists, and i will merge them together to create a .dist file. but there are plans to be able to update separate repository files a the repository.

the gui would basically read the file, interpret where each section fits, and bring up a screen to choose a mirror, then from that a category, and from that, packages, and also after that. the choice between direct download, and torrent.

but my current skills in programming are not the best. i'm currently learning tcl and tk. and i'm still a student. which means that it might take some time to build a program to manage it, but i'm sure some people might help.

- J-Bob

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SirDuncan


Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 836
Location: Ohio, USA

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 18:04    Post subject:  

Most distributed repository formats that I have used keep a list on each server and the package manager downloads the list from each server on its mirrors list. It then parses each list instead of one master list.

This is probably easier than one person maintaining a master list that must be updated constantly. Only the individual mirrors would have to keep their lists up to date. It also makes it easy to add an unofficial mirror.

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J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 18:19    Post subject:  

SirDuncan wrote:
Most distributed repository formats that I have used keep a list on each server and the package manager downloads the list from each server on its mirrors list. It then parses each list instead of one master list.

This is probably easier than one person maintaining a master list that must be updated constantly. Only the individual mirrors would have to keep their lists up to date. It also makes it easy to add an unofficial mirror.


I'm glad you brought up that point SirDuncan. and this was what i was intending, but what do you think about adding the ability to add new official mirrors, simply by adding an entry for their .dist file in the main file. and possibly using a script to remove old entries from a servers .dist file when you update it's file.

or what if we make it read the files as, puppycanada.dist for puppylinux.ca, bobpup.dist for one i might build and using the file name without the dist as the name for the repository.

i'm trying to build this with the community to try and have it cater to as many people as possible.

- J-Bob
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technosaurus


Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 4878
Location: Blue Springs, MO

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 18:36    Post subject:  

If we set up a wiki that categorizes pets (preferably into the same categories as are in the Puppy Menu) I can easily incorporate it into the web desktop.

my dropdown menus basically take a list of links and formats them into a dropdown menu using css

each entry looks like this:
Code:
<li><a href="http://url_of_pet" title="description of pet">Name_of_pet</a></li>


so all I would need is a wiki page that had a list of pets


I had a go at doing this using special categories in .desktop files and integrated it into jwm (called "The Pound") -here is a pic
I finally came to the conclusion that the web desktop would be a better place for it since you would need web access anyhow in order to download a pet. It was a lot of work and a great learning experience though.

I should have a working test going in the web desktop this weekend (I had to rebuild it recently due to a bot so please be patient - I will eventually get all the nice features and extra puppy searches back too)
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prit1


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 538
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 18:39    Post subject:  

Yeah as SirDuncan mentioned we could use individual lists on different servers and just have a single Mirrors list.

The mirrors list can be used by a daily cron by some server or servers to create a master list for fast and easy searching through the web.

Actually the software search on Puppylinux.org today does just this. It downloads the package list files from different servers. These are used to come up with the search. Tom's petch would be similar I guess.

Using this new package format files will help easily filter to find what package works on which Puppy version and stuff like that.

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J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 18:44    Post subject:  

technosaurus wrote:
If we set up a wiki that categorizes pets (preferably into the same categories as are in the Puppy Menu) I can easily incorporate it into the web desktop.

my dropdown menus basically take a list of links and formats them into a dropdown menu using css

each entry looks like this:
Code:
<li><a href="http://url_of_pet" title="description of pet">Name_of_pet</a></li>


so all I would need is a wiki page that had a list of pets


I had a go at doing this using special categories in .desktop files and integrated it into jwm (called "The Pound") -here is a pic
I finally came to the conclusion that the web desktop would be a better place for it since you would need web access anyhow in order to download a pet. It was a lot of work and a great learning experience though.

I should have a working test going in the web desktop this weekend (I had to rebuild it recently due to a bot so please be patient - I will eventually get all the nice features and extra puppy searches back too)


I like that alot Very Happy
i think your idea might be better than mine. and quite a bit better. Might not be as powerful, but much simpler. and straightforward. But i admit it seems like it might be able to fit with this idea. so how about this.

what if you could help me in building a v2 version of the format in css. and i could help with setting up a system to manage a set of repos files merged together. but i worry that it could become a little too big. which is why i think a script which would let you switch the repository would be something that could be used.

- J-Bob
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technosaurus


Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 4878
Location: Blue Springs, MO

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 20:25    Post subject:  

The great part about it is that all you would have to do is add another dropdown menu or I could always add additional or sub-categories too- maybe separate the single serve pets from the ones on large repos (I was planning on indicating this status with icons anyhow - puppy official =pet16.xpm, semi-official=package.xpm and unofficial = no icon)

- its pretty easy to do all of this now that I have my previous work to cut and paste from (well... most of it anyways)

The biggest difficulty for me is just gathering all of the links (and descriptions if needed) - this is where a pet wiki would come in VERY handy
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J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 21:04    Post subject:  

technosaurus wrote:
The great part about it is that all you would have to do is add another dropdown menu or I could always add additional or sub-categories too- maybe separate the single serve pets from the ones on large repos (I was planning on indicating this status with icons anyhow - puppy official =pet16.xpm, semi-official=package.xpm and unofficial = no icon)

- its pretty easy to do all of this now that I have my previous work to cut and paste from (well... most of it anyways)

The biggest difficulty for me is just gathering all of the links (and descriptions if needed) - this is where a pet wiki would come in VERY handy


agreed. how about i make a page on the wiki for people to place their application, category, and url. that would help speed up the process

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technosaurus


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PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 22:25    Post subject:  

sounds great to me - as long as we aren't duplicating labor ... there may already be one, in which case we could just get the word out - I am just going to be working on cataloging the larger repositories in the mean time
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J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec 2008, 22:34    Post subject:  

technosaurus wrote:
sounds great to me - as long as we aren't duplicating labor ... there may already be one, in which case we could just get the word out - I am just going to be working on cataloging the larger repositories in the mean time


that's a good idea technosaurus. we should check for such a thing.

- J-Bob

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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2946
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Thu 04 Dec 2008, 07:09    Post subject:  

the idea of a registry of software is great

My last rant on distributing unsigned binaries is over 6 months old so it is probably time to do it again for anyone that wasn't paying attention then. To save myself the typing here are some links to previous conversations.
Puppy's Website: Discussion
creators / maintainers / updaters of Pup packages?
Design Of Distributed Repository Backend The design is probably too complicated to implement in one hit, major priority IMHO is digitally signed packages and a package manager that understands how to check them. If you have this then you also have a UID for the package from the signature and can quite happily tell anybody to download anything from anywhere as long as they trust the person that signed it.

Establishing a formal community a very long thread with some relevance

Puppy Website: Package Lists a big list of puppy sites

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J-Bob


Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 283
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu 04 Dec 2008, 07:23    Post subject:  

HairyWill wrote:
the idea of a registry of software is great

My last rant on distributing unsigned binaries is over 6 months old so it is probably time to do it again for anyone that wasn't paying attention then. To save myself the typing here are some links to previous conversations.
Puppy's Website: Discussion
creators / maintainers / updaters of Pup packages?
Design Of Distributed Repository Backend The design is probably too complicated to implement in one hit, major priority IMHO is digitally signed packages and a package manager that understands how to check them. If you have this then you also have a UID for the package from the signature and can quite happily tell anybody to download anything from anywhere as long as they trust the person that signed it.

Establishing a formal community a very long thread with some relevance

Puppy Website: Package Lists a big list of puppy sites


that sounds like a good idea to work with. we could use either the md5sum of a package as it's tracker, or we could load a text file into the main directory for a package, which we could call "pack-id" which would contain an identification code, which could be used... well, i think we could use it to search for packages, but for my skills, this would require downloading the whole package and getting the code out of it.

that's why i think that perhaps having an id code in a link file might be a good idea. and build a program which reads all of the package linking files and splits them into separate categories, such as the ones used in the puppy menu system.

But we will eventually figure out what should be used as the package linking system for the package manager, and the id inside a package could be used to mark a link as "installed" if a person did install it manually.

- J-Bob

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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2946
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Thu 04 Dec 2008, 09:03    Post subject:  

Some more reading

Strong Distribution - Protection In The Wild

Not hard to do
Generating a key pair
Generating a signature


http://www.gnupg.org/download/

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