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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Puppy Power
Puppy 4.2
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big_bass

Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 1747

PostPosted: Sun 14 Sep 2008, 21:32    Post subject: a point to ponder  

"Ever since the resignation of Gentoo's founder and benevolent dictator from the project in 2004, the newly established Gentoo Foundation has been battling with lack of clear directions and frequent developer conflicts, which resulted in several high-profile departures of well-known Gentoo personalities. It remains to be seen whether Gentoo can regain its innovative qualities of the past or whether it will slowly disintegrate into a loose collection of personal sub-projects lacking clearly-defined goals."

the above quote was taken directly from Distro Watch


if we replace the word gentoo for puppy how does it read
will history repeat itself .

A very important point to ponder

I personally dont want that to happen
and I built my own derivatives from unleashed every pup since 2.13 through 3.01 *including retros * that I can easily update I did think about this a long time ago
and prepared for it
my positive actions in the puppy community reflect that
I will survive and I have many real plans that are in progress

on the "list" or off the list
I fight the good fight and press forward

I am also working with "amigo" an above developer
and I know good results will follow

P.S My thanks to the many multi-talented people in Puppy
that you cant fit into a box


big_bass -----> The fat free series
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tronkel


Joined: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 1097
Location: Vienna Austria

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 02:55    Post subject:  

@big_bass

I am wondering about that as well. Such a scenario could happen with Puppy and would be bad news.

The number of OS versions that actually function out-of-the-box with any given hardware combination seems to be decreasing. This applies to both Linux and Windows. I know, because I have tested most of the important ones.

One thing that testing has thrown up, is that Puppy - alongside Debian and Ubuntu - virtually always works, at least on the hardware selection I have available here. The rest are distinctly problematical.

This makes Puppy an important tool for me - and most likely many others as well

It is therefore important to ensure that the Puppy Project survives in such a fashion that its hardware functionality stays up-to-date and continues to be innovative as well. It will take a lot of doing to ensure this. Where will all of the necessary expertise come from? There are good competent people in the community, but Puppy is not covered for everything unfortunately. It was Barry who did most of the real implementation and innovation. If he is no longer available to the necessary extent, I fear the project will suffer.

Action needs to be taken now to find a replacement(s) from elsewhere if necessary, to ensure that Puppy does not do a Gentoo. Should we even consider working together with Gentoo as a self-help project?. Two heads are better than one. Both projects might survive better if they collaborate. Gentoo is built from source - something that would certainly help Puppy development as well, since Puppy is basically built from source as well via T2.

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
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PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 03:23    Post subject:  

jebaJQ8 is the name of the graphic artist - I could not remember

I have asked him and rastapix for logos
meanwhile . . .



Also darrelljon can you tell us where and how you are doing the documentation?

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jpeps

Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 3219

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 03:47    Post subject:  

zigbert wrote:
Puppy target list


- ...
7. What apps are we not pleased with.
- Fotoxx can't start slideshow from commandline.
- Gxine using fullscreen does sometimes give trouble.
-
Sigmund


I use gxine all the time with dingo, and never had a crash. I'm not sure if the problem occurred in previous versions due to dependencies, or specific video driver issues.
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darrelljon


Joined: 08 Apr 2007
Posts: 545

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 05:00    Post subject:  

Lobster wrote:
Also darrelljon can you tell us where and how you are doing the documentation?
I have been looking at the existing documentation which consists of a PDF download of a manual (one each for versions 2, 3 and 4) and the wiki which has a lot of incomplete content and is under the Creative Commons license (rather than say the GFDL). I also don't like the layout particularly for the puplets directory. I looked at the Mandriva Wiki and its looks a lot better. I would also like for Puppy documentation to be on general manual/how-to websites so people who haven't encountered Puppy or are casual users might contribute without having to register for a separate username and password.
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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2949
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 06:56    Post subject:  

darrelljon wrote:
I looked at the Mandriva Wiki and its looks a lot better. I would also like for Puppy documentation to be on general manual/how-to websites so people who haven't encountered Puppy or are casual users might contribute without having to register for a separate username and password.
Which particular aspects of the mandriva wiki do you particularly like. From a cursory glance I agree that it seems very welll organised.
I don't really understand why casual users would particularly want to contribute to the manual. Registering on puppylinux.org isn't hard and would seem sensible if you are serious about using puppy. There are many maal editors on the site and all regisered users can add comments to the manual pages for the editors to take action on.

I'm with pizzasgood and lobster on making small incremental changes and on rotating the "coordinator" or release engineer. I too am unwilling to commit to doing assigned tasks in a fixed timeframe. Many of us have formed small partnerships of people that we work well with on different projects. Bringing these different partneships to the front in different released may help to ensure that different releases bring improvements in different areas. ie
release 1 has a focus on multimedia
release 2 a new kernel
release 3 graphics and themeing
release 4 event handling
release 5 purely bug fixing
....by choosing a short fixed schedule
each leader has an oportunity to add a small number of features and benefits. A small number of features reduces the numer of intodued bugs. If they fail, stall or procrastinate they don't block puppy as a whole, they don't force some sort of leadership challege or forking the next cycle just moves on.
Another benefit to a short time scale is it is easier to commit for that period. For example I could probably get away with coordinating a release for 6 weeks without sacrificing my studies or risking divorce any long than that and puppy starts getting in the way of real life.

So ttuuxxx I would be happy to fully support you as coordinator for the 4.2 release on the understanding that the target time is 6-8 weeks, the number of changes will be focussed, limited, identified in advance (do one thing well) and that you step down afterwards and allow someone else to run the next release.

I would love to see both pizzasgood and dougal run releases as they too have released quality puplets in the past and have a very lng history of contributing to puppy. I wonder if Nathan F would like to have a crack too I don't know how much time grafpup takes these days.

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alienjeff


Joined: 08 Jul 2006
Posts: 2290
Location: Winsted, CT - USA

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 07:55    Post subject:  

ttuuxxx wrote:
I would like to keep coordinating future versions. I do find it a bit odd to get everything working/up and running and then just say see ya, better luck to next guy trying to work it out, and then they have to start all over again. Like make contact with the developers etc, find how things are done, who does what, who wants to do what, whats left to fix from the last release etc. I bet the developers will say after the 4th or 5th person, ohhh nooo, not another "Hi my name is so and so,I'm the new coordinator what do you do for puppy?"
I personally think changing hands all the time would just waste a lot of time and repeat a lot of task and stop the streamline of future releases.


HairyWill wrote:
So ttuuxxx I would be happy to fully support you as coordinator for the 4.2 release on the understanding that the target time is 6-8 weeks, the number of changes will be focussed, limited, identified in advance (do one thing well) and that you step down afterwards and allow someone else to run the next release.


Something tells me the return volley may very well be an all-time classic ...

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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 07:59    Post subject:  

[quote="HairyWill"]
darrelljon wrote:
.

So ttuuxxx I would be happy to fully support you as coordinator for the 4.2 release on the understanding that the target time is 6-8 weeks, the number of changes will be focussed, limited, identified in advance (do one thing well) and that you step down afterwards and allow someone else to run the next release.
.


Well thanks for the support, I think, Its like your letting me in the door but can't wait to see me leave,LOL Just consider me as your in-laws visiting you, LOL
Seriously now I'll step down but really I would like to stay, If nobody at the time wants to take a shot at it or I might just let the developers take a vote on it, Heck who knows I might do a excellent job and they might just want to keep me around. I'm only around as long as I'm needed or wanted. As for your other points they are well taken, but I think Its time to Start on it and I'll toss some Ideas to the developers and let them vote on it as a community. First Line of business is starting a new thread.
ttuuxxx

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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2949
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Mon 15 Sep 2008, 08:53    Post subject:  

ttuuxxx wrote:
I might just let the developers take a vote on it
emphasis is mine, they might just vote without you letting them.

I'm just yanking your chain and reading my earlier post it comes across as a little harsh, its not like you need my support but I look forward to collaborating further with you.

I'm not sure how many people actually do development work towards a specific release Barry's management style generally precluded that approach. The other hurdle is that it is hard to commit to an application being included until after the application is written.

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raffy

Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 4752
Location: Manila

PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 00:09    Post subject: pupweb.org and 2.xx development  

About the old site being useful:

1. No, they would not allow ssh access and that rules out the use of GIT in that site;

2. The old wiki is still there and people can put it to however it suits their needs: pupweb.org/wikka

I've been into minimalist systems and would likely continue work in pre-3.xx development, the way big_bass and amigo are working. If I remember right, this was one development direction led by economoney, but he's been silent for sometime.

Net-booting is a feature of the 2.16 release (that is valid with versions 2.13-2.16), so I hope that this part of development continues. Dougal and pakt have also worked in this area (in the development of 2.14R).

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 00:50    Post subject:  

Quote:
Its like your letting me in the door


Very Happy

3.03 is your chance to show that 4.2 is possible.
The 3 series is a Slackware compatible Puppy community edition.

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=224927#224927

Here is how the project started over a year ago:
http://puppylinux.org/community/puppy-ce/talking-stick/contributors

Are you able to finish the project? Tronkel I know is busy with work.

That door is still open Smile

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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2949
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 05:27    Post subject:  

I still don't really understand the model under which puppy linux will work after barry stops releasing.
The name Puppy Linux is Barry's. Either he gives it explicity to someone else (person or legal entity) or it makes no sense to use it. You can't have an official puppy linux without Barry's consent otherwise we could all fork and release our own official versions.

I was on holiday 2 months ago when this all kicked off. Weren't there a couple of people that put their names forward then? How did that end up? What was Barry's reaction?

As for an improvement, I would like to see the xorgwizard automated. At the very least there should be a timeout option that will boot straight to a default resolution.
Code:

Display Setup
1. 1024x768 XVesa (default)
2. run xorgwizard to choose a resolution
You have 60 seconds to choose an option:
by doing that and remastering with an appropriate pkeys parameter the boot can become automatic.
Whilst we are at it there might as well be an option at boot to turn on automatic wired dhcp networking.

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big_bass

Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 1747

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 10:04    Post subject:  

hey all
and I do mean all
those that posted and those that will post


after quite a pause
I chose to post here again but choose to measure my words with care

1.) being herded is for cows * I hope someone else can spell that out clearer
I wont bog down any of my CPU cycles if you dont get it

2.) people that share interests form friends ,and many friends form groups
at no time are they ever forced to be led and they enjoy because they share something key word --share

3.) I always reserve a place in my mind to interested by a good Idea from someone else

4.) you can never have too many friends the good the bad and the ugly Laughing

everyone gets a piece of the puzzle
what makes life interesting is who has the next piece you need

big_bass

Last edited by big_bass on Fri 19 Sep 2008, 11:44; edited 1 time in total
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jebaJQ8


Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 28
Location: Okinawa, Japan

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 12:51    Post subject: What I can do  

Quote:
jebaJQ8 is the name of the graphic artist - I could not remember

I have asked him and rastapix for logos


Lobster,

I made two kinds of logos.
"lite" and "h2g2".
Both are made easily.
Copyleft(means free)all.







jebaJQ8
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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
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PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 13:59    Post subject:  

Thanks jebaJQ8

You are a star . . .

Placed them here Smile
http://tmxxine.com/wik/wikka.php?wakka=PuppyCommunity

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