Pup214R v1.00 - Puppy Linux 2.14 Revisited, is now available

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prehistoric
Posts: 1744
Joined: Tue 23 Oct 2007, 17:34

more frugal install trouble

#31 Post by prehistoric »

Just got 2.14R installed and booting on an old box (Compaq Deskpro 6350, 350 MHz PII w/ 320 MB.). Several recent Puppies didn't finish booting because of trouble with the old IDE CDROM. Two other distros worked: DSL 4.0, TinyFlux 1.0. With a full install of the latter to the hard drive, tried to do a frugal install to a puppy214 directory. The result was something I wouldn't have predicted: puppy214 was made a subdirectory of /boot/grub in hda1, with vmlinuz and initrd.gz inside. I have no idea what happened to zdrv_214R.sfs and pup_214R.sfs. I ended up copying them from the CD manually and put everything in a top level directory (psubdir=puppy214).
There were errors in the text displayed for the menu.lst entry. ex: one place had (hd,0) instead of (hd0,0)

I rewrote the menu entry as

Code: Select all

title = Puppy 214R (frugal) on hda1
rootnoverify (hd0,0)
kernel /puppy214/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 PMEDIA=idehd psubdir=puppy214
initrd /puppy214/initrd.gz
The first time I booted through the grub menu on the hard disk the default location for the pup_save.2fs file was the base of the file system. I booted another system and moved this into /puppy214, after that it booted and saved as expected.

This is a great little system for old machines, and hotpuppy is habit forming. Fix the frugal install and it will go far.

prehistoric

twointo1
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed 09 May 2007, 02:07

#32 Post by twointo1 »

tempestuous-

Thanks for your reply on the zd1211rw driver. While it may be unreliable, it worked flawlessly in the puppy versions I've been using 2.15 through 3.0

I'm using the Airlink 3055 usb adapter and it is simply not recognized in this version. I really wanted to use this version because everything else seems to just work.

Unless someone can provide a pet that will allow my adapter to function, I will miss this version.

Thanks for your time and if there is something I can do (I'm not a programmer, just a happy puppy user), I would like to have someone's help.

I'm sure that going forward, others will have this same issue.

twointo1

tempestuous
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Joined: Fri 10 Jun 2005, 05:12
Location: Australia

#33 Post by tempestuous »

I can't find any reference to Airlink 3055. Do you maybe have the Airlink AWLL3025?

Well it's a very simple process to copy over the zd1211rw module plus firmware from Puppy 2.14 (or from 2.12/2.13/2.15CE/2.16)
... but before you do that, why not try the existing driver? Do this

Code: Select all

modprobe zd1211
EDIT: wrong module. It should be zd1211b.

now run this command to see if a new network interface has been created -

Code: Select all

ifconfig -a
If a network interface has been created, just go ahead and use the Network Wizard.

If no success, it would be worth knowing exactly which device you have. Please post the results of this command

Code: Select all

cat /proc/bus/usb/devices
Last edited by tempestuous on Tue 04 Dec 2007, 19:33, edited 1 time in total.

Sage
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Location: GB

#34 Post by Sage »

Sad to report real problems with FULL install. LiveCD is OK. First issue occurred when PUI tried to install GRUB. Only one choice to root??fs was offered, claiming it was 'usual' - well it isn't and it didn't work, so I used the independent GRUB installer from 3.01 into MBR and that worked. Both XVESA and Xorg caused problems I've never seen before with any version/any distro, various instabilities, black screens. Managed to find a winning combination only to find that the NIC drivers were missing, as happened with 4.0alpha. Copied the entire lib/modules file from 3.01 and that worked OK. There seem to be lots of other issues which need systematising before they merit description.
Later.

twointo1
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed 09 May 2007, 02:07

#35 Post by twointo1 »

tempestuous-

Tried to modprobe zd1211 and got: FATAL no module found

I have a Airlink101 AWLL3055 id 0ace:1215 just to give you the full information.

I added a folder /lib/firmware/zd1211 and added the firmware. It still doesn't work. I don't think that there is a zd1211.ko in the kernel - could be wrong.

Thanks again

twointo1

tempestuous
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Location: Australia

#36 Post by tempestuous »

Sage wrote:Managed to find a winning combination only to find that the NIC drivers were missing
This has been an ongoing problem with full HD installs using ALL versions of Puppy Linux, which I reported as a separate post here -
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=22471
Sage wrote:Copied the entire lib/modules file from 3.01 and that worked OK
Surely it would have been more logical to copy across the modules from ver 2.12-2.16, given that 3.01 has a completely different kernel ...
or uncompress the 2.14R zdrv file as I suggested in that other post.

tempestuous
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Location: Australia

#37 Post by tempestuous »

twointo1 wrote:I have a Airlink101 AWLL3055 id 0ace:1215
OK, that's important, it indicates that you have the ZD1211B chipset so the compatible wifi module is zd1211b, not zd1211.
twointo1 wrote:FATAL no module found
This demonstrates that your installation is failing to access the zdrv file, which has been an ongoing and annoying problem with certain Puppy installations, which almost no one on this forum will acknowledge. The common answer to this type of problem is: if the zdrv file is "in the correct location" Puppy will find it. If you can work out where the "correct location" is, then your problem will most likely be solved.
Otherwise, the workaround is to explicitly install just the necessary module, which in your case is zd1211+b-r85-k2.6.18.1.pet from
http://dotpups.de/dotpups/Wifi/drivers- ... 2-to-2.14/

I caution that for WEP or WPA encryption, some additional encryption modules will be required, so the inaccessible zdrv file will continue to be a problem for you.

Sage
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Location: GB

#38 Post by Sage »

You credit me with skills I don't possess - whatever works, comes to hand, my friend! But I take issue with "...ongoing problem with full HD installs using ALL versions..." Not for me - only 4.0alpha, which was reported promptly. But I usually steer well clear of CE editions. All collaboration is fraught unless there can be frequent personal face-to-face contact between the parties, especially the principal researcher. That's been my long experience. Sometimes difficult to justify in writing in grant proposals for the attendance at foreign conferences! Much less that the most important interactions occur in the bar....
But it just happens to be TRUE.

Leon
Posts: 265
Joined: Wed 22 Jun 2005, 21:33

#39 Post by Leon »

1.) I manually installed 214R v1.00 using frugal install. As another forum user named 'fudgy' mentioned the file searching code at startup works surprisingly fast.

The step of booting process between this two boot messages:

'Looking for Puppy in hda1... hda2... hda5... hda6... hda7... hda8...'

and

'Using personal data file /p214r1/pup_save.2fs which is on partition hda5'

takes less then 1 second. When booting to Puppy 3.01 or 3.92 from the same kind of frugal install it takes about 15 seconds or more.

2.) I really like the option to mount and to unmount partitions from Rox. This is very nice improvement.

3.) The Xorg Wizard from Puppy 214R v1.00 solved the problem with missing resolutions in display resolution list. Thanks for your efforts to fixing it.

We discussed the problem at:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 35&t=15382
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 886#110886
Last edited by Leon on Tue 04 Dec 2007, 09:49, edited 5 times in total.

tempestuous
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#40 Post by tempestuous »

Let me clarify a very important point: the ongoing problem I was referrring to does not relate to Sage's particular LAN driver, nor any other specific driver which may have been automatically detected and installed at first boot up. I'm referring to the fact that full HD installs do not uncompress and copy into place the full collection of modules. This is well-known, and acknowledged by Barry in the earlier post I mentioned.
The outcome is that full HD installations should work fine ... until users try to add a new device at a later stage! Any modules not already present in the installed filesystem must be accessed from the Puppy zdrv file, and due to a quirk in the way that full HD installs work compared to frugal installs, the zdrv file is not automatically mounted as a squash filesystem, and the contents are thus unavailable.

As to the meandering comments about distant collaboration, I leave response to pakt and Dougal.
It seems that pakt and Dougal's contribution, like many other forms of positive contribution on this forum, are subjected to disdain.

Leon
Posts: 265
Joined: Wed 22 Jun 2005, 21:33

Re: can't get frugal to boot ?!

#41 Post by Leon »

fudgy wrote:Thanks for these improvements! I awaited them for so long ...
It boots as expected from CD, however, I can't get frugal to work ?!
rc.sysinit never gets executed; after the union thing, it said:
[...]
busybox v 1.6.1 [...]
usage: init
init is the parent of all processes. - and then nothing else happens.

Here is what I did:
- copied all files from the ISO image to /mnt/home/pup214R/
- booted with grub:
kernel (hd0,1)/pup214R/vmlinuz pmedia=idehd pdev1=hda2 psubdir=pup214R
initrd (hd0,1)/pup214R/initrd.gz

I also tried a variety of disk locations for the files but the union thing seems to happen ok anyway.

Any help appreciated!
This settings from my menu.lst work for me:

# Boot Puppy Linux 2.14.r1
title Puppy-2.14.r1, /dev/ram0, idehd, /p2141r1
rootnoverify (hd0,4)
kernel /p214r1/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 PMEDIA=idehd psubdir=p214r1
initrd /p214r1/initrd.gz
boot

All files from the ISO image are located in /mnt/home/p2141r1 directory on hda5 partition.

raffy
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Joined: Wed 25 May 2005, 12:20
Location: Manila

lost zdrv; un-face-to-face

#42 Post by raffy »

your installation is failing to access the zdrv file, which has been an ongoing and annoying problem with certain Puppy installations
- the full install problem is just logical, as it uses uncompressed files (and zdrv IS still a compressed file). IMHO, full install is useful for developers who know what they are doing (and not for me). :D BTW, is it correct to say that zdrv got used only beginning with version 2.13?
- yes, one example is in doing frugal install of 2.16.1: I recall that it will try to find Puppy files only from the partition where it saw the kernel and initrd.gz.
It seems that pakt and Dougal's contribution, like many other forms of positive contribution on this forum, are subjected to disdain.
- I would connect Sage's comments to the fact that certain quick correction/advise would pass unnoticed in a face-to-face situation but would be embarrassing in a forum. This is something that we have to live with. To achieve a win-win situation, we need a high level of trust in each other. :)
Puppy user since Oct 2004. Want FreeOffice? [url=http://puppylinux.info/topic/freeoffice-2012-sfs]Get the sfs (English only)[/url].

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pakt
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"Hotfix" to fix problem with some modules not loading

#43 Post by pakt »

I have discovered a bug in Pup214R-1.00 that keeps certain modules (like zd1211) from loading properly. Tempestuous has kindly provided a dotpet that will correct this bug.

For this dotpet to work, you must use a pup save file. Install the dotpet by clicking on it and following the instructions.

Reboot Pup214R, then modprobe the module and it should install this time (if it hasn't been installed automatically after rebooting).

Download the "hotfix" dotpet here:
http://www.puppylinux.ca/puppyfiles/Pup ... es-fix.pet
Methinks Raspberry Pi were ideal for runnin' Puppy Linux

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Dougal
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#44 Post by Dougal »

gw wrote:HotPup is a great tool.
I have tried it on puppy 2.17.1 and it runs fine.
On Puppy 3.01 it does not run by me.
Do you know why?
No, sorry. I don't have Puppy3, so I don't know exactly what has changed in it.
What's the ugliest part of your body?
Some say your nose
Some say your toes
But I think it's your mind

Sage
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#45 Post by Sage »

No-one has greater respect for the talents of young Dougal and pakt. However, - don't you just love those 'however' s - it really isn't acceptable to say 'you have to do this and have to do that' in order to get very basic stuff working. Don't get me wrong - everyone appreciates the efforts you guys make. If you are determined to release stuff frequently, then it needs decimal increment releases to follow in quick succession as glitches arise - the whole caboodle re-uploaded, the old version taken down. In the alternative, keep developments amongst a small coterie of friends until just about every aspect has been tested, every bug fixed, even if this takes years. These kinds of strategies will avoid disappointment or worse from your adoring acolytes.

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Dougal
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#46 Post by Dougal »

tempestuous wrote:As to the meandering comments about distant collaboration, I leave response to pakt and Dougal.
The way I understood his comment is that the only reason he's actually trying it is because he knows me and that he can turn to me with bugs (same with Barry), whereas he never uses CE versions, since there's no specific person to turn to...
What's the ugliest part of your body?
Some say your nose
Some say your toes
But I think it's your mind

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Dougal
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#47 Post by Dougal »

Here's an updated installer.

I've (hopefully) fixed the problems with frugal installs.
I've implemented the copying of the contents of the zdrv onto the HD with a full install (I never heard of this problem before...).
What's the ugliest part of your body?
Some say your nose
Some say your toes
But I think it's your mind

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Dougal
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Re: can't get frugal to boot ?!

#48 Post by Dougal »

fudgy wrote:It boots as expected from CD, however, I can't get frugal to work ?!
rc.sysinit never gets executed; after the union thing, it said:
[...]
busybox v 1.6.1 [...]
usage: init
init is the parent of all processes. - and then nothing else happens.
Try the updated installer.

Note to everybody: if you have a problem booting, you should try booting with "pfix=debug" which will give you detailed output that can help me find out what the problem is.
What's the ugliest part of your body?
Some say your nose
Some say your toes
But I think it's your mind

swarnick
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Joined: Tue 26 Dec 2006, 03:21

Loading kernel modules hang

#49 Post by swarnick »

(I had trouble getting this to post. If it comes up twice I will try to delete the extra copy.)

I have two machines which won't boot any version earlier than 2.17. Actually that isn't quite true. They hang most of the time but if I turn them off and wait awhile sometimes they will boot up. They hang at "loading kernel modules". This problem has ruled out 2.14R for me. (It also rules out a personal favorite of mine, PuppyPro.)

I would like to help with fixing this but I'm not quite sure where to start. The first step would be to see what got improved in 2.17 to lower memory usage and let the modules load. The second step would be to gather info on CPU type, IDE disk type, memory size, etc. which I will do before posting again.

Vis a vis releasing: Point revisions are a good idea. Taking down the old iso isn't required as many people might not need a given fix. Waiting until everything is perfect to release is not an option as many subtle bugs will not emerge even during thorough testing. They depend on hardware/software combinations not available in the lab or on a pattern of use the testers didn't anticipate. When releasing to real users every development team must try to find the sweet spot: good enough for the vast majority of users but with niggles for obscure hardware or unanticipated usage patterns. Reaching perfection in any release of any product is an iterative process.

Finally, I can appreciate good work without being an acolyte, especially if that good work is done by volunteers.

Sage
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#50 Post by Sage »

Taking down the old iso isn't required as many people might not need a given fix.
Curious statement? Removing old saves server space. It would hardly be anticipated that the update would fail to do things the old one did?!

Otherwise my salt has been pinched.....

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