The swap partition I created only has 200M, would this have anything to do with it?
Also, does anybody have a link to the manual for v14?
Old computer received free, won't boot Puppy CD (Solved)
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Bruce B
I really think 200 mb is sufficent.
It is however possible that the swap partition is not being used.
In order to tell type the free command and read the output.
In order to be more specific, I think what I (we) would like to know the following:
How much RAM do you have?
What kind of Processor to you have? Especially the speed.
Is it true that you have only one hard drive and it is 10GB
What is the entire partitioning scheme?
What other operating systems are you running if any?
If you don't know how to answer these questions, just say so and somebody will tell you.
It is however possible that the swap partition is not being used.
In order to tell type the free command and read the output.
In order to be more specific, I think what I (we) would like to know the following:
How much RAM do you have?
What kind of Processor to you have? Especially the speed.
Is it true that you have only one hard drive and it is 10GB
What is the entire partitioning scheme?
What other operating systems are you running if any?
If you don't know how to answer these questions, just say so and somebody will tell you.
I did the xproc query and found the following:
The machine has a pentium III processor, it had 725.000 after it and I guess this is the speed in Mhz
There is 125000kb total RAM.
I created two other partitions besides the swap, both 5GB.
And there is no other OS installed other than puppy.
My query is: why is puppy running so slowly, it takes 3 minutes + to load any webpage on seamonkey?
And also, why aren't my configs being saved on shutdown? Every time I boot up I have to re-enter the keyboard, xorg/xvesa, screen resolution configurations which means bootup is taking an age.
The machine has a pentium III processor, it had 725.000 after it and I guess this is the speed in Mhz
There is 125000kb total RAM.
I created two other partitions besides the swap, both 5GB.
And there is no other OS installed other than puppy.
My query is: why is puppy running so slowly, it takes 3 minutes + to load any webpage on seamonkey?
And also, why aren't my configs being saved on shutdown? Every time I boot up I have to re-enter the keyboard, xorg/xvesa, screen resolution configurations which means bootup is taking an age.
You have 125 MB of RAM, which should be enough to run basic Puppy (Puppy without a large application such as OpenOffice for instance) entirely from RAM.
Your problem with webpages loading slowly may have nothing to do with Puppy itself, but rather its connection to the internet. When you first start SeaMonkey, does it seem to take a long time?
You created two partitions besides the swap partition. How did you format those two partitions? (ext2, ext3, FAT32, NTFS, etc.) If you did not format the partitions with a filesystem, Puppy can't use them.
Your problem with webpages loading slowly may have nothing to do with Puppy itself, but rather its connection to the internet. When you first start SeaMonkey, does it seem to take a long time?
You created two partitions besides the swap partition. How did you format those two partitions? (ext2, ext3, FAT32, NTFS, etc.) If you did not format the partitions with a filesystem, Puppy can't use them.
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Bruce B
I don't know why the pupfile is not being saved.stiginge wrote:I did the xproc query and found the following:
The machine has a pentium III processor, it had 725.000 after it and I guess this is the speed in Mhz
There is 125000kb total RAM.
I created two other partitions besides the swap, both 5GB.
And there is no other OS installed other than puppy.
My query is: why is puppy running so slowly, it takes 3 minutes + to load any webpage on seamonkey?
And also, why aren't my configs being saved on shutdown? Every time I boot up I have to re-enter the keyboard, xorg/xvesa, screen resolution configurations which means bootup is taking an age.
Your RAM is marginal and if you did an option 2 install, you'd have more free RAM to work with and no pupfile to save, because option 2 doesn't use a pupfile.
This thread is a classic demonstration of how not to help/be helped. A bunch of people have tried to help stiginge, but information about his system have had to be dragged out of him!
Notwithstanding, it looks as if we may finally have a clue about his problems. It is not possible to fit a strip of 125Mb main memory - it doesn't exist. Presuming that this is NOT a typo, it suggests that he has onboard video - a veritable recipe for disaster. There are two ways to deal with this: switch it OFF in BIOS and fit a real video card, or, especially appropriate for very old and troublesome proprietary boards, look up the pin-outs for the graphics chip via Google and slip a scalpel under the Vcc pin to permanently disable the onboard graphics!
If stiginge just has a typo and his mem. is really 128Mb, then, as Bruce suggests this is close to the functional minimum for recent Puppy versions. There are two easy ways to deal with this situation: add another strip of mem. (my recent tests suggest an old 32Mb strip will suffice - I have plenty of spares of this value) or use an older Puppy version (I completely agree with many folk who have recently pointed v1.0.8rc1 as one the most reliable, stable and predictable issues that Barry has ever created).
A propos many previous discussions on the subject, my investigations with this distro indicate that a swap file of 200Mb is too big; 128Mb would suffice, although, as indicated above, it may not be accessed at all if there is enough main memory.
Again, I completely concur with Bruce that for regular desktop applications, a full install is to be preferred every time despite what you read in some quarters. LiveCD, USB, flashCF and frugal installs are only appropriate in special circumstances. Apart from being very clever use of the technology, it is my experience that most folks would NOT be best advised to adopt these methods once they have decided on using Puppy, and provided they can amass junked hard drives from roadside skips, etc. [Anyone who is really, utterly desperate for onesuch can try asking me!]
Notwithstanding, it looks as if we may finally have a clue about his problems. It is not possible to fit a strip of 125Mb main memory - it doesn't exist. Presuming that this is NOT a typo, it suggests that he has onboard video - a veritable recipe for disaster. There are two ways to deal with this: switch it OFF in BIOS and fit a real video card, or, especially appropriate for very old and troublesome proprietary boards, look up the pin-outs for the graphics chip via Google and slip a scalpel under the Vcc pin to permanently disable the onboard graphics!
If stiginge just has a typo and his mem. is really 128Mb, then, as Bruce suggests this is close to the functional minimum for recent Puppy versions. There are two easy ways to deal with this situation: add another strip of mem. (my recent tests suggest an old 32Mb strip will suffice - I have plenty of spares of this value) or use an older Puppy version (I completely agree with many folk who have recently pointed v1.0.8rc1 as one the most reliable, stable and predictable issues that Barry has ever created).
A propos many previous discussions on the subject, my investigations with this distro indicate that a swap file of 200Mb is too big; 128Mb would suffice, although, as indicated above, it may not be accessed at all if there is enough main memory.
Again, I completely concur with Bruce that for regular desktop applications, a full install is to be preferred every time despite what you read in some quarters. LiveCD, USB, flashCF and frugal installs are only appropriate in special circumstances. Apart from being very clever use of the technology, it is my experience that most folks would NOT be best advised to adopt these methods once they have decided on using Puppy, and provided they can amass junked hard drives from roadside skips, etc. [Anyone who is really, utterly desperate for onesuch can try asking me!]
Last edited by Sage on Thu 29 Mar 2007, 08:41, edited 1 time in total.
The blind being lead by the partially sighted. I think everybody here is working to the best of their ability and as always all support comes with a money back guarantee. I agree it would have made more sense to ask about the machine specs. earlier.
Sage, I didn't know that about the onboard graphics card. Looks like an issue that needs to be addressed
@Stiginge
Sorry, I forgot to tell you to format the new partition. From the command window, assuming the first partition you created was type ext2, I think the command is
Sage, I didn't know that about the onboard graphics card. Looks like an issue that needs to be addressed
@Stiginge
Sorry, I forgot to tell you to format the new partition. From the command window, assuming the first partition you created was type ext2, I think the command is
Code: Select all
mke2fs /dev/hda1I'm interested to know why? I presume you've explained this before, would you be able to point me at a justification.Sage wrote:I completely concur with Bruce that for regular desktop applications, a full install is to be preferred every time despite what you read in some quarters. LiveCD, USB and frugal installs are only appropriate in special circumstances.
Will
contribute: [url=http://www.puppylinux.org]community website[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6c3nm6]screenshots[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6j2gbz]puplets[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/57gykn]wiki[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/5dgr83]rss[/url]
contribute: [url=http://www.puppylinux.org]community website[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6c3nm6]screenshots[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6j2gbz]puplets[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/57gykn]wiki[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/5dgr83]rss[/url]
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veronicathecow
- Posts: 559
- Joined: Sat 21 Oct 2006, 09:41
Smartmon, on my dotpups page: http://puppylinux.org/wikka/DotPupsSMART HDD and does anyone know of a program for Linux to read that data
HW: The discussion about types of install is liberally dissipated throughout countless threads this last few years, but I was simply relying on the item espoused by Bruce, vide supra, in this case.
You are completely correct in advising formatting to ext2 prior to using the Universal installer. This wasn't essential in version 1, but for reasons I don't understand, Barry hasn't incorporated this operation in version 2.
Otherwise, I agree - folks responding to st in this thread have been far too generous with their help!!
Again, as I've said so many times, failing to disclose WHERE you live is tantamount to shooting oneself in the foot. I have tried to get John to insist on this field being completed (as per most other boards) but he doesn't wish to do that. st could've received so much more help and much earlier had he taken this elementary step.
You are completely correct in advising formatting to ext2 prior to using the Universal installer. This wasn't essential in version 1, but for reasons I don't understand, Barry hasn't incorporated this operation in version 2.
Otherwise, I agree - folks responding to st in this thread have been far too generous with their help!!
Again, as I've said so many times, failing to disclose WHERE you live is tantamount to shooting oneself in the foot. I have tried to get John to insist on this field being completed (as per most other boards) but he doesn't wish to do that. st could've received so much more help and much earlier had he taken this elementary step.
That wasn't what I meant. My understanding is that stiginge is doing the best that he/she can with limited understanding. I am happy to help further.Sage wrote:Otherwise, I agree - folks responding to st in this thread have been far too generous with their help!!
But Bruce is only recommending full install because of the low RAM. I can't really think of any other situations where a full install carries significant benefits. I am sure there are some, I'd be very interested to know what they are.Sage wrote:I was simply relying on the item espoused by Bruce
Will
contribute: [url=http://www.puppylinux.org]community website[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6c3nm6]screenshots[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6j2gbz]puplets[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/57gykn]wiki[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/5dgr83]rss[/url]
contribute: [url=http://www.puppylinux.org]community website[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6c3nm6]screenshots[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6j2gbz]puplets[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/57gykn]wiki[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/5dgr83]rss[/url]
Who ever st might be, and whatever his knowledge and experience, it should have been evident much earlier to him that respondents were struggling to help him with severely limited information about his freebie. I think this is important, because others will be along frequently with similar questions. Of course we are going to help!!!
Coders of distros have traditionally suffered a severe blind spot wrt putative users. Many are just ivory tower academics talking to their mates about aspects of coding that Joe Average will never comprehend (cf Gentoo - the biggest in-joke amongst that community). Whereas, the most likely scenario is that the great unwashed masses, like st and me, will finally throw up their hands and proclaim that they've had it with Mr Gates, his rotten OS and his criminal business practices. In the first instances, they are most likely to try a Linux distro on something they 'dragged out from under the bed' or discovered in a roadside skip, rather than their shiny, but overpriced and horrendously overperforming PC-of-their-dreams. Klaus K was the first to recognise this reality and Barry originally had similar aspirations.
I am hoping that st isn't going to turn out to be a guy who is afraid to remove the two (four?) screws that give him access to his machine and read the labels on the stuff he's acquired. And use Google to discover some of the inner secrets of what's installed? [Whenever folks pass on their old junk to me, it's in pieces almost as soon as it crosses the threshold!] Incidentally, st, if you haven't washed out the innards with a pressure hose yet (or if you live in the US, with one of those useful sink-top spray units), then it's already too long gone. Don't forget to dry it in the sun if you live in Morocco or on the central heating boiler if you live in Norway.
As for the discussions about installation types and distro deployment, it mainly reduces to arguments about whether to retain the files in a compressed format or decompress them to a type2/full HD install. There are issues of resource overheads relating to memory size (and speed, I suppose on really old kit using 30pin stuff?!), cpu rating, and- critically- HD size, access time (the ultimate limitation amongst nearly all sub-systems) and availability. Add to this the nature and location of stored personal data files and d/l s, and other user specific aspects and you can see that the proverbial can o' worms soon emerges.
As I said somewhere else, there is no longer a shortage of old HD s (anyone will donate a 2Gb drive in exchange for a pint of 6X) suitable for storing compact distros, so a complete solution for those who enjoy dabbling with distro diarrhea is to use a caddy system. Think of it as a collection of giant CF flash discs using an oversized reader slot!
Those on the move, sharing a single machine or paranoid about security with HD storage should continue using liveCD s , etc. My main contention is that they are in a minority and, like st, are usually confronted with junk heaps bequeathed to them by the well-meaning (but probably misguided?!). Resurrection is the name of the game! Save the planet, stop landfill. We are here to help all those like st to achieve such noble aims - I think.
For a really technical discussion, HW, do your own Search to discover the gems on offer from real gurus.
Coders of distros have traditionally suffered a severe blind spot wrt putative users. Many are just ivory tower academics talking to their mates about aspects of coding that Joe Average will never comprehend (cf Gentoo - the biggest in-joke amongst that community). Whereas, the most likely scenario is that the great unwashed masses, like st and me, will finally throw up their hands and proclaim that they've had it with Mr Gates, his rotten OS and his criminal business practices. In the first instances, they are most likely to try a Linux distro on something they 'dragged out from under the bed' or discovered in a roadside skip, rather than their shiny, but overpriced and horrendously overperforming PC-of-their-dreams. Klaus K was the first to recognise this reality and Barry originally had similar aspirations.
I am hoping that st isn't going to turn out to be a guy who is afraid to remove the two (four?) screws that give him access to his machine and read the labels on the stuff he's acquired. And use Google to discover some of the inner secrets of what's installed? [Whenever folks pass on their old junk to me, it's in pieces almost as soon as it crosses the threshold!] Incidentally, st, if you haven't washed out the innards with a pressure hose yet (or if you live in the US, with one of those useful sink-top spray units), then it's already too long gone. Don't forget to dry it in the sun if you live in Morocco or on the central heating boiler if you live in Norway.
As for the discussions about installation types and distro deployment, it mainly reduces to arguments about whether to retain the files in a compressed format or decompress them to a type2/full HD install. There are issues of resource overheads relating to memory size (and speed, I suppose on really old kit using 30pin stuff?!), cpu rating, and- critically- HD size, access time (the ultimate limitation amongst nearly all sub-systems) and availability. Add to this the nature and location of stored personal data files and d/l s, and other user specific aspects and you can see that the proverbial can o' worms soon emerges.
As I said somewhere else, there is no longer a shortage of old HD s (anyone will donate a 2Gb drive in exchange for a pint of 6X) suitable for storing compact distros, so a complete solution for those who enjoy dabbling with distro diarrhea is to use a caddy system. Think of it as a collection of giant CF flash discs using an oversized reader slot!
Those on the move, sharing a single machine or paranoid about security with HD storage should continue using liveCD s , etc. My main contention is that they are in a minority and, like st, are usually confronted with junk heaps bequeathed to them by the well-meaning (but probably misguided?!). Resurrection is the name of the game! Save the planet, stop landfill. We are here to help all those like st to achieve such noble aims - I think.
For a really technical discussion, HW, do your own Search to discover the gems on offer from real gurus.
That may be misleading. You need to remove the memory strip(s), insert the printed details in Google and see what you really have. Software discovery is a waste of time unless you are highly experienced and able to interpret this kind of info in the light of what definitive knowledge you have about the HW, in my view.
It troubles me, st, that you are still being exceptionally economical with your information. You still aren't volunteering where you live or responding to some of the other issues I and others have raised. This has the effect of drawing in even more parties to your cause and I'm sure you don't wish to be branded as an attention-seeker!!
At this stage you should be able to tell us whether you have onboard video (the monitor plugs into a connector soldered directly to the motherboard) or a discrete card (the monitor plugs into a connector on a riser backplane card).
Best guess is the former, in which case I have given you a selection of permanent fixes.
Have you washed out the innards yet? Is your HD failing? Have you inspected for bad caps (www.badcaps.net/forum)?
It troubles me, st, that you are still being exceptionally economical with your information. You still aren't volunteering where you live or responding to some of the other issues I and others have raised. This has the effect of drawing in even more parties to your cause and I'm sure you don't wish to be branded as an attention-seeker!!
At this stage you should be able to tell us whether you have onboard video (the monitor plugs into a connector soldered directly to the motherboard) or a discrete card (the monitor plugs into a connector on a riser backplane card).
Best guess is the former, in which case I have given you a selection of permanent fixes.
Have you washed out the innards yet? Is your HD failing? Have you inspected for bad caps (www.badcaps.net/forum)?
The monitor cable is plugged to a socket which is soldered directly to the motherboard. So, according to Sage I must "look up the pin-outs for the graphics chip via Google and slip a scalpel under the Vcc pin to permanently disable the onboard graphics!".
What is a pin-out? What do I need to look for on the graphics chip?
And most importantly, will this speed up puppy to an operational speed and will it allow my configs to save?
I fail to see the relevance of someone's location, but anyhow...
What is a pin-out? What do I need to look for on the graphics chip?
And most importantly, will this speed up puppy to an operational speed and will it allow my configs to save?
I fail to see the relevance of someone's location, but anyhow...
OK - you have onboard video. This means that your chip that sends video to the monitor is pre-selected by the manufacturer and permanently soldered onto the board. You cannot change it when, not if, you work with incompatible operating systems, etc. The next step is to find out from the BIOS whether it can be disabled. Do you know how to tune the BIOS?
www.wimsbios.com and http://www.rojakpot.com/default.aspx?location=1
will tell you everything you need to know about BIOSes.
The scalpel comes later!
The importance of telling us that you live in Ireland is that you are just across the water from here and in a very friendly country. So, if you get badly stuck, there are folk over here on the mainland that can help you with free stuff and maybe even some weekend phone calls! Had you lived in Iran, you might've discovered that there was no further help available at this time.
'Pin-out' is just the term colloquial used to designate the pin configuration of a device (chip/integrated circuit/w.h.y). You can read the device number right off the top of any chip. Pop it into Google and you can get the entire characteristic for just about anything ever made. What I was suggesting was that, if it proves not possible to switch the onboard video OFF in BIOS, you find which pin is soldered to the voltage supply rail ( +positive) and cut it - then it can't work. Either way, you then need to pop in old PCI (will do) or AGP video cards until you find one that works. Ones that often work with almost all distros are Cirrus Logic on PCI, ATI on AGP, but avoid any Matrox, which often need DOS drivers even to get an opening screen or expensive nVidia cards. S3 Savage can be a pile of pants, too. However, with any particular system, you often have to try half-a-dozen to find one that works. So, your weekend homework is to strip out a load of video cards from junk heaps lying around your neighbourhood. I can send one to Ireland if you PM me and are stuck.
Having a separate video card will help you get Puppy booted, stable and normal speed - yes, because it isn't sharing main memory with the graphics department any longer. As I said that would be a bad feature - it was adopted widely in the trade by cheapskates like Dell, Packard Bell and Gateway, for example, when memory was exorbitantly priced.
However, 128Mb is still not ideal for the series 2 Puppy, so I'd advise d/l v1.0.8rc1 and use that. I can send you a stick of 32Mb once you've sorted things a little better if you don't find any lying around.
Then we come to the install you are using. Others have advised you about main partitions and swap. Like Bruce says use type 2 or 'full' install then you can save your d/l s , data etc anywhere you like in plain old uncompressed format and export it, use it with anything else that's compatible. There are others here who will guide you on this subject, but if you want to talk to me by phone, send me a PM and I'll give you my details. I have never claimed any expertise in the SW department, but have half-a-century of experience of fiddling with HW, long before computers existed.
www.wimsbios.com and http://www.rojakpot.com/default.aspx?location=1
will tell you everything you need to know about BIOSes.
The scalpel comes later!
The importance of telling us that you live in Ireland is that you are just across the water from here and in a very friendly country. So, if you get badly stuck, there are folk over here on the mainland that can help you with free stuff and maybe even some weekend phone calls! Had you lived in Iran, you might've discovered that there was no further help available at this time.
'Pin-out' is just the term colloquial used to designate the pin configuration of a device (chip/integrated circuit/w.h.y). You can read the device number right off the top of any chip. Pop it into Google and you can get the entire characteristic for just about anything ever made. What I was suggesting was that, if it proves not possible to switch the onboard video OFF in BIOS, you find which pin is soldered to the voltage supply rail ( +positive) and cut it - then it can't work. Either way, you then need to pop in old PCI (will do) or AGP video cards until you find one that works. Ones that often work with almost all distros are Cirrus Logic on PCI, ATI on AGP, but avoid any Matrox, which often need DOS drivers even to get an opening screen or expensive nVidia cards. S3 Savage can be a pile of pants, too. However, with any particular system, you often have to try half-a-dozen to find one that works. So, your weekend homework is to strip out a load of video cards from junk heaps lying around your neighbourhood. I can send one to Ireland if you PM me and are stuck.
Having a separate video card will help you get Puppy booted, stable and normal speed - yes, because it isn't sharing main memory with the graphics department any longer. As I said that would be a bad feature - it was adopted widely in the trade by cheapskates like Dell, Packard Bell and Gateway, for example, when memory was exorbitantly priced.
However, 128Mb is still not ideal for the series 2 Puppy, so I'd advise d/l v1.0.8rc1 and use that. I can send you a stick of 32Mb once you've sorted things a little better if you don't find any lying around.
Then we come to the install you are using. Others have advised you about main partitions and swap. Like Bruce says use type 2 or 'full' install then you can save your d/l s , data etc anywhere you like in plain old uncompressed format and export it, use it with anything else that's compatible. There are others here who will guide you on this subject, but if you want to talk to me by phone, send me a PM and I'll give you my details. I have never claimed any expertise in the SW department, but have half-a-century of experience of fiddling with HW, long before computers existed.