"if you don't go Linux you're dumb" So where do I learn

[Scoticus]

I am dumb but I want to use Linux & particularly Puppy

kjs posted against the heading Good Linux Promotional Site a link and commented about it remarking of the approach others take of "if you don't go Linux you're dumb"

I looked at the site and found it interesting but like this forum it appears that there is an assumption of knowledge that I, and possibly others do not have. For example looking at version 2.14 manual there are “how to

[pelokwin]

Hey Scoticus ,
I am a little confused. Do you want to run puppy on a machine or are you already running puppy and want to play at the code level? I have found the folks here very helpful, but you have to ask a more direct question. In other words list your computer specs and exactly what you want to do.
“I have a dell 3000 desktop with a pent. 4 processor, 1gig ram, 80gig HD........I want to run puppy in dual mode with WinXP

[Scoticus]

Pelokwin

Thanks for your reply. I have two disks a 2.13 straight from www.puppylinux.com and another that I purchased as a quick way to find out how my preference of browser and Open Office worked.

What I am finding is that there are times that those who provide information assume that I know about Linux and therefore post their reply at that level.

I am clearly a DUMMY seeking information but wish to expand my knowledge so that I can properly work with Puppy. I have a clear wish to set up Puppy to meet my specific needs but if I can not understand the basics feel that I will be totally stuck.

There is no point in posting seeking answers to problems only to find that the information goes straight over my head. Additionally I have found that at times when I seek clarification I have been ignored. I can only assume if that the daft beggar (ME) does not know what he is doing then it is a waste of time advising anything further approach has been taken.

I appreciate that a number of the responders are developing their own versions of Puppy and that my questions can be a diversion and it is on this basis that I am seeking to further my knowledge. To be told that a PUP will automatically load only to find that when it appears that it has done so and I still can not get it to work is so frustrating. Things like this I wish to avoid.

I hope this clarifies things

Ian

[kjs]

Ian,

The reason why you sometimes won't get a response may have several causes:
- it's difficult to understand the question
- nobody knows what you are asking for (rare case)
- the ones who know haven't read your question
- others ??

Version 2.14 you mentioned isn't released yet. If you really have it: ignore it as this is a development version intended for those who already know.

There are several good books about Linux, my personal favorite is "Linux in a Nutshell" (online at http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/linuxnut4/ = older edition) or "Linux for Dummies" but I'd recommend to look at this page: http://www.linux.org/books/ . Not a complete list but a start.

I can understand your frustration as I went though a similar thing when I decided to "Make The Move" in 1998. For winDOS you learned all the stuff in small steps and build up your knowledge base. Now you switched to Linux at a pretty mature level of performance and it's frustrating that you no longer have the same level of understanding you had before.

My recommendation is always to take it slow. If the system is basically working and does most of what you want be happy with it and ignore what you don't understand. Then take one additional thing you want to do and try it out first with Puppy in Live-CD mode (nothing you can ruin). Google and ask here (and read in a book) and once it works as you want make the same modification to your installed version.

There's a good source for info even if it's not Puppy: Ubuntu's wikis and forums! In a lot of cases I go there if I have a problem even if I don't use *ubuntu (currently I use openSuSE 10.2, SuSE Linux Enterprise Server 10 and Grafpup 104).

Good luck,

Juergen

[SirDuncan]

Typically, if you get an answer that you don't have the proper level of knowledge to understand, you can simply ask and it will be explained in simpler terms. I have never had a problem getting people on this forum to do so. In fact, this is the most friendly forum I have ever been on.

As for reasons why people don't answer your questions, it is possible that the person who started answering your question was not able to get back online for a while and couldn't answer you. Other people, seeing that someone else had started answering your question, didn't reply because they thought it was being handled.

If you have a specific problem that you are actually thinking of as you write this thread, tell us what it is and we will see what we can do.

[Scoticus]

Many thanks KJS and SirDuncan.

My reference to version 2.14 was made purely on the basis that during searching it keeps coming up with the caveat of it being advance information.

I will look at Dummies and see what they do for me as Linux in a Nutshell at 900 odd pages might just try my patience and maybe even the will to live.

There is no doubt that I no longer have the same level of understanding than before. My level was purely once I got my thick head round the problem and it worked I was happy. Puppy is proving a challenge but one that I am prepared meet given assistance.

I find that the search on the forum is extremely vague and will give your alternative suggestion a try.

I have two items which I would like to resolve one being able to listen to the BBC radio and the other my Logitech Laser mouse. I am under the impression that a .PUP file should open easily and once open work but I have not found this to be the case. I appear to possibly have gotten the wrong end of the stick. Could I be walked through the process?

With regard to the mouse I am unable to have it do all I want but am experiencing difficulty in even identifying what I should try as the search is throwing up too many pages for comfort. Can anyone offer a step for a hint.

Thanking you in anticipation

Ian

[msumner]

Hi Scoticus, I have also found some dotpups can be unreliable. See my thread:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=15233

Do what I did and be specific about one dotpup you have a problem with and I am sure someone will have an answer. It may not be your fault if it does not work.
Mike

[jonyo]

Pelokwin

Thanks for your reply. I have two disks a 2.13 straight from www.puppylinux.com and another that I purchased as a quick way to find out how my preference of browser and Open Office worked.

What I am finding is that there are times that those who provide information assume that I know about Linux and therefore post their reply at that level.

I am clearly a DUMMY seeking information but wish to expand my knowledge so that I can properly work with Puppy.

Me too

I have a clear wish to set up Puppy to meet my specific needs but if I can not understand the basics feel that I will be totally stuck.

Me too

There is no point in posting seeking answers to problems only to find that the information goes straight over my head.

Yes there is

Additionally I have found that at times when I seek clarification I have been ignored. I can only assume if that the daft beggar (ME) does not know what he is doing then it is a waste of time advising anything further approach has been taken.

Persistence is the key

I appreciate that a number of the responders are developing their own versions of Puppy and that my questions can be a diversion and it is on this basis that I am seeking to further my knowledge. To be told that a PUP will automatically load only to find that when it appears that it has done so and I still can not get it to work is so frustrating. Things like this I wish to avoid.

Me Too Puppy's can be a handful..no doubt

I hope this clarifies things

Ian

[SirDuncan]

I have found this Google based Puppy search engine to be more effective than the forum one: http://wellminded.com/puppy/pupsearch.html
Give it a try and see if it narrows down your search.

As for the DotPup, it is possible that the one you got was compiled for an older version of Puppy and no longer works. I don't know anything about your mouse, but I will look into BBC radio. I will get back to you when I have something to report.

[pelokwin]

Hey I (quickly) did a serch and this site came up
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions ... 84d1953193
Give it a shot, you will have to search abit but it looked promising
good luck
pelokwin

[CatmanDru]

I think many of the above posters have made good sugestions and given good answers and I'd like to 'endorse' those and ask you and others in your situation to consider them carefully. I would like to emphasise the importance of communicating clearly, specifically and with as much detail and information as you can. Please remember that you can edit your own posts. If at first you dont really clearly communicate, then you can always edit it to be more clear, more specific, more detailed, more inquiring, more directed or whatever seems needed. I would like to suggest that you consider editing your 'subject heading' to this post: "Post subject: "if you don't go Linux you're dumb" Subject description: Where do I learn about Linux". The first part (in bold) doesnt really relate to the thread. Specifically I chose to read this thread because i was curious and wondered "whats that all about?" I didnt open the thread because i thot 'I know the answer to that problem!" There still may be people out there who know good ways to learn about Puppy and Linux but who havent yet been 'lured' by your subject heading.
To learn about Linux (and Puppy) Id recommend you check out some books from your local public library and or used book store. Google for linux and any linux topics and just read it all. Read the posts here on the forum. Read the Puppy Wiki. Read the two 'Sticky' (permenant) posts at the top of the beginner's forum. I think this site may be useful: http://www.linux.org/info/index.html
Remember, everyone -- even the 'experts' -- at one time knew nothing about linux. But they learned. And you will too.

[muggins]

i agree with sirdunc that this is one of the friendliest, and helpful, forums going. if i see any queries unanswered, and i've got half a clue, i try and give my 2 bobs worth...but, as those in the know would know, i'm definitely no linux expert. but that's the beauty of BK's puppy, you can play with it, learn, break things, reinstall, and it's very forgiving, and you're always learning.

one thing i find annoying on the forum is when people post probs without specifying exactly what the problem is. i find it funny when people complain about help with puppy...have they ever had a windows problem & tried using the, ironically named, windows "help"? (when i studied english, in high school, i had an english teacher that we nicknamed "mrs I know what you mean" because she would ask your opinion of some novel, then say "i know what you mean", then transform what you actually said to her own tangent. likewise, whenever i tried to use Msoft help, it went off on it's own tangent)

when people respond to a query, they can't make assumptions about what "level" you're at...this is something resolved in the back&flow communications. i.e. if something is too technical, you have to say so, or ask for if it can be expressed in a different way.

also a lot of problems are repetitive & have been answered elsewhere in the forum...if you can find them!

for some people, they just want to surf the net. open & compose documents, play the odd game etc, & for this puppy is ideal for them &, providing it works with their equipment OK, there's no need for them to have any deep understanding of linux. ( i've tried, as many others have posted, heaps of other linuxes, including some of the biggies, & find puppy is far friendlier).

lastly, there is the possibility that no-one has reponded to a query because no-one knows. in which case you can be a puppy trail-blazer!

[pelokwin]

muggins,
Well said , as are all the above post.

[Braden]

muggins made a good point that I think really captures a lot of what this is about.

In the fall I discovered Puppy (v2.10 then) and wanted to install it to a VMWare Server with a full HD install. I had trouble getting Puppy to recognize the VMWare hard drive, and couldn't find it covered anywhere on the forums. I posted a question, kept fiddling, and with a bit of help from the other forum users I had found my own answer. Then I posted a How-To on the forums.
I think a huge portion of these little side tasks, special uses and other such things were made this way.

Every one of us is always learning new things you can and can't do. I just learned the hard way that I should really make sure I can save my pup_save properly before I go about setting up a bunch of my programs on a new install. I hope I don't learn the hard way that I shouldn't save my pup_save to an NTFS partition and expect my Windows to work

[Scoticus]

Many of you are stating the obvious when you say that the forum is extremely good and that people are most helpful and in the main I cannot nor do I wish to disagree.

At the risk of repeating myself I am seeking guidance on sources of reference where I may better understand the replies given on the forum. My general impression is that no one seems to reply in the KISS system (which is my level) even when I open a post stating my lack of knowledge. So how do I get up to understanding geek?

SirDuncan’s link is one that I use and is better than the forums search in narrowing down replies.

Pelokwin’s link looked interesting but on searching for Logitech Laser Mouse settings and finding “X server problem – Logitech USB Mouse (Solved) bang went the will to live.

In the main everyone stresses the importance of clearly stating the problem and when not clearly understanding the answer to seek clarification.

Not wishing to start a flame I was attempting to avoid specifically mentioning the post BBS Radio Player and my seeking clarification. At the time of writing it is still unanswered. This is only one example where I get the impression that my problem is totally below the consideration of the individual.

It is the frustration of not understanding the workings of the Linux OS and being ignored that in the main prompted the question. I will be looking at the Dummies series of books as this was the obvious choice for me but had hoped that there was some small gem out there that others knew of that would have been of equal or better value.

CatmanDru. I have followed your suggestion in part and modified the heading but as you stated my original one caught your attention, which was my intent. You suggest that I look at the sticky posts but looking there does not always help, as a lot of the information is historical. Puppy seems to be going at a pace that the information is often well behind the current version and yet when currently seeking help I was shown a manual that is not yet relevant namely 2.14

Muggins make a very valid point about the differing levels of performance users make within the Puppy environment but if you cannot get on the first rung of the ladder there is little or no hope of making Puppy work the way you want it to. Without wishing to swear and use the M$ word if all that I can do is accept the basic version 2.13 for example and live with that then it is Hobson’s choice and I am no better off with Puppy than wee Billy G.

I hope this makes my position clear and thank you all for your replies.

Ian

[pelokwin]

Scoticus
Sorry the link didn't pan out , but hey you are saying that you are dealing with a lot of frustration when seeking help, but computers are frustration. It took me mounths to get puppy 1.0.8 up and running with the help of a bunch of folks. forget

Hobson’s choice

and try "if first you don't succed try & try again

[Flash]

Look here, under If you are new to Linux.

[DC]

Hi Scoticus,
Some good news for you, If you have not found it already.

If you have booted up puppy and connected to the internet.
click on play icon ( middle on the left) or menu / multimedia / gxine media player.
In gxine player select media tab, then let your mouse run down
under News and Sport - BBC radio 5 live
under Oldies - BBC radio 2 and 3
under Top 40 - BBC radio 1
etc.

Also I found whist I've been learning Linux and puppy. If you have any sort of computer experince you tend to jump in and think complicated.
where as some things are really straight forward.
I also learnt a lot just playing the how to videos.
and then blindly trying things. some times they worked sometimes they did'nt. but you only learn by doing it your self.
As your country man said don't give up keep trying.

DC

[Scoticus]

Many thanks DC your post will let me have my morning fix of radio 4.

Looks not too bad but when attempting to link up with the forum to post my reply I kept being cut off. Looks like the buffer is a bit liimited.
During typing this reply I have been cut off abour 4 or 5 times.
Any suggestions?

Can you tell me how I can get Radio Scotland via this method as I and no doubt many expats would appreciate being able to hear of the fortunes of our teams.

Might have problems at the moment but is a step in the right direction

Once again thanks

Ian

[DC]

Hi Ian,

open gxine player
open tab Media
select "Add media mark"
if there is anything in the MRL line, delete it
copy the following line into MRL line

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/radioscot ... otland.rpm

( If the above line has been word wraped because of your viewing of the post is narrow then make the view bigger so the address is one line.
The reason is some times in word wrap you get control char's which destory the address link when copying and pasting)

in the name line type Radio Scotland

click ok and it should appear at the bottom of the media selection

and test

This works in my puppy but yours could have differences so fingers crossed

My suggestion for posting. Because of my bad spelling I sometimes write everything in open office writer (spell check it) and then copy and paste into the post. The added bonus is if your email / post / fill in form crashes you don't have to retype everything

Good luck

DC