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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Additional Software (PETs, n' stuff) » Unsorted
Xkb Config Manager: Control the Xorg keyboard settings
Moderators: deshlab, Flash, GuestToo, Ian, JohnMurga, Lobster
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2504
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Thu 30 Nov 2006, 10:12    Post subject:  Xkb Config Manager: Control the Xorg keyboard settings  

This utility lets you modify the various parts of the "keyboard0" section of the xorg.conf file.

You can change the keyboard model, add/remove/change layouts, variants of those layouts and control the various parts of the "XkbOptions" field (like setting the keys that change between layouts).

Please help me with feedback on things like:
- Window sizes: I've tried to make windows fit the contents (to avoid scrollbars), but wasn't sure if some aren't too big.
- Icons: I had a problem finding relevant icons that look good when small… and couldn't find one with a LED on it.
- I was thinking of adding a HELP button, to explain what each option does. That would require short, clear explanations…
- Should I create a "options" window, so that the main is smaller?
xkb-config-manager-0.1.pup
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Filename  xkb-config-manager-0.1.pup 
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Last edited by Dougal on Fri 01 Dec 2006, 08:30; edited 1 time in total
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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 6587
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Thu 30 Nov 2006, 10:38    Post subject:  

It all looks nice on my screen.
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kkpity


Joined: 27 Nov 2006
Posts: 112
Location: Brazil

PostPosted: Thu 30 Nov 2006, 17:47    Post subject:  

It looks very nice on my Dell D610 Laptop.

This program seems to be very useful (the graphics are also nice).

Unfortunately I couldn't achieve what I want Sad

I have an US keyboard.

I would like to have the "cedilla" working by pressing the key ":;" (it is a key right after the "L" one) plus the letter "c".

I've chosen:
"Dell" as keyboard model
"us" as Layout and
all kind of variants (there are 4 options).

Could you please help me?

I already have another topic on this forum with same issue:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=13233

Thanks in advance

kkpity
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GuestToo
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Thu 30 Nov 2006, 18:16    Post subject:  

i think your problem is that the newer version of Xorg and xkb has different keymap configurations now ... if you want the same configuration that you had with the older version of Xorg, you may need to write your own, or at least, copy the old configuration file from an older version of Puppy (if they will still work)

this has nothing to do with Puppy ... the Xorg server program has changed ... for example, see this post on the Debian forum
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2504
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Fri 01 Dec 2006, 08:20    Post subject:  

GuestToo wrote:
i think your problem is that the newer version of Xorg and xkb has different keymap configurations now ... if you want the same configuration that you had with the older version of Xorg, you may need to write your own, or at least, copy the old configuration file from an older version of Puppy (if they will still work)


I think the problem is the other way round: Puppy still uses the xkb directory it used in the past (taken from Vector), so some things might not work properly with the new xorg.

I'm actually now in the process of recreating that directory using the files that came with the new xorg and fixing various things that didn't work... (running a lot of "setxkbmap" loops testing all possible options of everything...

Hopefully this will be fixed in 2.13 and also this application wil be included.

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GuestToo
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PostPosted: Fri 01 Dec 2006, 11:34    Post subject:  

you may be right ... but some time ago, i went to the trouble of downloading the latest source from Xorg, and a precompiled Debian deb package, and they seemed to have exactly the same files as Puppy 212

the older xkb had separate keymap files in the symbols dir, with names like en_US and us_intl ... the newer xkb seems to do things differently ... it has just one file ... us ... with variants like intl and alt-intl configured inside the us file

there seems to have been a lot of confusion in other distros in the past months, with keyboard settings that used to work no longer working

so if you are used to using keyboard settings like en_US or us_intl, those settings will no longer work ... there are equivalent settings, though they need to be set slightly differently, and the equivalent configuration may not behave exactly the same as the older configuration ... which, yes, can be confusing ... and also frustrating, especially for a touch typist who is used to the keyboard working a certain way

so i understand kkpity's frustration ... but the older configuration that kkpity is familiar with seems to be no longer available in the newer version of Xorg, and the equivalent configuration that does come with xkb seems to be a little different

and as i said, this is not really Puppy's fault ... it's the Xorg software that has changed
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GuestToo
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PostPosted: Fri 01 Dec 2006, 11:37    Post subject:  

though some of the directory structure from the older version of Puppy may remain ... but i think xbk and Xorg is now straight from the T2 source
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
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Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sat 02 Dec 2006, 08:11    Post subject:  

GuestToo wrote:
though some of the directory structure from the older version of Puppy may remain ... but i think xbk and Xorg is now straight from the T2 source


No. When I created this utility I found that setxkbmap failed in some cases (like ca_enhanced) so I asked Barry for the full xkb directory and he said we're still using the old one...

As for the use of "us" and such shortened names, I actually encountered this yesterday: while testing I got xerrors about the symbol "pc/pc" missing -- which led to the discovery that what is now required from the "symbols" directory is not the files we used until now, but the contents of the "pc" sub-dir... in there you have various language files and each seems to contain all the variants for that language... So it seems like I'll be doing a bit of a overhaul to the entire xkb directory...

I'll post my modified directory before asking Barry to use it, so that a few people can test it out (Pakt??).

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GuestToo
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PostPosted: Sat 02 Dec 2006, 13:11    Post subject:  

there are people who are complaining that us_intl or en_US or ca_enhanced that used to work in Puppy 1.x no longer works in Puppy 2.x

this is absolutely correct ... the keymap configuration files in xkb seem to have been changed, sometime around Oct 2005, i think ... before, there were keymap files named us, us_intl, en_US, ca, ca_enhanced, etc etc etc ... now there is just us, ca, pt, with variant configurations inside the keymap files ... so before, in the version of xkb that is in Puppy 1.x, a keyboard with the capability to produce diacritical characters might be configured in xorg.conf like this:

Option "XkbLayout" "us_intl" #xkeymap0

that will no longer work in Puppy 2.x ... 2.x has the newer xkb ... the equivalent (but not identical) configuration would be something like this:

Option "XkbLayout" "us" #xkeymap0
Option "XkbVariant" "intl"

similarly, a Frech Canadian keyboard in Puppy 1.x would have been configured like this:

Option "XkbLayout" "ca_enhanced" #xkeymap0
Option "XkbVariant" "intl"

in Puppy 2.x, it would be configured like this:

Option "XkbLayout" "ca" #xkeymap0
Option "XkbVariant" "fr"

this is what is confusing people ... what worked in Puppy 1.x no longer works in Puppy 2.x ... ca_enhanced no longer works in Puppy 2.x because the configuration files have changed and the ca_enhanced file no longer exists and the ca_enhanced configuration no longer exists ... to get the equivalent French Canadian keyboard you would type this:

setxkbmap -layout ca -variant fr

if Barry is saying that the xkb configuration files in Puppy 212 are identical to the config files in Puppy 1.x, he is wrong ... i suspect that he means that the files are the same as in 211 and maybe 202 ... the files in Puppy 2.x are definitely different to the older xkb version in Puppy 1.x, you just need to look at them

another problem with the changed config files: the newer equivalent keymaps do not always behave exactly the same way as the older keymap did ... this is what was bothering kkpity ... the older keymap that kkpity was used to using had a cedilla dead key ... press , then c to get ç (c-cedilla) ... the newer keymap behaves a little differently ... for the intl variant, you hold the level3 key and press , to get the c-cedilla character ... for the alt-intl variant, you hold the level3 key and press , to get the cedilla dead key, release it, then press c to get c cedilla ... neither variant works exactly like the old us_intl map (which no longer exists)
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pakt


Joined: 04 Jun 2005
Posts: 1156
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Sat 02 Dec 2006, 13:45    Post subject:  

Dougal, you're doing us all a great service in working on this tool, and I think it is my turn to admire your tenacity Wink
Dougal wrote:
I'll post my modified directory before asking Barry to use it, so that a few people can test it out (Pakt??).

Sure, I'll test it. I'm definitely interested in helping out here. Smile

@G2 - thanks for explaining the changes in Xkb Smile

Paul

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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
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Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sun 03 Dec 2006, 10:14    Post subject:  

GuestToo wrote:
if Barry is saying that the xkb configuration files in Puppy 212 are identical to the config files in Puppy 1.x, he is wrong ... i suspect that he means that the files are the same as in 211 and maybe 202 ... the files in Puppy 2.x are definitely different to the older xkb version in Puppy 1.x, you just need to look at them


I was talking about 2.10 onwards being the same as 2.00-2.02, which it shouldn't be -- we should be using the files that came with the Xorg that Barry compiled...

Anyway, go test my alternate dir and see what happens.

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pakt


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PostPosted: Sun 03 Dec 2006, 11:15    Post subject:  

Dougal, I'll download your utility and test it as soon as John Murga fixes the forum so that we can *see* and download your attachment. I believe he's been made aware of the problem that only the owner of the post can see the attachment Confused

EDIT: Ignore this post - see my post in your new thread on testing the Xkb utility.

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pakt


Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Sun 03 Dec 2006, 14:30    Post subject:  

kkpity wrote:
Unfortunately I couldn't achieve what I want Sad

I have an US keyboard.

I would like to have the "cedilla" working by pressing the key ":;" (it is a key right after the "L" one) plus the letter "c".


kkpity, I've been testing Dougal's utility and I think I can help you.

You need to set up Xorg with two keyboard layouts: 'us' and 'pt' (portugal - I believe that is correct for Brazil(?)), then set up a way of switching layouts while you write.

Dougal's Xkb utility is perfect for setting this up. Here's how I got it working:

- First replace your Puppy 2.12 /etc/X11/xkb directory with Dougal's (see his instructions here: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=82006#82006 )

- In the Xkb utility, choose 'Layouts'. You'll see at the top of the new window which layouts you currently have. Set that up so that it lists 'us' first, then 'pt' under that.

- Back in the main utility window under 'Options Settings', choose 'Group Shift/Lock behavior'. I chose 'Alt+Control changes group'. That means that when you are writing, you can just press Ctrl + Alt and switch layouts. When you choose the 'pt' layout, just press the key to the right of 'L' and you will get 'ç'. Press Ctrl + Alt again and you're back in the US layout !

- If you want an LED to turn on to remind you of which layout you are using, go back to the main utility window and under 'Options Settings', choose 'Use keyboard LED to show alternative group'. I chose 'ScrollLock LED shows alternative group'. Now when you switch layouts to the second layout, the LED will light up Smile

HTH,
Paul

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kkpity


Joined: 27 Nov 2006
Posts: 112
Location: Brazil

PostPosted: Mon 04 Dec 2006, 18:34    Post subject:  

Paul¸

I've followed your instructions and everything worked fine¸but it was not what I was looking for Sad

In fact¸after some hours¸I've figured out that rxvt does not work with accentuation! (I think I have read this in a post but I totally forgot Confused Embarassed

Anyway¸I could solve my problem¸ choosing the following configuration on xkbconfigmanager:

Keyboard Model: pc101 Generic 101-key PC
Layout: US
Variant: intl us: International (with dead keys)

Now¸ writing this post I can produce all brazilian accentuation:
For example:
~ +a = ã
¸ + c = ç
' + a = á
` + a = à
^ + a = â
' + e = é
' + o = ó
' + u = ú
' + i = í ...

I will change the other post that I've oppened to "resolved" and hopefully change the others ones with other issues also to this state soon Wink

Thanks everyone for this great forum! Puppy is really an amazing distribution.

kkpity

Last edited by kkpity on Tue 23 Jan 2007, 15:04; edited 1 time in total
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pakt


Joined: 04 Jun 2005
Posts: 1156
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Tue 05 Dec 2006, 03:22    Post subject:  

kkpity wrote:
Anyway¸I could solve my problem¸ choosing the following configuration on xkbconfigmanager:

Keyboard Model: pc101 Generic 101-key PC
Layout: US
Variant: intl us: International (with dead keys)

Now¸ writing this post I can produce all brazilian accentuation:
For example:
a + ~ = ã
¸ + c = ç
a + ' = á
a + ` = à
a + ^ = â
e + ' = é
o + ' = ó
u + ' = ú
i + ' = í ...

Ok, kkpity, glad you got your keyboard working. Your info will be a great help to others Smile

Paul

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