Suggestions for a Puppy for my ancient PC

[silverojo]

Which current version of Puppy would be good for an old computer (specs in my sig file)?

The main reason I need a newer Puppy is that I can't upgrade my browsers to access sites like USPS.com or PayPal.com. Otherwise, my old Puppy works just fine for my needs.

My concern is that newer versions of Puppy won't be compatible with old CRT monitors.

Any help is appreciated!

[James C]

Which current version of Puppy would be good for an old computer (specs in my sig file)?

The main reason I need a newer Puppy is that I can't upgrade my browsers to access sites like USPS.com or PayPal.com. Otherwise, my old Puppy works just fine for my needs.

My concern is that newer versions of Puppy won't be compatible with old CRT monitors.

Any help is appreciated!

For what its worth, the other day I pulled an MSI P III off the shelf (866 mhz/512 mb ram plus swap) on a Compaq 7500 CRT monitor and both Xenialpup 7.5 and Peebee's Bionic Beaver installed and had no problem with the CRT monitor.
Didn't really test much but they both did a frugal install and worked with the old monitor. HTH.

[bigpup]

The only way to know is just try a Puppy version.

Xenialpup 7.5 will give you what you want.
http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/pu ... 5-uefi.iso

The PaleMoon browser that is in Xenialpup should work OK.

Xenialpup has a program Quickpet (icon on desktop)
After you get frugal install of Xenialpup 7.5.
Made a save and booted using the save.
Run Quickpet>Info>Update Xenialpup
This gets all the latest fixes, improvements installed.

With that amount of ram.

You need a Linux swap file or partition to help the ram.

Do you have a swap or know how to make one?

[Mike Walsh]

Slacko 570 is a good general workhorse (though you may want the no-PAE version with that Duron.) You may also have problems with that sound card; SiS were ever 'problematic'.

http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/puppy-slacko-5.7/

It'll run the newest version of Firefox Quantum, as embodied in Fredx181's 'portable-FF Quantum':-

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=112376

Thoroughly recommended; it works very well indeed. You can even put this on a flash drive and run it from there.....the profile is all built-in to the same directory. Just make sure to start it from the 'ff' script in the directory every time.

However, I don't think your Duron has SSE2 instructions. In which case, you'll have to use the 'special' version of PaleMoon that Walter Dnes has put together for really old boxes like yours.....coded to use SSEs only. See Walter's post here.

Your major problems here are going to stem from the age of your hardware - and browsers, in particular, have become extremely 'heavy' in recent years.....primarily to cope with 'demanding' websites, rich in graphical content. Sign o' the times, unfortunately.

EDIT:- If that's a Duron 900, you'll have bigger problems than I first suspected; you don't even have SSEs, either. Out of curiosity, what browser are you using, and which Puppy are we talking about?


Mike.

[mikeslr]

Hi silverojo,

Just wondered which 'old Puppy' you were using. Mike Walsh's concern that if your Duran doesn't have SSE2 instructions you'd have to use Walter Dnes' version of Palemoon also means you may be working to obtain results no better (and perhaps worse) than you already have. That version of Palemoon can be used, IIRC, even with Puppy 4.2x.

In fact, it might be best if you tell us how you are currently trying to access sites like USPS.com or PayPal.com.

Edit: Mike Walsh and I seem to be working on the same wavelength. But even at the speed of light it takes time to cross the pond. And I had to think about breakfast.

In order to figure out what your computer is a capable of, you might want to run PupSysInfo. If you don't already have it, you can obtain it here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 411#579411. AFAIK, it should run under any Puppy. Start it from Menu>System. Once its opened, click Mainboard on the Top Menu, then CPU. Scroll down to flags and see which, if any sse are listed.

[s243a]

The only way to know is just try a Puppy version.

Xenialpup 7.5 will give you what you want.
http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/pu ... 5-uefi.iso

The PaleMoon browser that is in Xenialpup should work OK.

Xenialpup has a program Quickpet (icon on desktop)
After you get frugal install of Xenialpup 7.5.
Made a save and booted using the save.
Run Quickpet>Info>Update Xenialpup
This gets all the latest fixes, improvements installed.

With that amount of ram.

You need a Linux swap file or partition to help the ram.

Do you have a swap or know how to make one?

I think with those specs Xenial isn't going to be any fun and even a modern browser isn't going to be that fun.

My suggestion though is to try TazPup with the iron-linux browser.

[Mike Walsh]

@ s243a:-

I'll be honest, I'm theorizing here. I've never so much as looked at the TazPup thread. I have, however, had a brief flirtation with SliTaZ itself a couple of years ago; SliTaZ 4.0, IIRC.

Yes, it does have the 'iron-linux' browser....and from what I remember, it also has Firefox 9 in its repos. Both of these are not only horribly out of date, but as t'other Mike says, it's quite possible silverojo may end up with no better results than he/she currently has.

Or is TazPup based on the 'rolling' version, which, AFAIK, is able to run newer browsers? In which case, we're right back at square one again; that Duron is going to struggle mightily. It's not a case of how light the Puppy/Puplet can get, it's down to the sheer lack of CPU instruction sets....if it's the one I think it is.

Mike's right; we need some more detailed info before we can make a sensible recommendation. I know bigpup always recommends the newest Puppy - usually it makes sense - but I don't think any of us gave much thought to the CPU itself.

Even a P4-based machine would work better than that Duron. Same generation as the Duron, but it was Intel's first to be equipped with SSE2s.....a prerequisite for modern browsers. Until recently, I was running Xenialpup 7081 on a P4 w/1.5 GB RAM; it wasn't fast.....but it worked, and ran Iron 63, the final 32-bit Chrome 48, and Fred's 'portable-Quantum'. I've since come to the conclusion that Precise 571 is a better match for the hardware.

A machine that obviously wouldn't run Windoze, but would also struggle with Puppy, is not going to be much use to anyone (except as a doorstop..!) If Silverojo needs a newer browser, he/she may have to 'bite the bullet', and consider lashing out some readies on a newer, second-hand machine; the market's awash with decent propositions for little outlay.

Need more info.....


Mike.

[mikeslr]

As Mike Walsh wrote, we need more information about your computer. Which is why I suggested installing PupSysInfo. It's a utility radky created that provides a front end (GUI) for many otherwise command line tools. As it's written in Bash --consequently "No-Arch"-- and should function under almost all Puppies. If the most recent version doesn't function [there have been changes to Bash] perhaps an earlier version would.

The Base-Report from the System-Specs Menu (see attached) provides a detailed overview, while the Submenus in other Sections go into the 'nuts and bolts". As I mention the Mainboard Submenu on the Top Menu, CPU sub-sub-menu provides details about the CPU including what sse modules are present.

If PupSysInfo can't be run from your current Puppy, someone else will have to provide commandline arguments for finding out just what you computer is capable of handling. Unfortunately, my flaky memory fails on such esoteric matters.

I've been following developments in TazPup. Mistfire has done a superlative job. Taking a modular approach, she has has been able to retain (IIRC) Slitaz's rolling-release capability in its core module, while grafting Puppy's ability to use both Read-only SFSes and Read-Write (i.e., SaveFile) SFSes; access Slitaz's repos and use uniquely "Puppy" applications. It is probably the smallest Puppy currently being developed, and light in its computer resources demands. But it is still in Beta; and whether it would have the firmware and drivers silverojo needs is a question. Unlike the precise-pups, there hasn't been several years to accumulate drivers, and whether there is any Puppy Dev to compile needed drivers under the kernel used by TazPup is a bigger question.

But, in any case, we will need to know more info about the 'nuts and bolts' of silverojo's computer.

[tallboy]

silverojo, which Puppy do you currently use?

I just loaded my Lucid 5.2.8.7 into a 1200MHz Athlon based PC with 512 Mb RAM, for use as a printer server. (my new 2001 model PC doesn't have the old style paralell printer connector)

[Bill3]

silverojo,

I can't address the non-monitor aspects, but both Slacko 5.7.1 and Slacko 6.3.2 work well with my CRT.

Bill3

[silverojo]

For what its worth, the other day I pulled an MSI P III off the shelf (866 mhz/512 mb ram plus swap) on a Compaq 7500 CRT monitor and both Xenialpup 7.5 and Peebee's Bionic Beaver installed and had no problem with the CRT monitor.
Didn't really test much but they both did a frugal install and worked with the old monitor. HTH.

Thanks. It looks like somebody else posted a link to Xenialpup 7.5, so I'll give that a shot.

[silverojo]

With that amount of ram.

You need a Linux swap file or partition to help the ram.

Do you have a swap or know how to make one?

I don't know how to make one...having used Puppy for so many years, I know I should be a lot more knowledgeable. But I was a caregiver and that pretty much dominated my life...you know how that goes.

[silverojo]

However, I don't think your Duron has SSE2 instructions. In which case, you'll have to use the 'special' version of PaleMoon that Walter Dnes has put together for really old boxes like yours.....coded to use SSEs only. See Walter's post here.

Your major problems here are going to stem from the age of your hardware - and browsers, in particular, have become extremely 'heavy' in recent years.....primarily to cope with 'demanding' websites, rich in graphical content. Sign o' the times, unfortunately.

That's why Dillo is my friend. Though I must say, I've found that the mobile Facebook site works much better in older browsers than newer ones.

EDIT:- If that's a Duron 900, you'll have bigger problems than I first suspected; you don't even have SSEs, either. Out of curiosity, what browser are you using, and which Puppy are we talking about?

I mostly use Puppy v. 2.0, as well as Puppy v. 5.10. I was using Slacko 5.5, but I absolutely hated it. It ran terribly on my computer, and when I could no longer use it to access PayPal, I uninstalled it.

I use Firefox and Dillo. I'm on Firefox 2.0 now (yeah, I know!). I can't remember the version that's on Puppy 5.10, but it's probably not much newer.

[silverojo]

Just wondered which 'old Puppy' you were using. Mike Walsh's concern that if your Duran doesn't have SSE2 instructions you'd have to use Walter Dnes' version of Palemoon also means you may be working to obtain results no better (and perhaps worse) than you already have. That version of Palemoon can be used, IIRC, even with Puppy 4.2x.

In fact, it might be best if you tell us how you are currently trying to access sites like USPS.com or PayPal.com.

Sorry for my late reply. I just started a new job, so I'm trying not to use their computer for personal issues.

As I mentioned in a reply to someone else, I mostly use v. 2.0, though I've used 5.10 in the past. I was using 5.5 Slacko, but it slowed my PC to a crawl.

In order to figure out what your computer is a capable of, you might want to run PupSysInfo. If you don't already have it, you can obtain it here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 411#579411. AFAIK, it should run under any Puppy. Start it from Menu>System. Once its opened, click Mainboard on the Top Menu, then CPU. Scroll down to flags and see which, if any sse are listed.

I'll give that a shot. Thanks for the link. I'll post the results here as soon as I have time to install and run it.

[silverojo]

A machine that obviously wouldn't run Windoze, but would also struggle with Puppy, is not going to be much use to anyone (except as a doorstop..!) If Silverojo needs a newer browser, he/she may have to 'bite the bullet', and consider lashing out some readies on a newer, second-hand machine; the market's awash with decent propositions for little outlay.

I plan to, but that will have to wait...my car needs some front-end work done, and that's my #1 priority. I'm also going to buy a cheap smartphone, too, which should help with sites I can't access with my PC.

The reason I'm using such old hardware is that the refresh rate on new monitors is only 60. I have neurological issues, and I need a refresh rate of 85-100 to avoid triggering symptoms. These new monitors kill my face....

[silverojo]

But, in any case, we will need to know more info about the 'nuts and bolts' of silverojo's computer.

If PupSysInfo won't run on 2.0, would Xproc give you the info you need?

[silverojo]

silverojo, which Puppy do you currently use?

Puppy 2.0 or Puppy 5.10

[rufwoof]

Consider perhaps giving a alternative a try. OpenBSD for instance might run on that and if you run just console with tmux and mc (file editor and text editor), create a tput style menu system ...etc. then it can look/feel OK. Then add alpine for email, calcurse for diary/calendar, irssi for IRC, cmus for music player ... etc. lynx/wm3/dillo even for web browsing.

I've modified my control key in tmux from ctrl-b to backtick (where if I press backtick it actually prints a backtick ... i.e. for script execute type character entry). F11 for new tmux window, F12 to step between windows (as that sits will mc using F1 to F10) ... and of course with tmux you can split a window into panes (I've set mine to backtick | or backtick - for vertical/horizontal splits). If someone else logs into the same userid remotely via ssh then they can also attach to the same tmux session and you can collaborate. There are IM type terminal versions that apparently work well (I don't use them myself), news readers/RSS feeds ..etc.

First image is a actual picture of the console as I can't snap that via software. Second is a version running under X ... that I can snap via software.

Fundamentally on even a much more powerful setup than yours I spend relatively little time in X, primarily just use it to run the latest browser and flip to that whenever needed (I run X as 'user' and a restricted one at that, no su, sudo (doas), no cron, no access to any setuid's ..etc) and the browser (chromium) also runs in a jailed like environment (by default chromium is now 'pledged' and when run with --enable-unveil is also 'unveiled' i.e. highly restricted in what disk/memory it can access).

Sound in OpenBSD is fantastic. cmus works very well with that IMO.

And if it can't manage a later gui browser but can fire up X then perhaps run a browser via ssh and X (browser) forwarding from another box. I however relegated my oldest box to be just a data server (vault) that reverse sshfs mounts a folder onto my desktop system whenever/wherever that appears online.

[Burn_IT]

Cheeky!! On a Puppy forum???

[mikeslr]

Cheeky!! On a Puppy forum???

Not really. The slogan "Keep Windows, run Puppy" has long been kicking around. People seek advice on this Forum because they expect each of us will try our best regardless of our self-interest.

There are those who think 'The DebianDogs' don't have a place here. On occasion, I've recommended one when I didn't think any Puppy could accomplish a Poster's objectives as well.

rufwoof has discovered a system he believes should be better known. His posts, recently, at first glace appear to be fixated by that idea. But he is the same rufwoof whose posts were always helpful. And, one of his recent posts provided details about setting up an operating system --IIRC sort of using Puppy as an 'underdog'-- which combined the strengths of OpenBSD with those of Puppy.

Like the 'DebianDogs' Tazpup is not 'really a Puppy' if creation via Woof is a criteria. But once out of Beta/Testing, it may prove to be 'the best' Puppy for resource-limited computers, combining the strength of Slitaz (low resource needs, and a 'rolling release') with those of Puppy (ease of preserving changes via SaveFiles and other uses of SFSes).

In its present state of development my only concern about recommending Tazpup to silverojo is whether it currently has the drivers and firmware needed by his computer. If he has the time to spare, trying it may certainly prove worthwhile. Which is not to say that rufwoof's suggestion might not be better: only that as silverojo is already familiar with Puppies, the learning curve would be less.