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 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Thinkpad T43 and Puppy
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m005kennedy

Joined: 10 Jun 2018
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 12:37    Post subject:  Thinkpad T43 and Puppy
Subject description: end goal image editing
 

I have a brain injury and could use some help. I got a T43 Thinkpad with 1 gig of ram and 32gigt hard drive. I am running the newest Puppy from a live DVD, XenioPuppy 7.5 I believe. it is running great. I created a save session file on the hard-drive and a swap file. My end idea is to eventually install puppy on the hard drive. But first I want to get an image editing program like Gimp to run if possible. I tried using the Puppy Package installer to do this but when I try to install it, even though it found it, when it tries to install it it says the packages are not available. it says I have plenty of room to install it. is it just too much program for this old laptop? do I need to find something else? or should I try to download and install it separately?

thanks in advance
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Burn_IT


Joined: 12 Aug 2006
Posts: 3191
Location: Tamworth UK

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 13:44    Post subject:  

I'm using a T43P and have been for ages.
Mine does have 2Gb of memory, but that is for Windows not Puppy.
Puppy works fine with just 1Gb of memory, especially if you give is a bit of swap space as well. I just allocate the bit at the end of the disk that the other file systems won't use.

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m005kennedy

Joined: 10 Jun 2018
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 14:15    Post subject: Gimp
Subject description: install
 

Have you installed other programs such as Gimp? Puppy runs fine I just can't seem to figure out how to install Gimp
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2627
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 15:21    Post subject: Gimp & other Apps for Beginners  

Hi m005kennedy,

Puppies are 'woof-built' to be binary (executable) compatible with a 'base' distro. For Xenialpup that base distribution is Ubuntu Xenial Xerus. What that means is that, at least in theory, applications created to run under Xenial Xerus can run uncer Xenialpup. Puppy's Package Manager provides direct access not only to its own repositories, but to Xenial Xerus' repositories. But Puppies are not merely versions of the distros they are based on. Puppies have their own way of doing things. While installing applications via Puppy Package Manager accessing the base distro's repository is very often possible, doing so is not always successful, or successful OOTB [tweaking needed frequently about getting it to appear on Puppy's Menu] and occasionally impossible. It remains a 'work of art'.

Until --and as a practical matter even after-- you've developed the art of installing applications via PPM, it is recommended that when you need an application you first look for those published specifically for Puppies in the Additional Software Section. It's organized into Categories almost identical to the organization of Puppy's Default Menu Structure.

Sometimes applications have been built for a specific Puppy, using the binaries of the base distro, and can not (at least OOTB) be used in other Puppies or other Puppies not also built from the same binaries. The following website provides a customized Search Engine that will enable you to quickly find any discussion about an application under a specific Puppy, https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=015995643981050743583%3Aabvzbibgzxo&q=#gsc.tab=0. Worth bookmarking as it's hard to find. Just plug 'xenialpup gimp' into its search box and you'll get a list of every post where both have been mentioned.

GIMP is not an application created by Ubuntu. It is rather the product of an independent organization and the versions maintained on Ubuntu Repositories may have been customized to run under Ubuntus. Puppies don't require such customizations and when present may detract from Puppies' use of an application. A version of Gimp built for Puppy, like many other applications based on the creation of an independent organization, is frequently NOT Puppy Version Specific.

I'm not running Xenialpup (32-bit) at the moment. But according to my notes, my Xenialpup 32-bit can use any of the following: portable-gimp-2.8.16-0.4, gimp-painter-2.8.7.sfs, gimp-2.8.10.pet. Some, if not all, of these were originally created to run under Precise-pups (about 4+ years ago). About the only differences between those and more current version are that the more current versions (a) may include 'Bells & Whistles' not previously available; and (b) require more computer resources (RAM and CPU). You can find those mentioned by using the Search Engine, or scanning thru the Graphics Section of Additional Software. On that Section you may find other graphic tools of interest.

Personally, I almost always use portable-gimp, http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=464426#464426, in part because when not in use it occupies only a couple of kilobytes of RAM.

mikesLr
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 11023
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 15:26    Post subject:  

In the Puppy Package Manager (PPM)
Run configure>Update data base

This makes sure you have the latest info on what is in the repositories.

Do a search for Gimp.
Try it again.

Gimp is going to be big download.
Make sure the save has a lot of free space in it.
Will need around 200MB free.


There is this topic on Gimp
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=90921

However, I use MtPaint that comes installed in Xenialpup.
Have you tried to use it?
It does a lot of stuff that Gimp does.
Try it and see if it has all you need.

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m005kennedy

Joined: 10 Jun 2018
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 15:31    Post subject:  gimp and Puppoy
Subject description: install of gimp
 

Thanks, I will work through the information you have given me and try to get it to work. I had an high end laptop but it died a year ago. I got this one for $5 at a yard sale so it will be great if I cab get it to do some image editing. I was using Adobe Photoshop Elements version
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 11023
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 15:32    Post subject:  

Quote:
My end idea is to eventually install puppy on the hard drive.

There are several ways to do this.
Do you want to keep the OS that is on it or totally turn it over to only Xenialpup on it?

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I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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m005kennedy

Joined: 10 Jun 2018
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 16:19    Post subject: install and gimp
Subject description: T43
 

I was first thinking of keeping window XP, but it might be a lot simpler just to make it all Linux computer. so yes the end gaol is to have Puppy with Gimp so I can use some more sophisticated tools like thew healing brush in Gimp
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Burn_IT


Joined: 12 Aug 2006
Posts: 3191
Location: Tamworth UK

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 16:27    Post subject:  

I use Gimp sfs under Precise Puppy when I need to, though I seldom need that level of editing.
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m005kennedy

Joined: 10 Jun 2018
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 16:41    Post subject:  Gimp Installed
Subject description: Updated
 

My big mistake that you were able to correct was that I had not updated the database for package installation. Once I did that it installed flawlessly. So the next step is to use it for a few days then go to a full install on the hard drive. my other big wish is video editing, but this computer is light years behind what I would need for that!
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dancytron

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Posts: 1125

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 16:51    Post subject: Re: Gimp Installed
Subject description: Updated
 

m005kennedy wrote:
My big mistake that you were able to correct was that I had not updated the database for package installation. Once I did that it installed flawlessly. So the next step is to use it for a few days then go to a full install on the hard drive. my other big wish is video editing, but this computer is light years behind what I would need for that!


It is a case of bad naming, but you don't want what Puppy calls a "full install." You want a "frugal install."

There are many threads on it, so I won't go into all the details, just take our word for it.
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Burn_IT


Joined: 12 Aug 2006
Posts: 3191
Location: Tamworth UK

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 16:59    Post subject:  

Indeed, Frugal is the only way to go unless you have something like a 133mHz machine with only 256Mb memory.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 11023
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 17:35    Post subject:  

Do the install from The Running live CD.

This will delete the save file you have already made. So make a copy someplace not on the hard drive.

Gparted is not hard to use.
All options are selectable from a right click menu.
See example image:
After making a selection of an operation to perform. Select apply at top of Gparted window.

First run Gparted to delete any partitions on the hard drive.
Now it should be showing as unallocated space.
Make a single partition of most of the drive.
Leave about 1GB not used yet.
Format it ext3 or ext4.
Flag it as boot.
Now make a 1GB swap partition out of what is left of the unallocated space.
Close Gparted.

Do the install using the Universal Installer.
Do a frugal install to the big partition you made which will probably be sda1.
After the install.
Run Grub4dos config to install a boot loader to boot the install.
Remove the live CD.
Boot to the new install.

There is two options for what save you use.
The save file you have already made can be copied to the folder the Frugal install is in.
Reboot and it will now be used.

However, if you make a new save, it can be a save folder and it will be able to use all free space on the drive and will not need to be constantly adjusted as you fill it up.
Save files are a set size you make it.
Save folders are a folder that auto sizes as you add or delete from it.
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capture26592.png


_________________
I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked

Last edited by bigpup on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 17:40; edited 1 time in total
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 11023
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 17:36    Post subject:  

Frugal installs:

Can be put on any partition any format, any type storage device.

They load more of Puppy into RAM.

Easier to backup, because all changes, settings are in the save. The core Puppy files never change. Only what is in the save changes. All you have to do is copy the save to have a backup.
If Puppy really gets messed up. Just delete the save and replace it with the backup save.

You can easily load or unload SFS program packages.
This lets you use a program without actually installing it to Puppy. You will have to use this option to fully understand it.

All of Puppy is placed in a directory (folder).
You can have many Puppies on one partition.
All completely separate from the other.
All in different directories (Linux term for folder).

Full installs:
Must be installed to a Linux formatted partition.
Uses the entire partition.
Main advantage is it uses less memory to boot to desktop.
Does not use layered file system.
Works best for compiling.
Does not run into size limit that a save file has on a fat32 format.

_________________
I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2627
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2018, 19:04    Post subject: Start a new thread about video editing  

Hi m005kennedy,

To try to maintain some order to the Forum, there's a rule of courtesy: One problem per thread.

That said, with a T43 Thinkpad with 1 gig of ram: Cinelerra (downloaded from publisher, unpacked, started by clicking binary) will run under anything if you're not intimidated/ put-off by its learning curve. Openshot 1.4.3 should be installable via PPM, but about half the time doing that it complains about python. Recommend looking for a pre-built version. Avidemux -- pre-built native linux versions can be found. But what I use is the latest Windows Avidemux portable running under Wine as it able to handle (and convert to/from) video formats more recent than Xenialpup's builtin ffmpeg. If you go that route remember it is a portable and 'installed' anywhere other than the Wine container.

VirtualDub (but not CutAssist) will run under Wine. So will several other video editors.

mikesLr

p.s. The Thinkpad T43 can manage 2 Gbs of RAM. http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/compatible-upgrade-for/IBM/thinkpad-t43-series-(type-2669) but look on ebay/Amazon. Will make a great deal of difference for video work.
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