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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3882
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Mon 13 Mar 2017, 02:44    Post subject:  

Hi Fred.

I will not accept the invitation from William because my idea about DebianDog is still valid. If something is non-free or without license (which is the same) I don't want to have any part of it. Even working on the same github page where non-free license isn't respected.
I care more for the developers wishes and much less for the passengers wishes.

I understand the huge efforts to build and upload all newer iso images and it isn't acceptable for you to rebuild everything. And you don't have to. My idea is mine and your idea is different.
fredx181 wrote:
Now Peace, Quiet

Yes.

Toni

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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4481
Location: holland

PostPosted: Mon 13 Mar 2017, 17:51    Post subject: Re: Post subject  

mikeslr wrote:
Dear Fred,

I am indeed saddened by your decision. But it is understandable. Linux projects exist because the people who work on them love what they are doing. When that love is gone --for whatever reason-- so is the reason for engaging in that mental state required for the work; and doing the work not only becomes drudgery, but a reminder of what once was and now is gone.

Yet, I can not help but grieve for the lost potential of this project. Together, in two years, you and Toni devised a light-weight, truly portable, operating system with the power of apt and synaptic to easily and accurately expand from its base to whatever debian or Ubuntu repositories had to offer. For "passengers" like me, it could only get better. Except, it won't.

Perhaps in time you may again find the passion needed to re-engage, or to engage in a similar project. Humans are odd creatures and the worlds they create do not evolve with mathematical precision. Yesterday's bitter enemies become today's respected trading partners.

But, if that is not the case, can you find the sufficient stamina to leave those who might desire to carry on with sufficient information to do so.

As I understand it --and always assume I may be wrong-- your recipe for creating operating systems:

1, Starts with a netboot ISO; then
2. "Remastering" initrd to support porteus boot. How is this accomplished?

I can only wish you peace and luck in your future efforts.

mikesLr


Thanks for your kind reply Mike.

As for your question: "Remastering" initrd to support porteus boot. How is this accomplished?"
I can't answer that in a short way, I better write in the How-to section (but at a much later point in time, presumably) is that OK?

Fred

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dancytron

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Posts: 1555

PostPosted: Mon 13 Mar 2017, 18:18    Post subject: Re: Post subject  

fredx181 wrote:
mikeslr wrote:
Dear Fred,

I am indeed saddened by your decision. But it is understandable. Linux projects exist because the people who work on them love what they are doing. When that love is gone --for whatever reason-- so is the reason for engaging in that mental state required for the work; and doing the work not only becomes drudgery, but a reminder of what once was and now is gone.

Yet, I can not help but grieve for the lost potential of this project. Together, in two years, you and Toni devised a light-weight, truly portable, operating system with the power of apt and synaptic to easily and accurately expand from its base to whatever debian or Ubuntu repositories had to offer. For "passengers" like me, it could only get better. Except, it won't.

Perhaps in time you may again find the passion needed to re-engage, or to engage in a similar project. Humans are odd creatures and the worlds they create do not evolve with mathematical precision. Yesterday's bitter enemies become today's respected trading partners.

But, if that is not the case, can you find the sufficient stamina to leave those who might desire to carry on with sufficient information to do so.

As I understand it --and always assume I may be wrong-- your recipe for creating operating systems:

1, Starts with a netboot ISO; then
2. "Remastering" initrd to support porteus boot. How is this accomplished?

I can only wish you peace and luck in your future efforts.

mikesLr


Thanks for your kind reply Mike.

As for your question: "Remastering" initrd to support porteus boot. How is this accomplished?"
I can't answer that in a short way, I better write in the How-to section (but at a much later point in time, presumably) is that OK?

Fred


Take your time Fred, but I think "How To" is an excellent idea and will be of great value to a lot of people.
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 3913
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Mon 13 Mar 2017, 20:36    Post subject: Post Subject  

Hi Fred,

dancytron beat me to the answer. Smile No hurry. You take care of yourself.

mikesLr
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 3725

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 08:30    Post subject:  

I transitioned over from Porteus to systemD/debian initrd some months back (I run Debian) and haven't looked back since. You can still link your own modules/code into that if you so desire, however having the single centrally managed (systemD) works well IMO. More eyes all looking/maintaining the same thing rather than lots of independent/different versions. All part of the Debian rock solid stability.

A single additional script similar to save2flash, all the rest being core Debian, but with many Puppy like qualities (sfs's, load to ram if desired, save on demand otherwise changes lost ...etc.) works great. Best of both worlds.
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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4481
Location: holland

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 12:05    Post subject:  

mikeslr wrote:
1, Starts with a netboot ISO; then
2. "Remastering" initrd to support porteus boot. How is this accomplished?


dancytron wrote:
Take your time Fred, but I think "How To" is an excellent idea and will be of great value to a lot of people.


I will take my time, but thought I'd better ask you guys now:
What are your wishes or advices what should this howto contain?
I mean is it specially about porteus-boot option or more in general building live OS, e.g. I could:
- write the steps of starting off with a netboot ISO, then install very minimal software e.g. xserver-xorg-core, openbox and some more and then the procedure to remaster, create porteus-boot initrd etc... (this would be long how-to, but very minimal OS)
- write only the steps of creating a porteus-boot initrd from a "official" live-boot Debian cd. (short howto, just a couple of steps)

I've been asked also earlier to make some sort of script/skeleton which makes it possible to create your own DebianDog, exactly as you like, let's say similar to WOOF but I answered at that time that it would be very complicated and probably brings a lot of issues (that I would not call a howto but a project!)

Just some thoughts for now and I will think about it more, but the first option I think is best (and I guess exactly what mikeslr asked).

So, any ideas, suggestions?

Fred

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backi

Joined: 27 Feb 2011
Posts: 2007
Location: GERMANY

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 12:19    Post subject:  

Quote:
write only the steps of creating a porteus-boot initrd from a "official" live-boot Debian cd. (short howto, just a couple of steps)


If this would be a easier to describe.....i am quite interested to know how to accomplish this .
But on the other hand don` t want to put another pressure on you ....relax fred .....slow down...you have done a lot of work.

In case you feel fine and in the mood for doing this....all these things should be for fun .
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dancytron

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Posts: 1555

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 12:44    Post subject:  

Quote:
- write the steps of starting off with a netboot ISO, then install very minimal software e.g. xserver-xorg-core, openbox and some more and then the procedure to remaster, create porteus-boot initrd etc... (this would be long how-to, but very minimal OS)


I think this would be the most useful. It would really unleash the power for others to create a lot of very different and useful distributions based on the power of what you have learned.

Take your time with it.

Dan

Last edited by dancytron on Tue 14 Mar 2017, 12:44; edited 1 time in total
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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4481
Location: holland

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 12:44    Post subject:  

backi wrote:
But on the other hand don` t want to put another pressure on you ....relax fred .....slow down...you have done a lot of work.


Yes, I sure will, thanks backi!
I've been thinking about such a howto for some time already, just didn't made up my mind yet "How To" make the howto Smile

Fred

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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4481
Location: holland

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 13:31    Post subject:  

dancytron wrote:
Quote:
- write the steps of starting off with a netboot ISO, then install very minimal software e.g. xserver-xorg-core, openbox and some more and then the procedure to remaster, create porteus-boot initrd etc... (this would be long how-to, but very minimal OS)


I think this would be the most useful. It would really unleash the power for others to create a lot of very different and useful distributions based on the power of what you have learned.

Take your time with it.

Dan


Yes, I think also, but on the other hand, it would be only for advanced users then.
I remember myself years ago trying such a way with a very minimal install I got stuck (didn't know were to begin to make it "polished" the way I liked, what to install or do next? didn't know about all that (strange) package names) and at that time chose for the more "official" way such as (prefab) Debian-Live (or official install with full desktop e.g. LXDE or XFCE and the most basic software included anyway).

Just thinking out loud again.

Fred

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anikin

Joined: 10 May 2012
Posts: 1020

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 13:57    Post subject:  

Fred,

Before you proceed any further, a quick question: Are you ready to put a license note on all the scripts, that you have contributed to the DD project? Or, post a clearly stated refusal to do so.

Unless I've missed something, this is still an unresolved issue. You can't wiggle and dance around it with a howto
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj-VmZYcUhQ
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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4481
Location: holland

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 14:22    Post subject:  

anikin wrote:
Fred,

Before you proceed any further with your howto, a quick question: Are you ready to put a license note on all the scripts, that you have contributed to the DD project? Or, post a clearly stated refusal to do so.

Unless I've missed something, this is still an unresolved issue. You can't wiggle and dance around it with a howto
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj-VmZYcUhQ


Anikin,

I don't know much about you, but really thought you were intelligent enough to know that I won't reply to any of your posts.
So consider this reply of mine now as absolutely the last time.

Fred

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stemsee

Joined: 27 Jun 2013
Posts: 2572
Location: In The Way

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 14:54    Post subject:  

Here here Fred!
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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4481
Location: holland

PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 15:11    Post subject:  

stemsee wrote:
Here here Fred!


Had to look at what it means, found this:
http://grammarist.com/spelling/hear-hear/

So I *think* I'm intelligent enough to know what you mean, so thanks Stemsee !!, but correct your spelling next time Shocked Laughing

Fred

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anikin

Joined: 10 May 2012
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PostPosted: Tue 14 Mar 2017, 17:03    Post subject:  

fredx181 wrote:
anikin wrote:
Fred,

Before you proceed any further with your howto, a quick question: Are you ready to put a license note on all the scripts, that you have contributed to the DD project? Or, post a clearly stated refusal to do so.

Unless I've missed something, this is still an unresolved issue. You can't wiggle and dance around it with a howto
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj-VmZYcUhQ
Anikin,

I don't know much about you, but really thought you were intelligent enough to know that I won't reply to any of your posts.
So consider this reply of mine now as absolutely the last time.

Fred
I'm not here to engage you in personal correspondence. I'm not here to evaluate your intelligence or lack of it. I absolutely am not interested in that and I don't have a lot of time for you either. I asked a question (although it's more of a statement), that's on everyone's mind: Why is Fred sabotaging the reconciliation process? Why is he wiggling?
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