Dual booting grub2 Linux with frugal Puppy?

[Jim1911]

Grub4dos configuration, if it finds grub2, will include an entry "find grub2" which will locate grub2 and boot from it. I have found that feature convenient to boot ubuntu in some instances.

[nooby]

@nooby: With all due respect, you are mixing up two different situations. This thread started off talking about an old Dell Dimension 4600 that would only have Linux's on it.

Now you are back to talking about dual booting with Windows and NTFS.

Which is it?

Yes but I responded to that specific claim. I maybe lure us to go off topic.

On topic Idid put that computer back on the scrapbin but kept the HD
and DVD and RAM and such to combine from 3 other computers to
make the best Linux "test" computer that I am able to make shift together.

Sure I can be wrong but AFAIK or rather IIRC the Dev guys that changed
from using grub legacy to Grub2 then are saying that their distro should
have grub2 for to boot. And as I get it they refer to both "Live" and full install.

And my experience of booting the live it fail to find a certain file
if one use grub4dos

I have that on an Asus EEEPC and that one has ext2 and ext2 exclusively
and "live" installs fails even on that one. So it is not about NTFS either.

And you have to consider what happens when I ask about their distro
on their forum. They expect that those that ask have installed it the way
their installer set it up.

My experience is that they refuse to answer if one managed to boot
their distro with the wrong boot loader.

So I want to stick to grub2 on sda1 for booting many many linux distros
when they write about them in DistroWatch and on other such sites.

But considering how noisy these big Desktops are and how much space
they take up are on the desk I will also try out something else. Also
off topic in this thread.

I have purchased an usb to Ide and Sata drive adapter.
That way I can treat any old internal HD as if they are usb memory
and that would allow me to boot linuxes as if they are fully installed
on the external usb?

I hope that solve my problem?

[nooby]

Here is why I saw myself as "partly" being on topic.

I want to boot the way the devs of that distro have planned it to be.
I have forgotten which guy it was but some 6 months or more way back
he showed me that a great majority of all linuxes are set up to boot with
grub2 on internal HD exclusively.

Sure on external usb connected you maybe can boot it pretending it is
on CD/DVD/USB but the internal HD they expect grub2.

With a few exceptions. say at most 5 to 10% of all listed distros on DW?
All the major brands are using grub2?

As I remember he got very upset with me for not believing him.
If he where wrong and I had it right would not then a lot of you
confirm that I where right. I don't remember how to find that thread again.

I came to believe him after spending much time going through many of
the listed distros that where high up on the list as popular. .

Sorry if I come through as rigid and defending and not so flexible.
All the man hours that I invested in that "research" convinced me
that he gets it right. Where he wrong. Remember he got very upset
when I did not believe him.

[Tman]

nooby,

This is becoming more complicated than it should be.
If you want, you can just PM me and I will try to walk you through setting things up the way you like.

[nooby]

nooby,

This is becoming more complicated than it should be.
If you want, you can just PM me and I will try to walk you through setting things up the way you like.

Yes and no.

The good thing with sharing on line is that others can make use of
the solutions you share with us.

Yes sure I can do PM I don't mind but then I would still share it
online not the PM but the code for to get it to work.

Remember I don't have that computer anymore but if your code works
for using an USB connected external ide HD then I can test it right away
with code for grub4dos and using same menu.lst I use to boot every day.

Is that okay with you? I can show example now.

Code: Select all

title lupu-528-005  
  kernel (hd0,1)/lupu-528-005/vmlinuz PMEDIA=idehd PDEV1=sda2 psubdir=lupu-528-005  pfix=fsck 
  initrd (hd0,1)/lupu-528-005/initrd.gz

I ahve this part too but not sure if it should be there i915.modeset=1

Here is how I boot Linux Mint latest version but the LXDE variant.

title LM12 LXDE 2012 frugal iso boot of LM12 LM12LXDE
find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /linuxmint-12-lxde-cd-32bit.iso
kernel /LM12LXDE/casper/vmlinuz rw file=/cdrom/preseed/mint.seed boot=casper iso-scan/filename=/linuxmint-12-lxde-cd-32bit.iso ramdisk_size=1048576 root=/dev/ram noeject noprompt --
initrd /LM12LXDE/casper/initrd.lz

Now that is on the internal hd which have NTFS
So the external hd have ext 3 on it in three partitions made for linux mint
and other grub2 distros.

I trust that if I do the grub4dos config thing it delete the grub2 so that is a
no no.

So your idea that it should work with grub legacy has to be done on another usb then. I ahve many such so no problem to find one.

Another bad thing about doing PM is that none of the others can
jump in and point out things. Maybe one can do both.
You write PM to me and I continue on this thread if others feel for it.

[nooby]

Thanks for that PM

I am not sure how to proceed.

I have to set up one usb that I dedicate to make use of as
the test of linux usb and then stick to that one or to add
several such if need come up. I have a quick and dirty
one now and old 8GB noisy internal HD attached to the
adapter and can use that one so do tell me what would be
the best way to get Linux Mint on it. Send me that PM.

I have some 2 hours before bed time here locally so
if you have time we could try it out. To use Puppy to
boot Linux Mint on that external USB hd using grub4dos

Tomorrow I will be traveling so will be away for most of the day.

[Tman]

Code: Select all

title lupu-528-005  
  kernel (hd0,1)/lupu-528-005/vmlinuz PMEDIA=idehd PDEV1=sda2 psubdir=lupu-528-005  pfix=fsck 
  initrd (hd0,1)/lupu-528-005/initrd.gz

Is your bootloader grub4dos or Grub Legacy?

The confusing part is both of them have a menu.lst file,but you cannot just add Grub4dos settings into a grub legacy menu.lst. You need to actually install grub4dos. A frugal-pup entry in grub4dos would be like this:

Code: Select all

title Lupu-528-005
  find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /lupu-528-005/initrd.gz
  kernel /lupu-528-005/vmlinuz   psubdir=lupu-528-005 pmedia=atahd pfix=fsck
  initrd /lupu-528-005/initrd.gz

I am not sure about the pmedia part...you might have to change yours to "pmedia=idehd"

[nooby]

Ooops I thought I told you that I prefer to make use of grub4dos
because that is what I have now.

So what do you suggest for Linux Mint then?

[Tman]

Did you install Mint to the USB yet? If not, you can install it now and install the grub2 bootloader to the USB as well.

Also, what have you got installed in your main hard-drive, and is your main hard-drive using grub4dos?

title LM12 LXDE 2012 frugal iso boot of LM12 LM12LXDE
find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /linuxmint-12-lxde-cd-32bit.iso
kernel /LM12LXDE/casper/vmlinuz rw file=/cdrom/preseed/mint.seed boot=casper iso-scan/filename=/linuxmint-12-lxde-cd-32bit.iso ramdisk_size=1048576 root=/dev/ram noeject noprompt --
initrd /LM12LXDE/casper/initrd.lz

Looks like you are running a livecd image of Mint from your main hard-drive...is that correct?
You need to actually install Mint if you want to add more apps, and have your settings saved. (AFAIK)

[nooby]

Yes my main install is on grub4dos that where the lupu 528-005
that I use now when I write now.
I changed to another less old HD instead.
Will see if it boots. I get back
Formated to ext3 and installed grub4dos and
used my old and your new menu.lst entry and will test both.

Yes sorry about my confusing code on LM12 I just did show it
to inspire you to share how you boot LM12 using grub4dos.

What do I need to change and add or delete for it to work as you
have experience of?

This code from you worked very well.

title Lupu-528-005
find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /lupu-528-005/initrd.gz
kernel /lupu-528-005/vmlinuz psubdir=lupu-528-005 pmedia=atahd pfix=fsck
initrd /lupu-528-005/initrd.gz

So how do I add LM12 now manually?

re your use of uuid
would you not need to have set root=UUID or something?

[Tman]

Your lupu might be stalling due to applying my suggested code; if so...

replace:

kernel /lupu-528-005/vmlinuz psubdir=lupu-528-005 pmedia=atahd pfix=fsck

with:

kernel /lupu-528-005/vmlinuz psubdir=lupu-528-005 pmedia=idehd pfix=fsck

[nooby]

I am booted in Arch now but the one that Godane have on his blog.
I had no time to download the other ones.

I will download archbang tomorrow and other arch.

I did test to boot LM12 using the iso boot code


title LM12 LXDE 2012 frugal iso boot of LM12 LM12LXDE
find --set-root --ignore-floppies --ignore-cd /linuxmint-12-lxde-cd-32bit.iso
kernel /LM12LXDE/casper/vmlinuz rw file=/cdrom/preseed/mint.seed boot=casper iso-scan/filename=/linuxmint-12-lxde-cd-32bit.iso ramdisk_size=1048576 root=/dev/ram noeject noprompt --
initrd /LM12LXDE/casper/initrd.lz

That one already works on internal hd in NTFS but the surprising thing is this

on NTFS internal it allow me to edit files but on external usb HD it does not allow me to edit files.

Sorry late at night so I go to bed now. Eyes hurting due to lack of sleep

[nooby]

I trust that my poor English can be very misleading.

I try to find the text that I maybe misunderstood?

[nooby]

. But I got curious on
Arch and other distros and some of them can only work if one boot
using grub2? That is the impression I got. Okay if you go for CD/DVD or USB
then one can get them to boot but full install they need grub2? .

Just to keep the record straight,you can boot Arch and every other Linux distro I've tried with good old legacy Grub.
I boot everything with regular old legacy Grub. I've got installs of Arch,Ubuntu,Mandriva,Mepis, PCLOS,Semplice plus a lot of various Windows and Puppy installs....everything booting with regular Grub.
I'd just suggest to use the bootloader you are comfortable with..... I just happen to prefer the old reliable regular Grub.

This text I understood as the following.

If James can do that using grub legacy then one would only change the stanza
to be able to do the same with grub4dos and boot same linux as James do
with that boot loader

so when Tman offered his help I trusted that where what we where doing.

What James claims here above.

I have to go to bed now. Sorry

I may be back due to insomnia or failure to go into sleep but my plan
is to sleep for 7 hours and then prepare for the travel and get back
at 3PM or so and it is 10.45PM now so that will be many hour absence
so enjoy the peace and silent from wordy nooby

[Tman]

nooby

Your computer is already using grub4dos as the main bootloader.
And it appears that you don't have any other bootloaders installed on your system. This is becuase you have not been doing full installs, but rather have been running ISO images on your drives.
That is the equivalent of running a LiveCD on your hard-drive...it is not the same as a full-install.

the link below is a video on how to make a full-install of Mint:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GXdNJuTSuw

After completing a full-install, you can opt to use Grub2 as the bootloader or have grub4dos launch the full Mint install, or have grub4dos launch grub2 to launch Mint. Yes, it can get confusing.

[Tman]

okay, I just learned something that you already knew...

You can save your settings while using a LiveCD with Ubuntu and Mint, after all.

This being the case..forget about the full installs of Mint. Just boot as you've always have...and save your settings to a linux partition.

You can't save Mint settings to an NTFS, but you can shrink the NTFS and used the freed up space to make linux partition(s) to save your settings.

If you have Windows installed, a good free partitioning tool is "Easeus".
If you don't have need for Windows, you might as well delete the NTFS and convert it to a linux filesystem.

[nooby]

Does persistence work with "Live Session User"?

It does not allow me to write to the drive that I boot from.
So why would it allow me to have persistence?

But you are right in that Pendrivelinux has written about how to
get persistence on usb but maybe that is full installs?

Suppose I do a full install of Arch.
Should I chose the one that Godane have on his Dev Blog?
http://godane.wordpress.com/2011/01/05/ ... 4-release/

or use the more known Chackra Linux
http://chakra-project.org/

What about ArchBang? http://archbang.org/

[nooby]

@nooby: Here is the strategy you should use.

1. Make a small FAT32 partition at the start of the drive. It will be used by GRUB4DOS to hold the files grldr and menu.lst. GRUB4DOS will put its startup code on the MBR of the drive. Nothing else will go here.

2. Make some other partitions. If you need more than three, create an extended partition and put other partitions inside it.

3. Boot up a Linux off its CD and run the install procedure. For Ubuntu 10.10, I used the following steps.

a. Do a manual install to a partition.
b. Set the mount point of the selected partition as "/".
c. Install GRUB2 to the partition boot sector. ie sda2, NOT sda.

4. When done, boot off a Puppy CD.

5. Run GRUB4DOS bootloader config. It will auto-detect the new Linux, create a menu.lst and make the drive bootable.

6. To add another Linux, repeat steps 3, 4 and 5.

Thanks I will try to follow this one then.
As it is now it has this structure

So I have to learn then how to add the "1. Make a small FAT32 partition at the start of the drive" how do I tell Gparted to add that one?

Then I want to split up the big one with ext3 into one 8GB ext3 and one for data? so I can keep backups of Puppy on the data and only do new installes on the second partion which should have grub2 on it.
The first one as you suggest then have grub4dos config installing g4d on it
with a menu.lst that chainload the grub2?
So I need to find a description how to tell gparted to do these moves.

[rcrsn51]

So I have to learn then how to add the "1. Make a small FAT32 partition at the start of the drive" how do I tell Gparted to add that one?

When I wrote those instructions, I assumed that you were working on the old Dell machine where you could safely add and delete partitions.

But now I don't know what machine you are using. So I don't want to make any more suggestions about using Gparted.

[nooby]

Oh sorry.

I am using Acer D255 and have an external HD 20GB big
and it is an external such but connected through USB plug.

So it's name is sdb

I presume that is safe enough to make use of.
http://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/gparted.html

That is supposed to be a tutorial. Hopefully I can use it.
It is more likely that I don't get a bit of it but I can try.

This thread on our forum suggest that one start fresh
having wiped everything from that drive?

That would be dangerous maybe if it decide to wipe my internal hd.

Can I always trust that wen it sad sdb and 20GB then that is the external drive?