(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 14:51**

BarryK wrote:I am experiencing SeaMonkey crashing, seemingly randomly.

linuxcbon also reported this with the Werewolf beta release.

Is this a problem with version 2.38?

I have usually found SeaMonkey to be pretty rock solid.

I will experiment, compile an older version.

I read on Linux From Scratch site, regarding SM 2.39, that --enable-system-cairo causes SM to be unstable.

Compiling SM 2.39 now, with --disable-system-cairo. Note, Q7.3 has SM 2.38.

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 15:37**

BarryK wrote:You had me worried there for a second!

I did nor really go through the scripts but 1.7GB space required (pic) made me think otherwise.

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 16:02**

Hello @BarryK.

@Mavrothal shows the screen for an initial save-session. I have read both of your descriptions of the process, but, this implementation screen in a little misleading and I ask clarification on the process.

Step1
Here we identify which of any partitions seen by the system we want the file to be saved and further what folder name on the partition is the session file to be saved in
Question
Can the folder name be a path OR does the boot process only search root level for the folder vs looking for it path to find the session file?

Step2
Here, this step begins by asserting that a REMASTER is required.
Question
Is this to be done before we initially use this SAVE desktop icon? Or is this announcing that the process to be performed is going to place a new system master on the media in one of the PC's magazine?

The understanding appears that we are to rewrite the CD/DVD media as well as write a file for system boot on the permanent media (HDD/USB). Is that correct?

Is this correct, too?
Is your save-process structure for Live use as follows?

The initial (pristine) DVD is to remain without change, because it is general for most PCs to boot from. Thus, this remains constant.
While the save-session file is specific and unique to one's booted PC; and applies to only this PC. Thus, this is variable by individual PC where its saved

Thanks in advance for any clarification on Live use

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 17:41**

Busy but enough time for a quick live test. No SeaMonkey crashes yet.All basics working on initial boot.

Code: Select all

-Computer-
Processor		: 6x AMD FX(tm)-6300 Six-Core Processor
Memory		: 8086MB (367MB used)
Machine Type		: Physical machine
Operating System		: Quirky Werewolf64
User Name		: root (root)
Date/Time		: Wed Nov 11 11:37:53 2015
-Display-
Resolution		: 1440x900 pixels
OpenGL Renderer		: Gallium 0.4 on NVA8
X11 Vendor		: The X.Org Foundation
-Audio Devices-
Audio Adapter		: HDA-Intel - HDA ATI SB
Audio Adapter		: HDA-Intel - HDA NVidia

Code: Select all

# report-video
VIDEO REPORT: Quirky Werewolf64, version 7.3

Chip description:
VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation GT218 [GeForce 210] (rev a2)

Requested by /etc/X11/xorg.conf:
  Resolution (widthxheight, in pixels): 1024x768x16
  Depth (bits, or planes):              24
  Modules requested to be loaded:       dbe 

Probing Xorg startup log file (/var/log/Xorg.0.log):
  Driver loaded (and currently in use): nouveau
  Loaded modules: dbe dri2 exa extmod fb glx kbd mouse shadowfb

Actual rendering on monitor:
  Resolution:  1440x900 pixels (381x238 millimeters)
  Depth:       24 planes

...the above also recorded in /tmp/report-video

Code: Select all

# free
             total         used         free       shared      buffers
Mem:       8086400       945948      7140452       297592        84704
-/+ buffers:             861244      7225156
Swap:      8396796            0      8396796

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 19:16**

Had a better look at the "boot from CD save to partition/folder" process.
The space requirement mentioned above is a leftover from full installs and thankfully does not block the process.
However, both q.sfs and s.sfs are saved, which does not make sense if you are going to be booting from the CD that has the q.sfs. You just want to save the s.sfs file I would think.

Regarding kernel command arguments, it would appear that they require a /BOOT_SPECS file at the root of the boot device and there is no obvious way to provide the BOOT_DEV, BOOT_FS and BOOT_FOLDER parameters from the command line other than just type them and this is not working as they are ignored.
It would also appear that you can not have the initrd.q and s.sfs in different devices, at least when running from the original CD.

...Or maybe some better instruction are needed.

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 21:38**

Having issues with text and icons not being visible until passed over with mouse with dialog based interfaces, like connection wizard and whatever that was at the very beginning of first boot.

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 22:19**

Very excited to give this a go! I hope I'll find time this weekend. Otherwise I'll just have to accept that I will miss out on the bugs

Are there any changes (eg., to devx library versions) which might upset my Quirky7.2 .pets? I've built some finicky packages which I need for work.

Posted: **Wed 11 Nov 2015, 23:25**

http://distrowatch.com/

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 00:52**

mavrothal wrote:
BarryK wrote:You had me worried there for a second!
I did nor really go through the scripts but 1.7GB space required (pic) made me think otherwise.

That figure of 1.7GB is an estimate of the maximum that Quirky is likely to need.
This is derived from about 1.7*2 = 3.4GB being the amount that can be stored in RAM, and the save-file compressing that.

That is, your system will have about 3.4GB space in the zram, in which to download files, install packages, caches, etc.
-- but you would need to mouse-over the memory icon in the tray to see the exact amount available.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 01:00**

gcmartin wrote:Hello @BarryK.

@Mavrothal shows the screen for an initial save-session. I have read both of your descriptions of the process, but, this implementation screen in a little misleading and I ask clarification on the process.

Step1
Here we identify which of any partitions seen by the system we want the file to be saved and further what folder name on the partition is the session file to be saved in
Question
Can the folder name be a path OR does the boot process only search root level for the folder vs looking for it path to find the session file?

Step2
Here, this step begins by asserting that a REMASTER is required.
Question
Is this to be done before we initially use this SAVE desktop icon? Or is this announcing that the process to be performed is going to place a new system master on the media in one of the PC's magazine?

The understanding appears that we are to rewrite the CD/DVD media as well as write a file for system boot on the permanent media (HDD/USB). Is that correct?

Is this correct, too?
Is your save-process structure for Live use as follows?
The initial (pristine) DVD is to remain without change, because it is general for most PCs to boot from. Thus, this remains constant.

While the save-session file is specific and unique to one's booted PC; and applies to only this PC. Thus, this is variable by individual PC where its saved
Thanks in advance for any clarification on Live use

Step 1,
the example folder name could be left as-is. It could have a path, but I haven't put in code to create a path if it doesn't exist.
That is something that I could clarify.

Step 2
I think that it is unambiguous.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 01:03**

mavrothal wrote:Had a better look at the "boot from CD save to partition/folder" process.
The space requirement mentioned above is a leftover from full installs and thankfully does not block the process.
However, both q.sfs and s.sfs are saved, which does not make sense if you are going to be booting from the CD that has the q.sfs. You just want to save the s.sfs file I would think.

Regarding kernel command arguments, it would appear that they require a /BOOT_SPECS file at the root of the boot device and there is no obvious way to provide the BOOT_DEV, BOOT_FS and BOOT_FOLDER parameters from the command line other than just type them and this is not working as they are ignored.
It would also appear that you can not have the initrd.q and s.sfs in different devices, at least when running from the original CD.

...Or maybe some better instruction are needed.

You haven't looked at the 'init' script.

If the q.sfs is saved alongside s.sfs, it is removed from the CD.

The install instructions are unambiguous, as per the snapshot you posted above.
The CD has to get remastered as part of the process.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 01:29**

OK, I see your process a little more clearly.

The save process REQUIRES that the CD is burned, initially, such that it is NOT closed. This must be done so that it can be reburned for a save session. Thus it MUST be a RW disc and NOT an +R/-R. Your process will rewrite the CD/DVD disc and also write a session file to local disk; namely HDD/USB/etc.

Therefore, the 2 items are a marriage required for Live CD/DVD use with save sessions.

This also means that if I want to use Live on another PC, it is best to create its own, separate Live disc media for boot and save-session use.

Is that correct?

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 04:28**

BarryK wrote:You haven't looked at the 'init' script.

If the q.sfs is saved alongside s.sfs, it is removed from the CD.

The install instructions are unambiguous, as per the snapshot you posted above.
The CD has to get remastered as part of the process.

Maybe so but before I look again please let us know
a) if it is possible to boot from the original CD (_not_ a remaster) and have a save folder with _only_ the s.sfs on a partition? EDIT: It would appear "no"
b) if the above _is_ possible what the boot line arguments would be to use the said save folder (provided there is no /BOOT_SPECS file)? EDIT: Is possible. See below.
Thx

Latter OK

Code: Select all

quirky boot_specs=sda1:ext4:werewolf64-7.3

(or what ever partition:filesystem:folder is) works.

Kind like fatdog.

Bit later It would appear that the q.sfs _must_ be copied to hard disk too. Although the save dialog provides the option not to copy it to the HD, this results in a kernel panic on next boot with the above arguments.
This is because the init defaults in loading q.sfs from $QPATH if QPATH exits.
Maybe split QPATH to QPATH and SPATH to allow loading from different devices/partitions.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 05:42**

Quirky Werewolf 64-bit 7.3

- transmission bittorent client has too many dependencies and not needed ? There is already pctorrent (small gui for ctorrent).
- xemeraldia has too many dependencies.
- why are perl and python not in devx ?
- why is there /usr/local/install_quirky/ when there is a standalone version ?
- there are duplicate folders :
/usr/local/lib/X11/pixmaps/ and /usr/share/pixmaps/
/usr/local/lib/X11/themes/ and /usr/share/themes/
solution : maybe merge them and create symlinks

This quirky is quite nice at the moment, except for seamonkey crashes.
T2 seems dead, so maybe this way is better. Anyway T2 has too many bugs and work to put into.

cheers

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 11:08**

gcmartin wrote:Step1
Here we identify which of any partitions seen by the system we want the file to be saved and further what folder name on the partition is the session file to be saved in
Question
Can the folder name be a path OR does the boot process only search root level for the folder vs looking for it path to find the session file?

I have added a help button alongside the folder entry box.

Yes, the folder has to be at top-level in the partition, unless a path is specified. For example "quirky/werewolf-7.3"

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 11:17**

gcmartin wrote:OK, I see your process a little more clearly.

The save process REQUIRES that the CD is burned, initially, such that it is NOT closed. This must be done so that it can be reburned for a save session. Thus it MUST be a RW disc and NOT an +R/-R. Your process will rewrite the CD/DVD disc and also write a session file to local disk; namely HDD/USB/etc.

Therefore, the 2 items are a marriage required for Live CD/DVD use with save sessions.

This also means that if I want to use Live on another PC, it is best to create its own, separate Live disc media for boot and save-session use.

Is that correct?

No, that is not correct.

Look at the snapshot posted by mavrothal.

If you choose to save the session to hard drive, a once-only remaster of the CD is required. Look at the snapshot, it unambiguously states "once only", and "please insert a blank CD or DVD".
So you do not use a -RW, you burn a new CD, with the save-file location hard coded into it.

It was a design decision I made for the original CD not to probe the hard drive.
Of course, I could go the Puppy-route and put some drive-probing into it -- which I might do if it turns out that nobody likes this idea of having to burn another CD.

So, yes, the second CD is hard coded for a specific partition, filesystem and folder (with optional path), so won't work on another PC unless you set it up with that same partition/filesystem/folder.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 11:24**

mavrothal wrote:
BarryK wrote:You haven't looked at the 'init' script.

If the q.sfs is saved alongside s.sfs, it is removed from the CD.

The install instructions are unambiguous, as per the snapshot you posted above.
The CD has to get remastered as part of the process.
Maybe so but before I look again please let us know
a) if it is possible to boot from the original CD (_not_ a remaster) and have a save folder with _only_ the s.sfs on a partition? EDIT: It would appear "no"
b) if the above _is_ possible what the boot line arguments would be to use the said save folder (provided there is no /BOOT_SPECS file)? EDIT: Is possible. See below.
Thx

Latter OK
Code: Select all
quirky boot_specs=sda1:ext4:werewolf64-7.3
(or what ever partition:filesystem:folder is) works.
Kind like fatdog.

Bit later It would appear that the q.sfs _must_ be copied to hard disk too. Although the save dialog provides the option not to copy it to the HD, this results in a kernel panic on next boot with the above arguments.
This is because the init defaults in loading q.sfs from $QPATH if QPATH exits.
Maybe split QPATH to QPATH and SPATH to allow loading from different devices/partitions.

Yes, you are right!

Booting the live-CD, then saving a session, which requires burning another CD, might seem a hassle, but apart from hard-coding the save-file location, it does one more thing, move the q.sfs out of the CD to the hard drive.

Frugal install does the same thing.

This results in very fast booting, as q.sfs was previously inside the initrd so had to get loaded at bootup.

Note, the reason I put q.sfs inside the initrd was to avoid any drive probing at bootup. This makes the init script very "situation agnostic", for net boots or whatever.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 11:41**

linuxcbon wrote: - why are perl and python not in devx ?
- why is there /usr/local/install_quirky/ when there is a standalone version ?

This quirky is quite nice at the moment, except for seamonkey crashes.

There is only perl_tiny, the full perl is in the devx. I want to keep perl_tiny for now.

Yes, sometime ago I decided to put python into the main f.s.
I need to rethink this, should probably put it out to the devx.

/usr/local/install_quirky has /usr/sbin/installquirky, which runs it.

The standalone version is an alternative, that can be created to use anywhere, in another distro.

Running in Quirky, the standalone version is not needed, it is builtin, in the menu.

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 11:43**

linuxcbon wrote:This quirky is quite nice at the moment, except for seamonkey crashes.

I am running SM 2.39 now, so far so good!

Posted: **Thu 12 Nov 2015, 12:45**

Can this version of Quirky Werewolf run 32-bit applications?

If so - time to give it a spin.

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Quirky Werewolf 64-bit 7.4 released

The "Save" desktop utility

Re: The "Save" desktop utility

Re: The "Save" desktop utility