KDE for Testers !!!

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pakt · #101 Post by **pakt** » Mon 14 Nov 2005, 16:59

Nathan F wrote: As far as a custom KDE Puppy, that's actually not too far fetched. I'm pretty sure I could get an iso together using the files out of this installation and keep it around the size of Chubby Puppy. Basically I'd just cut down everything else in favor of the KDE apps, so we're looking at a barebones sized puppy at around 30-40 MB plus the KDE files which compress to around 60 MB, so the worst case scenario is around 100MB. I don't know of any KDE distro that small, guys. It almost makes me want to do it.

Sounds like a great idea. That way you know that all the pieces are in place and working (like with Chubby Puppy...)

Nathan F wrote:From the feedback I've gotten on OpenOffice, I think it's already pretty intimidating for most new users to use usr_more. I've had questions over and over again about it, both in the public forum and private messages. Expect the same kind of response to this no matter how straightforward you think you've made it to install.
Nathan

Is there anything that says you can't have it both ways - a custom KDE Puppy and usr_more.sfs for those prefering to keep things modular?

#102 Post by MU » Mon 14 Nov 2005, 17:12

pakt wrote:Is there anything that says you can't have it both ways - a custom KDE Puppy and usr_more.sfs for those prefering to keep things modular?

No, I think it will be great to have a KDE-Puppy.
I just wrote, that me myself I will concentrate on usr_more.sfs.

But if for example Nathan uses it partially or completely to build up a special Puppy, I would really enjoy that

We also will have enough servers now to spread it, Ted_Dog, Rob and me now have enough capacity to host larger files

-------------
Bombayrockers, I will test your new files tomorrow.
Wanted to go asleep 3 hours ago, but was wakened up.
Now I am in this "tired, but can't sleep"-state, too unconcentrated to test stuff.

Mark

rarsa · #103 Post by **rarsa** » Mon 14 Nov 2005, 17:35

OK, This thread has been moving fast and I haven't had time to follow it.

So much has been happening that I don't know what I need to download to setup KDE. The last thing I did was install a usr_more.sfs with the KDE, but that version still had conflicts with the qt libraries.

So, what posts should I look at? What are the latest packages and installs I should get?

Thank you,

#104 Post by MU » Mon 14 Nov 2005, 18:01

http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic ... 2873#22873

Or use the small usr_more.sfs in the link to the install-description.
And all addons mentioned there and in the install-description.

Then the two new addons (AmaroK and missing libs) from Bombayrockers on this page (7).
Plus Quanta from this Page (Nathan), if you like.

Hope I forgot nothing.

Mark

rob · #105 Post by **rob** » Mon 14 Nov 2005, 21:02

Hey guys,
What steps need to be taken before we can roll up all the improvements onto a demo cd? I hear a new kde release is imminent, so I presume thats part of the hold up.

I'm thinking of making a distro based on puppy with customisations for Manchester University settings and a couple of extra apps, which I will hopefully also be able to release as dotpups (If I can get my head round how to make a dotpup!)

I definitely would like to see KDE in there with all the apps and the boosted kernel, as I feel it would help the people who haven't heard of linux to use it. I'd stick antivirus/spyware (if you can get antispyware for linux??) on there so all the people who crap their pcs up can use it. I'd also put QTparted, JDK, Novel client, webmail and other appropriate pre-set favorites, settings for applications, and maybe even a download and install script for any university linux apps off the network to avoid licensing issues.

Anyone got any other suggestions? I'm thinking I might start with a few electronic engineering specific programs, then release packs of apps for the different faculties, to keep size down and speed up.

saintlangton · #106 Post by **saintlangton** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 00:02

rob wrote: I'd stick antivirus/spyware (if you can get antispyware for linux??)

I dunno about linux based antispyware but I just tryed SpybotSD on puppy using wine and it seems to work! (With a bit of general faffing and showing odd error messages...) I'm just now rebooting into windows to get it infected and see if winespybot can sort it out...

Chris

Update:

Sucessfully got Windows spyware infected. (not exactly difficult) Confirmed infection by running spybot, made sure didn't remove. Booted into puppy ran spybot in wine. It did what seemed to be a full check. It found nothing

Booted back into windows ran spybot again - detected the same stuff as before.

Spybot seems to run in wine (with a bit of moaning and lots of messages appearing in rxvt...) but doesn't do anything useful {At least in my attempt} sorry for getting anyones hopes up. Perhaps someone else may be able to do it better or try a different program etc. but for now I'm done.

Goodnight

Nathan F · #107 Post by **Nathan F** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 01:19

What Spybot does is it looks for active spyware progams in memory. Since you weren't booted into Windows there wasn't anything to detect.

I'm wondering what this has to do with KDE?

Nathan

#108 Post by MU » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 03:03

Rob, you should not fix on my KDE 3.5 -message.This is my personal "release-plan".
I think Nathan already works on the KDE 3.4.1-Puppy.
Bombayrockers suggested to use the new KDE 3.4.2 from kslax in a personal message.

So it is up to you, how much time you can/want to enable.

Concerning dotpup:
There are descriptions in the Wiki/Faq - Overview: http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=672 , there is stuff related in my Wizard-message: http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=2138

usr_more.sfs is completely different from Dotpups: http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=3631

Use Dotpups for small programs, usr_more for a collection of larger ones.

The rest of your ideas was quite specific (related to special programs), so I would suggest to start new threads concerning each program.

A JDK has completely other issues than a KDE for example.

Mark

bombayrockers · #109 Post by **bombayrockers** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 05:47

Amarok requires python for scripts and libxine for non-kde users.
Does any body have python packged for puppy. SLAX packages has python2.4 mini package ~5 mb.

MU wrote

On Nov. 23, KDE 3.5 will be released.

klax is based on slax and features the latest version of kde currently 3.5 rc1. So as soon as kde 3.5 is released klax will come up with the latest version. So we rather wait until its released. However making KDE-puppy
based on 3.4.1 is OK. Its a solid base. I am downloading Klax-koffice 1.4.2 now. It has the complete koffice 1.4.2 . I will extract koffice and try to run it on top of the present installation. If it works well then puppy can be stripped of its packges in favour of KDE & KOffice.

Also, People at slax are using the devel module for slax + kdevelop to compile kde-apps for slax. I will try to tame this to make a usr_kdevx.sfs thus making a complete KDE-Puppy.

Lobster · #110 Post by **Lobster** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 08:15

bombayrockers wrote:Amarok requires python for scripts and libxine for non-kde users.
Does any body have python packged for puppy.

Yes Nathans Grafpup has a Python package that I had working on Puppy Sizzler (current 1.0.6 Puppy)

Under misc near the bottom of this page . . .
http://grafpup.com/packages/

PeterSieg · #111 Post by **PeterSieg** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 10:12

Hi.

Yesterday I tried the 2 remaster scripts from AlienX with my puppy 1.0.6rc+
xorg+kde installation. Both created error messages at Xdialog? So I replaced Xdialog in the head of each script with a fixed DATA="/mnt/data". Before starting each script, I mounted a 500MB ext2 partition to /mnt/data.
The full remaster than run and produced a app 150MB iso file. However,
booting it results in error messages (can't mount /proc etc.) and I consider this a complete failure!? The fast remaster script produced a 90MB iso??!
When I add all things together, it should be around app. 150MB..?

So I thought about other possibilities to transfer such an installation to
another system, without the need to install all pup's and tgz again...

So everything installed after first boot up is inside pup001 file.
So 'cloning' just this file should be enough!

I got out of X. I did not umount /mnt/home. Just cd /mnt/home
tar czvf pup001.tgz pup001
I transfered this pup001.tgz to the puppy iso image.
Booted the other pc with option 3.
mounted /dev/hda1 on /mnt/home using pmount.
mounted /dev/hdc on /mnt/hdc using pmount.
opened a terminal.. cd /mnt/home
tar zxvf /mnt/hdc/pup001.tgz (resulting in pup001 file clone)
then rebooted - and had my clone up and running...
One maybe has to delete /etc/mousedevice to allow setting up a different mouse type etc.

So this is a poor man cloning

Then I thought, maybe this could be a nice feature to be build inside
puppy... If looking for the PFILE and don't find one, look on cd for
a pup001.tgz and if found, extract it to PHOME to start with a cloned
pup001 file instead of a fresh/empty one..?

What do you thing?

PS

rob · #112 Post by **rob** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 11:39

I apologise, I meant to write on KDE but got sidetracked as usual and began rambling off topic. I realise the difference between dotpups and usr_more but don't understand how to get a usr_more onto a live cd remaster. And while I'm at it how big is the full KDE games?

Nathan F · #113 Post by **Nathan F** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 18:08

The way I intend to build an iso (once I've finished work on Grafpup-1.0.1) is to extract the KDE files and make them into an unleashed package. I will then build the iso using PuppyUnleashed. Unleashed packages are actually quite a bit easier to make than dotpups, which is a little known fact.

The tricky part is getting all of the customizations into the iso, like a Puppified KDE menu for instance. This will all have to be setup on a running installation and then transferred to the unleashed package, making for several generations of iso images after all of the tweaking.

In order to extract the files all one has to do is mount the sqaush file and copy them over. If you have KDE running already then you would just copy everything out of /.usr_more into the directory you're building the unleashed package in. This would be something like ..../puppy-unleashed/packages/KDE-3.4/.

Other than that I intend to tear out everything from Puppy that is duplicated by KDE. That means goodbye Mozilla, Sylpheed, Gaim, gFTP (Konqueror can function just like an ftp client), Beaver and Leafpad, etc. etc. I'm thinking I can get the size under 100MB and have a full desktop environment still.

I don't have enough hard drive space to build this in parallell with Grafpup so it may have to wait for a little while. If someone else wants to give it a try in the meantime go right ahead.

Nathan

rarsa · #114 Post by **rarsa** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 18:22

nathen F wrote:The tricky part is getting all of the customizations into the iso, like a Puppified KDE menu for instance

Not that tricky. Just time consuming.

With the development I've done for the dynamic xdg menu generation project, 95% of the work is already done.

I am right now finishing a first proposal for KDE menu where we leave the KDE menu as is (Keeping it as the default KDE menu) and adding an entry for the Puppy applications.

Reorganizing to a different structure will be quite easy. I may play with different alternatives.

I tried merging the puppy entries with the kde entries but each resulting menu was huge.

I'm at the last stage right now just trying to figure out where should I create symlinks to the icons so they show in the menu.

Here is a first cut without the icons.

Nathan F · #115 Post by **Nathan F** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 19:31

That's a neet trick, Rarsa. I've been too busy with some other projects to have much of a look at the dynamic menu project. I'll have to read up on it.

I'm currently uploading Grafpup-101 release candidate to the server. I wanted to mention here one of the features I built into it as it's related to this thread. I added more loop devices to the iso (there are now nine total instead of five) and modified the bootup scripts to mount usr_kde.sfs just like it mounts usr_more.sfs, making it possible to run both KDE and OpenOffice as seperate modules. This seems to be working pretty well for me at the moment and I thought something similar might be a good idea for Puppy. As a matter of fact I know it's been brought up several times before.

If all goes well with the testing of this release and there aren't any significant bugs then the final release will be in about a week, after which I could get started on a KDE-Puppy iso if everyone's still interested.

Nathan

bombayrockers · #116 Post by **bombayrockers** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 21:57

I have found a solution to a light weight kde desktop consisting of
rox + openbox + kde. See to beieive.
Will release a package tommorow. Very sleepy, got to go to sleep.

#117 Post by MU » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 22:22

Bombayrockers, thats great!

In the dotpups-forum someone suggested to compile KDE-runtime-libraries for AmaroK only.
I don't really like that idea, because once you release that, the next one certainly will ask "can you add support for Kxxxx, too?".

So if we have a "mini-KDE", that might solve that

Sleep well small doggy

Mark

rob · #118 Post by **rob** » Tue 15 Nov 2005, 23:46

How is KDE Light as used in pocketlinux? I believe this was meant to be a similar cut-down version of full KDE developed by the official KDE team (if my memory serves me ok, no promises) Would this better suit puppy?

bombayrockers · #119 Post by **bombayrockers** » Wed 16 Nov 2005, 05:07

Rob,
This idea of mine is based on pocketlinux. they are using
openbox + fbpanel + kdm for a light wt desktop.
However because we have a great light wt desktop manager in the form of rox so we use rox instead of kdm. kicker does a fine job so lets stick to it.
I have also contacted joe who made jwm to know whether it would be possible to strip jwm to work only as a wm and transfer the panel control to kicker.

*EDIT* MU has posted oroborus window manager which is equally functional and looks better than openbox. I will make a dotpup of that + kdetrayproxy from openbox.pup and release later.

.xinitrc

*EDIT2*
the /opt/kde/share/autostart folder contains .desktop files which started at startup. We dont want the kdesktop starting up so go to /opt/kde/share/autostart and remove kdesktop.desktop from that and back it up.
To startkde with the kdesktop you will have to reinstate this file back to /opt/kde/share/autostart

*EDIT3*
Uploaded a new dotpup.
backup your /root/.xinitrc
install openbox.pup
.xinitrc and startkdeob are inside the dotpup.
removed all instances of -o option for rox from the .xinitrc
checked for any missing dependencies using ldd - binaries in this package are the same as the earlier package only changes made to .xinitrc and startkdeob

ZERO STEP-> remove kdesktop.desktop as above

FIRST STEP -> xwin jwm -> rxvt -> openbox -> if openbox is working rxvt window will say 'another window manager running on screen 0'. if it says anthing else please let me know

SECOND STEP -> xwin openbox -> -o option for rox already removed the flaoting icon problem should should not occur.

THIRD STEP -> xwin startkdeob

_________________
Boosted Puppy Kernel (2.4.29) available
Download Here

bombayrockers · #120 Post by **bombayrockers** » Wed 16 Nov 2005, 08:21

amarok .py scripts do not work with with python from grafpup site. .py scripts search for python in /usr/bin/env
also they require PyQt.

any idea what can be done ??

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