xenialPup-7.0.6 32-bits with kernel 4.1

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nbah07
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat 28 Apr 2018, 23:09

targeted hardware

#141 Post by nbah07 »

{ESL here}
hello,
hehe i'm in trouble.
This is Atom N450 CPU with 2 GB RAM with a distro release version that doesn't support its own' repository hplip's wifi feature . {...] or something like that. (from what a launchpad bee worker wrote me) So I plan a move, to Puppy.
I've read some notes across Puppy domains about LxPup, Slacko 6.3.0 and XenialPup kernel 4.1 would suit best my netbook (box).
What are the security — or else concerns of having an old distro or old kernel running the system?
I am aware LxPup has recent updates[ ...] but LXDE? didn't its devs move to LxQt? Who is running LXDE, or what such matter would impact my computer usage?
Ah, I would better prefer to get a distro with minimal kernel (moded targeted at my hardware) + minimal pkgs for user friendlyness/web online video studying (college) and usual homework productivity programs.
Slacko64 fsfinstaller' full installer doesn't work? Maintainer recommends frugal install [...] I think this box handles 64 arch well, though = "Towards overall compatibility". I had reach couple programs which were not meant to 32 bit, so I had switched to 64 arch since that event.
Have a great time!

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mikeslr
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#142 Post by mikeslr »

Hi nbah07,

Best to repost your computer's specs and concerns on the Beginner's Section and ask for recommendations. However, here's my take.

Even though your computer's specs can support a 64-bit operating system you'll get much more responsive performance from a 32-bit system and should use one for as long as you can. Currently, there are very few 64-bit applications for which you won't be able to find a 32-bit version built for Puppies. However, the long term availability of the major 32-bit Web-browsers is questionable. Puppy Devs and Packagers are still providing 32-bit pets and/or SFSes of web-browsers based on Chrome and its clones, and firefox and its clones. I wouldn't be worried about the next year or so, but later is anybody's guess. If you don't know what an SFS is, be sure to find out.

If I recall correctly, support for LxQt has languished while Lxde continues. As you probably know, this version of Xenialpup does not include Lxde out-of-the box and it would be a PITA to try to install and configure that window manager. However, you could install FbBox. Just download the pet from here, http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 018#769018, Left-Click it and follow the instructions. It offers almost everything that Lxde has --AFAIK, the exception is that panels can only have one vertical or horizontal row-- and has several nifty features which Lxpanel lacks. With the exceptions of LxPups and those using xfce as window manager, it can be installed in any Puppy. OpenboxPlus (choice of LxPanel or Tint2) is available here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 730#703730. Not certain it will work under Puppies not mentioned there.

Frugal is the generally recommended way to install Puppies. When so installed they can be configured so that the data files created by applications are directory written to your storage media while everything else --such as the junk you unknowingly pick up while surfing-- exists only in RAM and is cleared when you reboot/shutdown. This and other unique aspects of Frugal Puppies make them particularly safe against malware infestations. Current versions of openssl can be installed in any Puppy which is less than 5 years old, maybe older. Current versions of Chrome and Clones are configured to run as Spot -- a limited user without access beyond its own folder. You can copy files from that folder, but anything which remains in it, in a frugal install with Automatic Save Removed, will be deleted on reboot/shutdown. I think firefox (and clones) can also be configured to run as Spot, but haven't bothered to test.

As far as I know, meltdown is only a threat to 64-bit systems. I may be wrong, but as far I know the only 32-bit Puppy whose kernel has been patched against it is BionicPup 18.05. There are, however, several kernel packages available including patches; and with Puppies changing kernels is a simple procedure. Most of those kernel packages are 64-bit (you can use a 64-bit Kernel with a 32-bit operating system) but all kernels beyond 4.1 may degrade performance given your computer's specs. Suggest you see how well BionicPup works on your computer before sacrificing performance to avoid a theoretical threat.

By the way, once you've downloaded an ISO and installed or mounted it (just Right-click) you can copy its vmlinuz, zdrv_name_and_number.sfs, and some Puppies include a fdrv_name_and_number.sfs, to another location. That's all a kernel package consists of. They can then be used with a different recent (4 years +/-) target Puppy, substituting them for the vmlinuz, zdrv.sfs and fdrv.sfs of the target Puppy once the names of the later two files are edited to the name and number of the target Puppy.

So if BionicPup's kernel doesn't present a problem, but you like the look-and-feel of XYZ Puppy better, or XYZ Puppy offers a necessary application which BionicPup lacks, you can mix-and-match.

You might also take a look at this post: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 775#989775 Slacko 5.7.1 is a solid "work-horse", lighter on resources. Many usable pets and SFSes and Slackware 14.0 repos and applications (some new) are available. AFAIK, only current versions of Chrome & clones are NOT available.

mikesLr

nbah07
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat 28 Apr 2018, 23:09

sorry previous intromission

#143 Post by nbah07 »

Musher0, with uppercase M, indeed,
you've just got a new follower
No, I am neither a dog or stalker.
MikesLr, good fellow, set bright over stubbornness as well.
Hope I can deal with any upcoming architecture issue.

musher0
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Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#144 Post by musher0 »

Thanks, nbah07.
Welcome aboard!
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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tallboy
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#145 Post by tallboy »

PC Manufacturer: Hewlett-Packard
Product Name:

Motherboard Vendor: Hewlett-Packard
Product Name: 0864h

BIOS Vendor: Hewlett-Packard
Version: 786B1 v1.14
Release Date: 07/11/2003

Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.60GHz
Max Speed: 3200 MHz
Current Speed of Core 0:2600 MHz

Frequency governor : performance
Freq. scaling driver : p4-clockmod

Sensor status is not available, or required kernel drivers are not loaded.

Personal Storage: RAM Disk
Size Used Free Use%
3.8G 594M 3.2G 16%

Memory Allocation:
Total RAM: 992 MB
Used RAM: 711 MB
Free RAM: 281 MB
Buffers: 48 MB
Cached: 416 MB
Total Swap: 6159 MB
Free Swap: 5700 MB

Actual Used RAM: 247 MB Used - (buffers + cached)
Actual Free RAM: 745 MB Free + (buffers + cached)
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True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.

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tallboy
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#146 Post by tallboy »

And this extra post only tell that this XenialPup does not save to a multisession CD, so I now run Lucid again.
True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.

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paulh177
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Suspend to RAM

#147 Post by paulh177 »

So, I finally got a wrinkle smoothed out that was stopping me swinging over to Xenial from Precise - suspend to ram.

I've used acpitool for years to manage suspending, but I just couldn't make it work with Xenial, whatever combination of acpi options I plugged into the boot parameters (which had worked for older pups on my 2008 Acer AspireOne AOA150, 1GB, Atom N270)

The problem was that when I ran acpitool -s, the machine would power down, but immediately power up again. Frustrating.

The solution lay with the file /proc/acpi/wakeup.

You can't create or delete files in /proc without writing a module for the kernel, but you can view and manipulate them.

On my freshly booted (frugal) Xenial, /proc/acpi/wakeup looks like this:

Code: Select all

Device  S-state   Status   Sysfs node
P32         S4    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1e.0
UHC1      S3    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1d.0
UHC2      S3    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1d.1
UHC3      S3    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1d.2
UHC4      S3    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1d.3
ECHI        S3    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1d.7
EXP1       S4    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1c.0
EXP2       S4    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1c.1
EXP3       S4    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1c.2
EXP4       S4    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1c.3
AZAL       S0    *enabled   pci:0000:00:1b.0
MODM     S0    *disabled
Where S-state = S3, we have to reset *enabled to *disabled.

Adding the following lines to /etc/profile or /etc/profile.local sorts this out:

Code: Select all

echo "UHC1  S3  *disabled" > /proc/acpi/wakeup
echo "UHC2  S3  *disabled" > /proc/acpi/wakeup
echo "UHC3  S3  *disabled" > /proc/acpi/wakeup
echo "UHC4  S3  *disabled" > /proc/acpi/wakeup
echo "ECHI   S3  *disabled" > /proc/acpi/wakeup
(Someone else will have to explain why tf these devices automagically wake up a laptop when you don't want them to, 'cause I don't have a clue ...)

One day I'll get round to seeing if I can get the damn thing to hibernate to disk.

hth someone.
:)

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glene77is
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#148 Post by glene77is »

Reply is related to the slowdown during boot,
traced to "sfs_load" and "fixmenus".

Here, we run several 1999 to 2001 M$-XP computers.
Currently, we run a Hewlitt-Packard, 3GHz clock, 1GB Ram.
We setup the HP system, original M$XP MBR to boot into grldr, menu.lst.
This is a multi-boot method, allowing back-booting into M$XP .
(1) HP : Normally, we run the Puppy Xenial 7.08 system,
totally on Flash Drives, Frugal Install.
There is a Slow-Down during boot. Traced and measured 20 seconds total.
(2) HP : There is a Frugal install on a Hard-Drive, ext 2 partition.
When the Hard-Drive system is booted, it run much like the FlashDrive system.
There is a Slow-Down during boot. Traced and measured 20 seconds total.

(3) When we run the same Xenialpup 7.08 on a Dell LapTop, Lattitude D630,
Dual-Core, with 2 GB Ram,
with the same Xenialpup OS frugally installed on HardDrive :
there is a Slow-Down during boot. Traced and measured 30 seconds total.

Attached are my automated traces for the "sfs_load" and the "fixmenus"
which show the processes which are involved in the "lingering boot" .

Reply is related to the slowdown during boot,
traced to "sfs_load" and "fixmenus".

I will post this whole reply to my website
www.GeoCities.WS/glene77is

Hope this helps. Glen Ellis
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Puppy Linux is more fun than a barrel of M$ monkeys :P
www.geocities.WS/glene77is
glene77is --- {^,^} --- electricity is shocking, Memphis, TN, USA.

musher0
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#149 Post by musher0 »

Hi Glen.

Thanks for your report.

A couple of remarks if I may:

In my mind, it is obvious that loading two large sfs' such as Libre Office
and Chrome on oldish hardware -- at boot-up, along with the rest of the Pup
-- is likely to take a bit of time. Not that you should not, but please realize
your hardware is probably giving its maximum.

We should be glad that this old horse can load ~ 1 Gb of material at all in
30-40 seconds! :) (And please give it all the oats it wants!) :)

Have you tried unpacking those large packages into the pupsave file (make
it big enough, eh?), and retesting the boot time?

~~~~~~~~~

My second remark concerns the fixmenus utility: I am not surprised.

if you do not force me, I tend NOT to run my xenial-7.0.6 with jwm. I try to
use a window manager that does NOT rely on fixmenus, e.g.
-- icewm (with my new menu-construction script),
-- wmx (there are 7-8 color themes to choose from),
-- echinus (almost 50 color themes),
-- waimea (reasonable number of very adaptable native themes, plus some
blackbox themes are available),
-- even aewm, if you like adventure!

In other words, use a WM that does not use the fixmenus utility and the
other half of your slowness problem is solved. (Mind you, with old hw like
this, you will never get Formula One-type performance.)

I have to dig up the thread, but fixmenus was proven inefficient many years
ago, when forum member technosaurus produced an altermative to it. My
menu-construction scripts for all of the above alternative WM's are all based
/ derived on his work (and on work by former member aragon). Fixmenus
has been improved a bit through the years, but it is still a slow-poke.

BFN.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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glene77is
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#150 Post by glene77is »

musher0
Thanks for the experienced comments.
Time is not so bad, in my experience.
I turn it on, go grab a cup of tea, and Linux is ready.

Savefile is a Directory. May try the unpack method.
Browser is German "IRON" v.56. (fork from Google Chrome) ,
unless a web site complains ( requesting FireFox or Chrome ).

Overall, running on 1G Ram, and totally on flash drives
on old vintage equipment ... this runs OK.
Fits with an old geeky engineer's view of life.

I compare the pro and con .
(1) (a) Flash Drives are totally portable to other computers of this vintage.
(1) (b) This puppy method , with daily savefile archive ,
offers great security.

(2) (a) I don't want to buy a new M$ system, not on my budget,
(2) (b) I don't want learn how to make it perform, not on my time.
(2) (c) That would be fun, but after five decades,
ever since building up systems from the Apple II era,
I just want to stay away from M$ , and tinker with Linux.

(3) Mostly my interest is Linear I.C. Design for Amateur Radio
with browse access into PartSIM ( SPICE simulator ) !.

Have read lots of good comments on this forum.
Good Luck, young man !
Puppy Linux is more fun than a barrel of M$ monkeys :P
www.geocities.WS/glene77is
glene77is --- {^,^} --- electricity is shocking, Memphis, TN, USA.

musher0
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Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#151 Post by musher0 »

Thanks for the good wishes, including the "young" part! ;)

Like you, I think that going back to any WhineDose incarnation is not worth
the trouble on any hardware, while there are Linux's around.

BFN.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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glene77is
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#152 Post by glene77is »

Musher
Do you think Xenialpup 64 bit could run on a 2001 HP 32 bit computer ?
Have always run 32 bit Linux, but future developments are going to 64 bit.

Here, I use grub4dos .
Ever since I compared Ubuntu vs Puppy, about seven years ago,
and switched to the compacted system files of Puppy,
I have used grub4dos.
Puppy Linux is more fun than a barrel of M$ monkeys :P
www.geocities.WS/glene77is
glene77is --- {^,^} --- electricity is shocking, Memphis, TN, USA.

musher0
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Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#153 Post by musher0 »

Hi glene77is.

I am afraid i can be of little help concerning 64-bit Puppies. The only one
I have used is Just_Lighthouse_64-604, by forum member Dry_Falls, and
it is fabulous!

I tried a xenialPup64 once, but its performance was sluggish on my set-
up (please see attached description). So that was that, I removed it.

A sixty-four-bit Pup has the same apps as its 32-bit counterpart. If it does
not offer the speed advantage -- or maybe a needed driver written for a 64-
bit PC--, IMO, installing it is not worth the trouble.

BFN.
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musher0
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glene77is
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#154 Post by glene77is »

Musher,
I have been noticing that the subroutine in sfs_load "waitsplash"
does not do anything.
I have tried running the line
/usr/lib/gtkdialog/box_splash -text "$* $(gettext "Wait a moment ...")"
at the end of the rc.shutdown program.
( end of the shutdown is where I test routines).

. /usr/lib/gtkdialog/box_splash -text "$* $(gettext "Wait a moment ...")"

What is the "$*" , a variable ?

If you could, please, suggest a correction (or tutorial text)
on this simple routine.
BASH has been an interesting, if convoluted, experience.

As a background,
I spent several decades writing commercial relational-databases
in the highly structured world of FoxPro and T-SQL.
BASH is not so highly structured.



...
Puppy Linux is more fun than a barrel of M$ monkeys :P
www.geocities.WS/glene77is
glene77is --- {^,^} --- electricity is shocking, Memphis, TN, USA.

musher0
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Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#155 Post by musher0 »

glene77is wrote:Musher,
I have been noticing that the subroutine in sfs_load "waitsplash"
does not do anything.
I have tried running the line
/usr/lib/gtkdialog/box_splash -text "$* $(gettext "Wait a moment ...")"
at the end of the rc.shutdown program.
( end of the shutdown is where I test routines).

. /usr/lib/gtkdialog/box_splash -text "$* $(gettext "Wait a moment ...")"

What is the "$*" , a variable ?

If you could, please, suggest a correction (or tutorial text)
on this simple routine.
BASH has been an interesting, if convoluted, experience.

As a background,
I spent several decades writing commercial relational-databases
in the highly structured world of FoxPro and T-SQL.
BASH is not so highly structured.
...
Hi glene77is.

Reading your background, I feel you must be way ahead of me on so
many computing subjects. You are a professional and I am only an
"amateur" (hopefully in the positive sense of the word). As a university
student, I tried APL (unsuccessfully!) for a few months, then many years
later Atari Basic and TurboBasic, then with Puppy, bash (and a bit of ash).

I haver never ventured into gtkdialog coding, so I cannot help you,
unfortunately.

The simplest thing to do IMO would be to mention this oversight directly
to the author of sfs_load, "shinobar". AFAIK, he has not posted on this
board for a long time. Try PM'ing him anyway? Who knows, maybe he's
still around, lurking ?!

Other that that, off the top of my head, I'd say your go-to persons for
gtkdialog code would be forum members "MochiMoppei" and "wiak".
Perhaps send them a PM? There are other competent gtkdiapog coders
on this board, but their names escape me at this time.

Also, there are a few gtkdialog threads on the forum: perhaps browse
through them and / or repost your question in one of them.

Best of luck. Sorry I cannot be of more help...

~~~~~~~~~
PS. I almost forgot to mention that one sure way of drawing attention to
the problem, and potentially a solution to it, is to create a separate thread
for the problem.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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glene77is
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#156 Post by glene77is »

Musher,
Thank you for the informative and tempered response.
We are who we are.
Your suggestion to post in a new topic is appropriate.
I have found a tutorial on GTK,
and (functionally) this is not a serious problem.
I did resolve the problem of "where" Xenial is slowing down.

Wished I were a young man and a serious student, again.
That is what got me into radio electronics and Linux.
BASH is a bitch , but there is much more BASH code in this river
... the learning curve into complex functions
is steeper than first appears.
Copying previous working system code is a good first step.
I have found several good tutorials.

Thanks again,
and I hope you continue your serious interest
in these technologies.

My website is www.GeoCities.WS/glene77is
Puppy Linux is more fun than a barrel of M$ monkeys :P
www.geocities.WS/glene77is
glene77is --- {^,^} --- electricity is shocking, Memphis, TN, USA.

musher0
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Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#157 Post by musher0 »

Hello all.

Pet archives for text editors:

cudatext-1.55 ( url] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CudaText [/url])

AND

joe-4.6 ( url] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe's_Own_Editor [/url])

for xenialPup-7.0.6 (a 32-bit PuppyLinux) are now available for download
and install from: http://augras.eu/puppy_linux/?dir=musher0/Editeurs

Enjoy!
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

Dry Falls
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Location: Upper Columbia

#158 Post by Dry Falls »

glene77is wrote:Do you think Xenialpup 64 bit could run on a 2001 HP 32 bit computer ?
As far as I know, trying to boot a 64bit os on a 32 bit box will break the processor! The obverse is, on the other hand, ok.

df

ps, thanks for the compliment, Musher. 604 is a bit buggy. In some ways, JL64 just keeps getting worse! but I'm trying.
BASH is a bitch , but there is much more BASH code in this river
... the learning curve into complex functions
is steeper than first appears.
Copying previous working system code is a good first step.
is an understatement!

musher0
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Joined: Mon 05 Jan 2009, 00:54
Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#159 Post by musher0 »

Hello, bash haters! ;)

I beg to disagree with both of you!

Bash is a fine programming environment. It's dynamic (as in "runtime"), it
can call into play any GNU utility, plus the richness of awk, the ANSI
escape codes, and even incorporate a few short C one-liners.

(Before you tag ANSI escape codes as passé, please read recent reports
about it. You will find that ANSI can now give access to 24-bit colors.
I repeat: 24-bit colors. Now tell me, what is passé about 24-bit colors?) :)

If you write your bash script with the attitude: "Yerk, this is bash code",
you won't get far. But give it a fighting chance, and you might be happily
surprised by all it can do for you.

Finally, if you write bash code, do not hesitate to use a worthy terminal
for it: by that I mean urxvt-9.2* compiled with "everything" (sic). I have
tried quite a few other terminals, and nothing compares to recent urxvt
versions. (This is not a sales pitch, I'm serious.)

BFN.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

musher0
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Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

#160 Post by musher0 »

Hello all.

I forgot to mention it in my previous post:

AFAIK (you can research the Web to double-check, but I think the following
statement will stand the test),

there is a consensus among developers to the effect that bash has
the best string|variable processing capacity in the business -- bar none.


BFN.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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