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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
LxPup : a Puppy with LXDE as its desktop environment
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peebee


Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 3497
Location: Worcestershire, UK

PostPosted: Tue 06 Feb 2018, 08:18    Post subject:  

LxPupArtful-17.11+5 has been uploaded - based on ArtfulPup-17.11+14

iso

delta

includes the fix to run-as-spot for mozilla webbrowsers

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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 1086
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Wed 07 Feb 2018, 20:54    Post subject:  

Both LxPupArtful (+4 to +5) and ArtfulPup (+13 to +14) updated on two of my i5 laptops using the deltas. md5sums correct, No issues expected, none seen in a days use of both. I am running the 4.14.17 64-bit kernel from the most recent LxPupSc uneventfully in these, mostly for the meltdown & spectre mitigation. I use pretty much the stock disk-drive icon placement in Artful and set up my own desktop layout in LxPupArtful where it's pie-simple. Right now, LxPupArtful seems to be my top dog. I'm always amazed when I commit some error like not loading a browser SFS or something that goofs up a .desktop and the LXDE panel just quietly hides the associated item in the panel launchers and when I miss it, scritch my head, fix the .desktop and restart the WM it's back. I've blown any number of XFCE4 panels and 'reverted' more than a few jwm panels doing similar things Embarassed
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Pups currently in kennel Very Happy LxPupSc and X-slacko-4.4 for my users; LxPupSc, LxPupSc64, and LxPupBB for me. All good pups indeed, and all running savefiles for look'n'feel only. Browsers, etc. solely from SFS. Now tazpup for puzzles Smile
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belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1552

PostPosted: Sat 10 Feb 2018, 05:45    Post subject:  

peebee wrote:
belham2 wrote:
...but only in "Run-As-Spot" mode. When running as "root" all is well.

Aaaaaahhhhh .... significant extra information not mentioned previously....

Palemoon when run-as-spot in both LxPupArtful and LxPupXenial produces the warning on startup.

Palemoon in LxPupSc run-as-spot does not exhibit this warning.

Other web browsers run-as-spot in LxPupArtful do not exhibit this warning - i.e. Light, Firefox and Chromium (always runs-as-spot).

My advice is therefore do not run Palemoon as run-as-spot in Ubuntu based LxPups.....either run Palemoon as root or run another browser as spot.



Hi Peebee,

Got your message. Have been running Palemoon run-as-spot no problems now.

Thanks!
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peebee


Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 3497
Location: Worcestershire, UK

PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2018, 07:32    Post subject:  

LxPupArtful-17.11+6 has been uploaded - based on ArtfulPup-17.11+16

iso

delta

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01101001b


Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 47
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina

PostPosted: Thu 19 Apr 2018, 19:06    Post subject:  

peebee wrote:
LxPupArtful-17.11+6 has been uploaded - based on ArtfulPup-17.11+16
Wow! Great! (Updating...) Thanks so much!
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humanise

Joined: 22 Apr 2011
Posts: 16
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPosted: Sun 29 Apr 2018, 05:52    Post subject: My LXpup Intro/overview.  

My LXpup Intro/overview.

The following is my notes on LXpups after coming from use of standard Puppy Xenial (& earlier tahr & precise) Operating Systems and now using LXpup Xenial 32 (with a Kernal change to give me PAE). I expect that previous Puppy users converting to other LXpups will find similar results.

Lxpups are similar to standard Puppy Linux systems but use the LXDE environment rather than the traditional JWM/Rox-filer. The LXDE environment uses the PCManFM file manager with the Openbox window manager and LxPanel panel manager. This is the same environment as used with LUbuntu and some other Linux Operation Systems. It also adds a new terminal program 'LXTerminal', which I found to be better than the traditional Urxvt terminal.

Once the user has selected menu item edit>>preferences and under the General Tab changed 'Default drop action' to 'Ask', the file manager (PCManFM) in LXpup is a much better file manager than the traditional Puppy file manager (ROX-filer) . Changing this parameter to 'Ask' is critical as without it, there isn't any easy way to create symbolic links within PCManFM (or at least, I couldn't find it). It is meant to have a cntl shift drop to create symbolic links but it wouldn't work for me in trying to create links onto the desktop. I also believe that this is the way all moves or copies should be done. For example, with Microsoft windows I always performed my moves and copies using the right mouse button so that I get the equivalent menu before final invocation, particularly the cancel option. A pity that this wasn't set as the LXpup's default after installation.

Advantages of pcmanfm include:
- ability to have all deletes automatically go to trash with appropriate undeletes
- ability to have a Dual Pane Modes similar to Microsoft windows file managers.

One change that ROX-filer users need to get used to is that PCManFM is extremely finicky about the positioning of the mouse when dropping a file or directory. Most of the time dropping on top of a file icon or file name listed in the destination directory, doesn't work. In these cases, the drop position can be some blank space between file names and/or icons. I have found the easiest way to move or copy files into the currently open directory is to place the destination directory in 'Detailed list view' and drop onto the 'Name' line at the top of the pane. Items can also be dropped on top of a directory icon or directory name. In this case the move or copy is made into that directory, similar to Rox-filer. If you change the left bar from 'Places' to 'Directory Tree', each directory in that tree can be used as a move/copy destination.

Another adjustment is file or folder selection as a group. Traditional Puppy linux allows you to hold the mouse down and circle the icons you want to be part of the selected group. With PCManFM I couldn't get this to work in Detailed list view (the view that I normally work in) but it will work in other views with larger icons. PCManFM seems to have a different way to select groups of items. Holding (for a short period of time) the mouse over an item selects that item. Holding the Cntl key down while holding the mouse over another item will add that item into the selection group. Holding both the Cntl and Shift keys down while holding the mouse over another item will add all the items between the current group and that item. The keyboard use of this is compatible with Microsoft Windows. Overall, previous Microsoft Windows users will feel a lot more at home with this file manager. Note: I found all this just by experimentation. I have yet to find good user manuals on the use of LXDE desktop programs.

Rox-Filer shows recently changed or recently added files in a bold text. This has been very handy. For example, after performing a 'Save all' of attachments from emails, it makes it quick to see the files within the folder selected. PCManFm lacks this feature and it will be missed.

PCManFM misses the permission column in its detail view. For me, this isn't too much of a problem as you can view or alter permissions in the properties from the right click menu. There have been occasions where I have needed to look at and compare permissions on a large number of files. For this rare use, the remaining availability of Rox-filer is advantageous.

Note that it is possible within LXpup to use Rox-filer. Most of the previous puppy programs are still there. One problem I found was that when symbolic links are created by Rox-filer, they are not understood by PCManFM. If you use Rox-filer for deletes you will not have the ability to undelete these files from trash.

Another problem I have had is that some puppy programs have options to bring up the file manager. These are likely to bring up Rox-filer instead of PCManFM. An example of this is the right menu option to 'Open containing folder' within the Download window of portable Seamonkey. This would be a bug in the portable seamonkey where it hadn't used the default file manager.

A major advancement with Puppy Linux was the development of the portable programs. The way that Puppy is normally installed with frugal installations, while overall advantageous, has some problems with specific programs where it is not as appropriate to keep data and program changes in the save file. The portable programs overcome these problems.

The problem with the Puppy portable programs is that that their installation was designed for the traditional JWM desktop environment and some parts of the initial installation of some of the them have problems with the LXDE environment. The following procedure was used to overcome this:

If not previously installed, then uncompress the downloaded file and copy all the files into a newly created directory within the host environment. This is typically within the /mnt/home or /mnt/sda2 directories.
Use menu>>Setup>>Select LXDE<>JWM Desktop enviroments
to switch to the JWM Desktop environment.
Using Rox-filer (available from the filesystem menu) activate either 'build' or 'register' from the portable installation. Note: The 'build' and 'register' are executable files within the application that you simply click on within Rox-Filer. 'build' can be used to register as well as rebuild.
Switch back to the LXDE environment. Locate the relevant .desktop files from /usr/share/applications and copy onto the desktop.

Note that once in a while you should repeat the switch desktop environments, followed by 'build' activation, and then switch back to the LXDE environment in order to rebuild the portable applications so that they are kept up to date.

One needs to recognise that programs and scripts that interact with the desktop on your previously standard Puppy, are likely not to work on the LXPup. and Vice Versa. For example, a script that kept changing the Puppy background at set time intervals would need to be modified to make it work with LxPup.

The desktop is not quite as good as the traditional Puppy JWM desktop. For example JWM makes it easy to set up symbolic links on the desktop, add parameters to the command invocation and then add an appropriate icon to the short cut. LXDE seems to require you to make .desktop files to get the same result which takes a lot longer when it isn't always needed.

The desktop seems to be a little flaky. After reboots the system can lose the information relating to position of the icons on desktop and all the icons get shifted around. I have also rebooted and found the 'Desktop manager is not active' which meant no icons or background on the screen. (Note command to start: pcmanfm --desktop). A second reboot and it all came good. It probably needs an extra wait in the bootup but I'm not sure where to put this.

Overall, I found that the advantages of the file manager more than made up for the disadvantages of the desktop. In my opinion, the automatic use of a trash bin with undelete facilities is critical for day to day use of a computer. The lack of this on other Puppy Linuxs is a major problem. It is this feature in particular which makes me want to stay with Lxpups.

My System:
3rd gen i5 processor with 12Mb RAM with 120MB SSD (main disk) + 2T as 2nd disk. Frugal install as dual boot with Windows 7.
I originall installed LxPupXenial-17.11.iso. Later downloaded LxPupXenial-17.11+3.iso. Internal to that I could only find 2 files that had changed. These being boot.cat & puppy_xenialpup_7.5.sfs. I simply copied these to my install directory.
I recently changed the kernal to one made for PAE version of standard Puppy Xenial. Interestingly it is only 31MB whereas the original LXpup kernal was 75MB but so far I haven't found anything lacking.

One of the reasons I write a review like this is to allow people to correct any misunderstandings I have.
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peebee


Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 3497
Location: Worcestershire, UK

PostPosted: Sun 29 Apr 2018, 10:56    Post subject: Re: My LXpup Intro/overview.  

humanise wrote:
One of the reasons I write a review like this is to allow people to correct any misunderstandings I have.

Wow thats quite a review - thanks for the effort you've put into it....
Quote:
menu item edit>>preferences and under the General Tab changed 'Default drop action' to 'Ask',

Quite a find - the default will change in future LxPups as suggested.
Quote:
LXDE seems to require you to make .desktop files to get the same result which takes a lot longer when it isn't always needed.

You might need to investigate this in more depth - for instance you can make desktop icons for programs simply by right clicking on the menu entry. Also if you install the option "Right Clicks" then there will be a right click action added for many items to put a link onto the desktop.....

Cheers & thanks
peebee

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01101001b


Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 47
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina

PostPosted: Tue 01 May 2018, 21:58    Post subject: Re: My LXpup Intro/overview.  

peebee wrote:
humanise wrote:
LXDE seems to require you to make .desktop files to get the same result which takes a lot longer when it isn't always needed.

[...] you can make desktop icons for programs simply by right clicking on the menu entry. Also if you install the option "Right Clicks" [...]

At first it took me some time too to deal with desktop icons. What PeeBee suggests is right indeed. Another way I found is to drag an item (from pcmanfm) to the desktop while pressing Ctrl+Shift. You'll see a little icon of a chain accompanying the item you drag. Make sure you drop the item *before* releasing those keys.
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01101001b


Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 47
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina

PostPosted: Tue 01 May 2018, 22:52    Post subject: Re: My LXpup Intro/overview.  

humanise wrote:
My LXpup Intro/overview.
[...]
PCManFM misses the permission column in its detail view [...].

You can add it. Right click on any column name (in "Detailed mode view"). There it is.

Quote:
The desktop seems to be a little flaky.

There you have a point. In my case, my desktop used to go to h3ll when I opened my browser (Firefox or Palemoon, same deal). Not every time, but always and only then (LxPrecise, LxTahr, LxXenial, LxArtful).

First, I suspected it was related to my screen resolution (1152x864@75Hz) so I lived with it but since I switched to Dpup, problem never appeared again... until...

Fbpanel didn't work for me. So I installed Lxpanel (replacing fbpanel). No problem so far, except menu items didn't show up (it's important to understand I'm far off from PeeBee's skill. I'm just a regular user).

Thinking I missed something, I installed also LxSession... and *there* the same problem started again.

I uninstalled LxSession, leaving only LxPanel. No problem so far. System is rock solid and "silky smooth" Wink

I resolved the menu issue eventually. LxPanel is not working at full capacity (as I said, not a savvy one here) but what works, does it beautifully.
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peebee


Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 3497
Location: Worcestershire, UK

PostPosted: Thu 03 May 2018, 04:53    Post subject: LxPupBionic-18.05  

iso md5
devx md5
kernel sources md5

Kernel 4.9.96 32-bit pae
BUILD_FROM_WOOF='testing;536733d3;2018-04-26 23:26:34 -0500'

ndiswrapper pet is at this post
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greengeek


Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 5235
Location: Republic of Novo Zelande

PostPosted: Thu 03 May 2018, 06:07    Post subject: Re: LxPupBionic-18.05  

peebee wrote:
iso md5
devx md5
kernel sources md5

Kernel 4.9.96 32-bit pae
BUILD_FROM_WOOF='testing;536733d3;2018-04-26 23:26:34 -0500'
Good, very good. I think this is the first LxPup that I have had success wih (weird Toshiba hardware here...)
Seems a really solid offering so far. Thanks peebee!
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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 1086
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Sat 05 May 2018, 20:09    Post subject: Post subject: LxPupBionic-18.05  

Just set this up from scratch to replace my LxPupArtful. md5sums ok, frugal Grub4Dos install to SSD on one of my i5 based (sandy bridge) laptops. Every step went smoothly. SNS connection, sound, Lx-rightclicks and Disk on desktop options added. slimjet_lxsc_spot_18.0.3.0.sfs loaded and spot and .sylpheed-2.0 symlinks to directories on EXT2 data partition set up. Inxi and Locator 3.7.1(older librsvg v2-2_36.1 added using LD_PRELOAD so small map displays) added. Mucked with wallpaper using MTPaint and LxPanel menu to replace 'Run' with 'Save'. Automount on boot for data partition set up with Pmount and line to remove Save icon from desktop added to rc.local. Permanently remove rightclick modified to 'just do it', my preferred lethal mode. Brightness comes up correctly OOTB on this intel kit. standard 256Mb EXT2 savefile created and rebooted. All in all withstood my noodling and is stable and running well with expected video FPS on this lappie. Just lid-suspended and resumed perfectly mid-post. PPM and optical drives not used yet.

# inxi -bw
System: Host: puppypc6521 Kernel: 4.9.96-lxpup-32-pae i686 bits: 32 Desktop: LXDE (Openbox 3.6.1)
Distro: UPupBB 18.05
Machine: Device: laptop System: FUJITSU product: LIFEBOOK S761 serial: R2500459
Mobo: FUJITSU model: FJNB225 serial: N/A
UEFI [Legacy]: FUJITSU // Phoenix v: Version 1.17 date: 03/14/2012
Battery CMB1: charge: 59.7 Wh 96.0% condition: 62.2/62.2 Wh (100%)
CPU: Dual core Intel Core i5-2520M (-HT-MCP-) speed/max: 1000/2501 MHz
Graphics: Card: Intel 2nd Generation Core Processor Family Integrated Graphics Controller
Display Server: X.Org 1.19.6 drivers: modesetting (unloaded: fbdev,vesa) Resolution: 1366x768@60.00hz
OpenGL: renderer: Mesa DRI Intel Sandybridge Mobile x86/MMX/SSE2 version: 3.3 Mesa 18.0.0-rc5
Network: Card: Qualcomm Atheros AR9287 Wireless Network Adapter (PCI-Express) driver: ath9k
Drives: HDD Total Size: 120.0GB (20.0% used)
Weather: Conditions: 79 F (26 C) - Clear Time: May 5, 6:51 PM CDT
Info: Processes: 270 Uptime: 11:25 Memory: 321.4/4881.6MB Client: Shell (bash) inxi: 2.3.40

Thanks,
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Pups currently in kennel Very Happy LxPupSc and X-slacko-4.4 for my users; LxPupSc, LxPupSc64, and LxPupBB for me. All good pups indeed, and all running savefiles for look'n'feel only. Browsers, etc. solely from SFS. Now tazpup for puzzles Smile
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fishmanluvslinux


Joined: 26 Jun 2015
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sun 06 May 2018, 00:35    Post subject:  Live Mode Only  

I have went thru alot of Puppies today and so far Upupbb is the only one that works well with my Toshiba Satellite Pro Model 6100. But I have not been able to install it . Sanity check failure. If anyone has any ideas let me know where to go and no RTFM please thank you all.

Machine Specs:

Cpu:Intel Pentium 4-M 1.80 GHz
RAM: 1 Gb. DDR2 PC2100-266 Mhz
GPU:AGP - NVIDIA GeForce4 420 Go - 16 MB
HDD: 20 Gb.
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peebee


Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 3497
Location: Worcestershire, UK

PostPosted: Sun 06 May 2018, 04:49    Post subject: Re: Live Mode Only  

fishmanluvslinux wrote:
so far Upupbb is the only one that works well with my Toshiba Satellite Pro Model 6100. But I have not been able to install it . Sanity check failure.

Hi

By "install" are you trying to do a full install? What tool are you using? What does the Sanity Check Failure say?

I have a problem testing your report as I never ever do full installs as Puppy's "frugal installs" are much easier, much more flexible and have zero disadvantages over full installs IMHO.....

If you can describe what you're attempting to do then hopefully somebody else will jump in to help.

Cheers
peebee

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peebee


Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 3497
Location: Worcestershire, UK

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 06:15    Post subject:  

23e54e3b5ee95083ea22b5877a2f607c LxPupBionic-18.05+1.iso

{delta}

Has woof-ce fix to puppyinstaller

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