xenialPup-7.0.6 32-bits with kernel 4.1

[musher0]

Hello s243a.

You are right, the correct link is:
http://augras.eu/puppy_linux/musher0/xe ... -7.0.6.iso

The one I gave initially points to my DPupStretch7-fr. I'll be correcting that link -- now.

One minute later: Done! (That was around the time forum member augras was changing
ftp hosts and I no doubt got my URLs mixed up.)

Thanks for pointing it out. Happy New Year!

[futwerk]

Nice, musher0, works well on this old laptop and pretty fast, thanks.

[sindi]

Xenial 7.0.6 PAE works fine on a 2004 HP zv5000 Pentium M with PC2700 RAM and FSB 533. But the 2003 Pentium M's with
PC2100 and FSB400 do not support PAE. Pentium Pro and II and III do but they do not have 1GB RAM.

On my 2003 Gateway 200ARC (same as Samsung NX05, I read), with maximum RAM 1GB, I attempted to install Xenial 7.5 - it
would not load sfs. I tried 7.0.1 - would not run an exe (is that a PAE kernel?). 7.0.6 told me I need PAE. 7.0.8
installed and works, but took several minutes to load dailymotion.com (which with 7.0.6 loaded in a few seconds on my 2004
HP). I was advised at the 7.5 discussion to come to here and get a non-PAE kernel but I cannot find one.

Lucid is showing its age. As of last week, smtube no longer works, Palemoon only plays Youtube at multiple
resolutions using WebM, and Dailymotion tells me Blop update your browser.

Tahr works acceptably so far and the kernel (3.5MB) is 70% as large as Xenial (5MB). It recommends 768MB RAM but runs in
512MB without cupsd etc.

Xenial would work with newer Ubuntu binaries (such as Motiontube).

Xenial 7.0.8 used about 100% of 1GB running just pale moon but 350MB of that can be eliminated. Would it run in less
memory with a smaller kernel? I read that smaller kernels run faster. I don't need support for post-2003 hardware.

I should learn to compile puppy kernels and modules. Do I need kernel 4 to use Ubuntu 16 binaries?

Where do I find the config file for a current xenial kernel?.

The laptop happily runs with kernel 2.6 and older (puppies 4.1.2, 4.3.1, lucid retro - 2.2MB kernel).
I compiled 500-800K kernels 2.2 and 2.4 for another linux on it (Basiclinux, based on Slackware 7).

[musher0]

Xenial 7.0.6 PAE works fine on a 2004 HP zv5000 Pentium M with PC2700 RAM and FSB 533. But the 2003 Pentium M's with
PC2100 and FSB400 do not support PAE. Pentium Pro and II and III do but they do not have 1GB RAM.

On my 2003 Gateway 200ARC (same as Samsung NX05, I read), with maximum RAM 1GB, I attempted to install Xenial 7.5 - it
would not load sfs. I tried 7.0.1 - would not run an exe (is that a PAE kernel?). 7.0.6 told me I need PAE. 7.0.8
installed and works, but took several minutes to load dailymotion.com (which with 7.0.6 loaded in a few seconds on my 2004
HP). I was advised at the 7.5 discussion to come to here and get a non-PAE kernel but I cannot find one.

Lucid is showing its age. As of last week, smtube no longer works, Palemoon only plays Youtube at multiple
resolutions using WebM, and Dailymotion tells me Blop update your browser.

Tahr works acceptably so far and the kernel (3.5MB) is 70% as large as Xenial (5MB). It recommends 768MB RAM but runs in
512MB without cupsd etc.

Xenial would work with newer Ubuntu binaries (such as Motiontube).

Xenial 7.0.8 used about 100% of 1GB running just pale moon but 350MB of that can be eliminated. Would it run in less
memory with a smaller kernel? I read that smaller kernels run faster. I don't need support for post-2003 hardware.

I should learn to compile puppy kernels and modules. Do I need kernel 4 to use Ubuntu 16 binaries?

Where do I find the config file for a current xenial kernel?.

The laptop happily runs with kernel 2.6 and older (puppies 4.1.2, 4.3.1, lucid retro - 2.2MB kernel).
I compiled 500-800K kernels 2.2 and 2.4 for another linux on it (Basiclinux, based on Slackware 7).

Hello sindi.

Thanks for chiming in.

Various notes and reactions :
-- It is quite possible that the xenial-7.0.6 32 bits with kernel 4.1 does not work with all
older computers. It is impossible for me to test it on every one.

-- It is quite ok to use an older Puppy such as Puppy-4.31 on an older computer.
As long as it does what you want.

-- TahrPup is a fabulous Puppy. It won a prize, did you know that? So if you have
tahrPup on one of your computers, and it does the job, and you like it, why change?

-- "exe" is the file ending for WhineDose executables, e.g. "explorer.exe". Linux
kernels on Puppy are named "vmlinuz", with no file ending.

-- when you say "Ubuntu 16 binaries", you mean "Ubuntu 2016 binaries", yes?
Actual "16-bit binaries" would bring us back to the 1990's !!!

-- I know of the dailymotion.com site, but I do not use it. AFAIK it is a site
offering many videos on many subjects, similar to youtube.

As with youtube, I would suspect that the slowness or speed of dailymotion.com
depends on a number of things:
-- your browser,
-- the speed of your connection,
-- the traffic (how many people are on the site at the same time).

I just accessed it, and it took a full minute to load the initial page.

One other thing is the flash extension : have you included it in your browser? If not,
when you try to play the videos, an error will show instead.

The slowness of dailymotion.com probably has nothing to do with this xenial Puppy.
I use palemoon on this xenialPup-7.0.6 to access youtube for music, songs and
some news, and I have never had a problem.

-- I do not wish to provide a non-PAE kernel for this xenial. Let me explain:

I have provided last Spring (around end of April 2017) a non-PAE Puppy of similar
"strength" to this xenialPup-7. It is a DPupStretch-7 located here:
http://augras.eu/puppy_linux/?dir=mushe ... Os_de_base.
It comes with a choice of three kernels: 3.14, 3.16 or 4.1.3, all non-PAE.
You are welcome to try one or all of them.

-- at this time, the great expert on Linux kernels for Puppies is a forum member
called "stemsee". Very few devs on this forum can compare to stemsee when it
comes to kernels. I certainly cannot!

If kernels are your interest, or changing kernels, may I suggest that you PM
stemsee or browse through his thread concerning kernels on this forum at:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 852#812525.
Perhaps you will find your profit there.

IHTH.

[sindi]

Thanks for your suggestion to try DPup with kernel 3.14 or 3.16.

I read that Pentium M laptops with FSB400 (PC2100 memory) support PAE. I have at least five of these (from 2003).
They use a maximum of 1GB memory and do not need PAE.

Pentium IIIs (which have up to 512MB RAM) support PAE, but xenial needs more RAM.

My newest (2007) laptop will not run Xenial 7.5, Slacko 6.3 or Tahr 6.05 due to auto-chosen wrong video driver
and resolution (nouveau instead of nv). Even framebuffer console is scrambled. Maybe DPup will work on it.

Xenial Ubuntu is Ubuntu 16. Tahr Ubuntu is Ubuntu 14. Lucid Ubuntu is Ubuntu 10.
I want to run programs available precompiled for Ubuntu 16, such as Motiontube.

[musher0]

Hello sindi.

Thanks for the add'l info about the Ubuntu's and your various machines.

About this:

(...) My newest (2007) laptop will not run Xenial 7.5, Slacko 6.3 or Tahr 6.05
due to auto-chosen wrong video driver and resolution (nouveau instead of nv).
Even framebuffer console is scrambled. (...)

Have you tried running xorgwizard to change the video driver?

In any case, can I suggest that you bring this problem to 666philb's attention (for
his xenialPup-7.5 and his tahrPup-6), and to 01micko's attention (for the Slacko
6.3) on the respective threads?

Hopefully, one of my DPup's will work fine on your box.

Also, it may be a good idea to check the manufacturer's specs for your machines.
Some computers (especially notebooks or portables) come with a GPU that is
neither nvidia nor radeon. In such a case, we have to find the proper driver. It
usually exists, but we have to go through the trouble of finding it on the web and
incorporating it into the Puppy. (Just a thought.)

BFN.

[musher0]

Hello again, sindi.

You'll find the manual for your Gateway 200arc, here:
http://office.manualsonline.com/manuals ... 00arc.html
It's a pdf document, but I have attached a txt conversion of it, zipped.

Top of page 2 is indicated the type of GPU: it is an Intel 82855GM (chipset
integrated), with 2D hardware acceleration and 3D rendering acceleration. So this is
the video driver you would be looking for. Do a search in the forum first, somebody
may already be offering it here.

You can also have 2Gb's of RAM on it. If you have a little money, it may be worth
it. It will make a big difference.

IHTH,

[sindi]

[quote="musher0"]Hello sindi.

Thanks for the add'l info about the Ubuntu's and your various machines.

About this:[quote][i](...) My newest (2007) laptop will not run Xenial 7.5, Slacko 6.3 or Tahr 6.05
due to auto-chosen wrong video driver and resolution (nouveau instead of nv).
Even framebuffer console is scrambled. (...)[/i]

[/quote]Have you tried running xorgwizard to change the video driver?

In any case, can I suggest that you bring this problem to 666philb's attention (for his xenialPup-7.5 and his tahrPup-6), and to 01micko's attention (for the Slacko 6.3) on the respective threads?

Hopefully, one of my DPup's will work fine on your box.

Also, it may be a good idea to check the manufacturer's specs for your machines. Some computers (especially notebooks or portables) come with a GPU that is neither nvidia nor radeon. In such a case, we have to find the proper driver. It usually exists, but we have to go through the trouble of finding it on the web and incorporating it into the Puppy. (Just a thought.)

BFN.[/quote]

The laptop in question is a 2007 HP dv6500. It works perfectly (I am typing on it now) with nv video at 1280x800 in Lucid Puppy 2016.

If I install (from the files extracted from the iso, with grub4dos run in Lucid Puppy) any of the three newer Puppies (that use Ubuntu packages) I CANNOT SEE to run xorgwizard because the video is is scrambled. The text (in its windows) is scattered to three parts of the page. Elongated vertically. I figured out (from reading xorg.conf) that nouveau driver is being used at 1024x768. I attempted to choose VESA and arrowed about blindly and got a readable 1024x768 screen with unusable keyboard and mouse. I would need to manually edit xorg.conf for all three newer linuxes.

If it installs automatically, I get scrambled X - window broken into three pieces as in console mode.

Copying xorg.conf from Lucid to the others Puppies made no difference.

Something is being detected differently (wrongly) compared to Lucid Puppy. The author of Lucid 2016 (rerwin) is not interested in figuring this out for other Puppies.

Maybe Dpup will do better on here.

This is NOT the 200ARC Gateway, which is 4 years older and has no video problems in any of the Puppy Linuxes. It does however refuse to install three of them. 7.0.6 because it requires PAE which Pentium M from 2003 does not support. 7.0.1 something about an executable. 7.5 will not load the sfs file and objected to sda1 not having been checked with fsck (it is NTFS). 7.0.8 works fine apart from using too much memory by default.

Memorystock agrees that it can handle 2.0GB of PC2100 FSB400.

The FSB400 is the problem - no Pentium M cpus of that type do PAE. The memory is not a problem if I kill 350MB of unused processes (clipit retrovol cupsd etc.) and I could also probably unload a few modules.

I really should learn to compile Puppy kernels.

I am downloading DPup Stretch 3.14 kernel (27 minutes, 3 to go).

[sindi]

DPup also automatically chooses the wrong driver (nouveau) and resolution on the computer where Tahr, Slacko, and Xenial 7.5 have this problem. A DELL Inspiron 8500 had a similar problem (before the video went bad).

Lupu with 2.6 kernel works perfectly - could the kernel be the problem? I have not tried a later kernel in Lupu because the kernel 3's do not support console framebuffer. I need to compile my own kernels! The 2.6 kernel has problems with some video chips and some b43 wifi chips.

I have not tried DPup on the 200ARC Gateway because my partner has taken it over. I can try on a DELL 600M with 768MB RAM. I have only 256MB of PC2100 but it will accept PC2700 too and up to 2GB.

If DPup works on my Pentium M's, how do I replace the PAE kernel from Xenial 7.0.6 with the non-PAE one from DPup? Or would you provide a non-PAE alternate 7.0.6 to use with Pentium M 2003 laptops? Pentium M uses less power than Mobile Pentium 4-M or 4 also 2003. (I have three of each).

[musher0]

Hello sindi.

Sorry to hear about your troubles. We have 2 separate problems, I believe.

One being PAE / non-PAE;
the second being proper driver recognition of your machine's video card.

For the 1st problem, you can try switching kernels, it is a very simple procedure.
You simply substitute one for the other. But make sure you back-up the original
kernel and zdrv sfs file first. This may solve -- or not -- the PAE issue.

Edit: If you change kernels, you need to use the zdrv sfs file that goes with
that kernel. The zdrv sfs file has the drivers associated with that kernel.

For the video card problem, I thought xorgwizard would be the solution. According to
the people building the woof-CE, xorgwizard is not even needed since X (aka Xorg)
is supposed to be able to automatically choose the right driver for the video card in
one's computer. But sometimes we still have to call in xorgwizard.

Probably you know this already, but as a reminder: to use < xorgwizard >, one has
to include < pfix=nox > on the Grub4DOS or lilo launch line for the kernel (not the
initrd line). This parameter will stop the boot process at the original CLI interface,
where you can type < xordwizard > and then follow the prompts.

If you are booting from a disc, there is a pause in front of the Puppy logo, at the
beginning. This is where you type puppy < pfix=nox > .

If you are booting from HD, you have to edit the kernel line in file "menu.lst", by
adding < pfix=nox > towards the end of the line. (Without the chevrons, of course.
Again, sorry for reminding you if you already know this.)

Beyond that, I would say that more research is needed, in the forum and beyond.
Perhaps create new threads for these problems, and people will ring in with some
good suggestions. As you may know, my strong points are small window managers
and their menus; I am not a hardware or driver expert, sorry.

IHTH nevertheless. BFN.

[sindi]

As a test, I attempted to use Lupu 2016 with 3.0.25 kernel (Sulu1) on the dv6500 which is not usable with Puppy 6 or 7.
It identified my nv video at the proper resolution 1280x800 but as fbdev.
The X screen is similarly scrambled as in Tahr Slacko and Xenial, but the console is differently scrambled, with horizontal
lines and general fuzziness. I have not succeeded in attaching any images in this forum.

I did not test any other Lupus (with later kernel 3's) or Slacko 5.7.

So either something changed in the later kernel code that prevents video from working on this laptop,
or all the later kernels were compiled not to recognize nv and to use fbdev or nouveau instead
(in which case I can try to compile my own xenial or tahr kernel).

Also, Pale Moon displays links and quotes with tags [] and [/]. (As does lynx).
I was copying and pasting URLs and removing the tags.

Firefox shows them as clickable links and quotes.

Have I set something wrong in Pale Moon or should I report this as a bug?

Pale Moon is the default browser for Tahr and Xenial puppies.

-----
Musher0 posted as I was writing this.

The video is definitely nvidia. nv works with Lupu 2016. Later puppies automatically choose something else
that does NOT work (fbdev or nouveau - I can read that much in X, in one of the bits of a window).

If I substitute a different kernel (in my boot directory) I would also need to add modules to match. /lib/modules/(kernel-version)....
Just copy over all the subdirectories too, to the save directory? (You can have several sets of modules).

So I can try DPup's non-PAE kernel (and matching modules) in Xenial 7.0.6 on my Pentium M 200ARC from 2003.

Will Xenial run with kernel 2.6? If so I can test where the video problem lies - in the kernel or elsewhere.

I CANNOT READ the console to run xorgwizard - in puppies 6 the sections of text are scattered about in three places
in both console mode and X (kernel 4). In puppy 5 (sulu1 kernel 3.0.25) X is as in kernel 4, except it is fbdev not nouveau.
In console mode (Ctrl-Alt-Backspace gets you out of X) there are parallel horizontal stripes and blurry text.
I attempted to post photos but nothing happened after I selected them as attachments. Maybe Firefox would do it?

I had a similar problem with DELL Inspiron 8500 and Tahr. The video failed (went stripey) so we recycled it (after USB,
PCMCIA, and wifi had failed, and hd was replaced). It had a discrete video card, which could be Nvidia. 2003.

I still need to try DPup on a Pentium M FSB 400 before borrowing its kernel.

[musher0]

Oops.

Thanks for reminding me. I forgot to mention that one needs to use the zdrv sfs
file that goes with the kernel. The zdrv sfs file has the drivers associated with the
kernel and AFAIK only that kernel. I'll be updating my previous message in a
minute.

I don't know about using Lupu's kernel on a xenial or stretch Pup. My instinct says
no. Because they are too far removed in time.

Also because the Puppies' "upgrade ability" is limited: within a Puppy "breed" only,
and then from version number to next version number only. The "breed" limitation
is because the source distros have different hierarchies; the "next-version"
limitation is because that's how Puppy is built.

I do appreciate your interest in my work, I really do. But as I said earlier, sindi,
there is nothing wrong with using an older Puppy for an older computer.

Speaking of which, I chanced upon darry1966's remake of Puppy-4.31, called
StarDustPup-013, dating from May 2017. It's here:
https://archive.org/details/Stardustpup013glibc2.10. It has a modern glibc
2.10 library so modern apps should run on it without problems. Maybe this
puplet will respond better to your needs? Just a thought.

BFN.

[sindi]

DPup Stretch 7 with kernel 3.16 works very well on the 200ARC Pentium M (non-PAE).
My partner asked me to put it first in menu.lst and is happily browsing with it.

I prefer it to Xenial partly because it already has nano and mplayer, and the colors are nice.
It will be fun to see how it differs from Ubuntu-package-accepting puppies.

A few minor changes to make it perfect for me:
On booting it cannot find the background image (which I do not need).
I will change to a darker background color so the text under the icons shows up.
I will change the font in the urxvt to fit in less space.
I will add lynx and maybe links2 or elinks.

Wifi, sound, and video work very well. Framebuffer console works (unlike in Slackware 5.7 or Lupus with a kernel 3.X).
I added Pale Moon, which works at Youtube in all resolutions (unlike Lupu and Wary puppies). 1GB RAM is plenty, and I can
make it work in less.

Regarding kernels, Lucid Puppy 2016 works with a 2.6 kernel and also with kernels 3.0.25, 3.2.48, 3.5.2, and 3.9.9, so
maybe Dpup would work with a 2.6 kernel instead of a 3.16 kernel, and thus be usable on my HP dv6500 with screwy video. It
is less likely Xenial (kernels 4) would work with a kernel 2.6.

I updated Wary and probably Lupu to glibc 2.11, so Puppy 4.3.1 with glibc 2.10 is not MORE updated.
Smtube or its dependencies need glibc 2.17. (Tahr has 2.19).

As I recall, Puppy 4.3.1 would not run newer browsers. I may take a look though. Merci beaucoup.

[musher0]

My pleasure!

[melon688]

bug report

Menu --> Graphic --> Screeny Capture Windows and Fullscreen --> fullscreen

captured screen distortion.

[musher0]

bug report

Menu --> Graphic --> Screeny Capture Windows and Fullscreen --> fullscreen

captured screen distortion.

Hello melon 688.

No such problem here, I just re-tested. It may depend on the type of image or app
being captured. E.g., from experience, I know that trying to do a screen capture of
any DOSBox window will produce a distorted image.

Were you trying to do a still image of a game? Or of a movie while it is playing?
For the latter, some movie apps have a dedicated command; one should not use
an utility such as Screeny for that purpose. (Or pause the movie first.)

In any case, the Screeny utility being the creation of Mick Amadio, the proper place
to complain about it and / or to report your bug is in its own thread at
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 845#606358

IHTH. Have a great day!

[melon688]

Dell 1535 laptop (1280x800),
captured desktop picture:

[Sailor Enceladus]

@melon688: This has been fixed in the newest netpbm. I think musher0 posted (en Français ) how to get it here:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=112265

Related posts:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 852#943852
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 591#974591

[mfb]

My comments are:

(1) I trust, this time, Flash will read between the lines.

(2) I trust Forum members know the halo is well placed.

(3) I don’t care if sum her0 sees a threat or a challenge.

[musher0]

Dell 1535 laptop (1280x800),
captured desktop picture:

Hi melon688.

As I mentioned above, I do not have the problem with Screeny on this machine.
Please report it to 01micko on his Screeny thread. I have provided the URL for it
above.

Alternatively, to get a screenshot, you can use SFR's Take-a-Shot or use the
following command from console:

Code: Select all

sleep 5s;mtpaint -s

"sleep 5s" gives you the time to iconify the console before the snapshot is taken.
After the image has appeared in the mtpaint window, you save in the format you like.

Results of taking a snapshot with mtpaint -s and with screeny are attached.

IHTH.