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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
XenialDog (Ubuntu 16.04 'Xenial Xerus' LTS, 32-bit)
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Pelo

Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 12591
Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Fri 20 May 2016, 11:45    Post subject: That is bad news for the repository.  

That is bad news for the repository.

About RAM indicator, is it so important ? Windows 7 starting does not reach the maxima. Xenialdog is ok at home (faster than Xenialpup).
Htop.jpg
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Htop.jpg

RAM.jpg
 Description   12% is not 90%
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 Viewed   2404 Time(s)

RAM.jpg


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Pelo

Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 12591
Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Fri 20 May 2016, 12:07    Post subject: Free and Htop and SWAP
Subject description: SWAP unused is the only thing to survey, in my opinion;
 

our old VIPs in France had a debate too about meanings of Free and Htop. It's not the same thing that is measured.
in Memory there is inactive, active and free.
Mister processor will empty inactive memory if free memory become to low to allow him to work. If you have 4GB, it will not empty memory, I know some puppy builders who store files in memory
The only thing to look is swap. As soon as swap is used, you are in the limits.. Swap should never be used. It's a rescue system. Close some programs.
Screenshot is my old Acer's one 512MB. Use old Puppies for these laptops. Browsers nowadays quite fulfill 512Mb
The bigger your RAM is, The more inactive Memory will be kept, because no need to kick it out.
QuiBosse.jpg
 Description   in Memory there is inactive, active and free.
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QuiBosse.jpg


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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4204
Location: holland

PostPosted: Fri 20 May 2016, 12:58    Post subject:  

Pelo wrote:
About RAM indicator, is it so important ?


In my opinion sure it is. You have the luxury of 4GB (same for me, I have 3GB).
But what if someone who has only 512MB reads about XenialDog and wants to try, he/she should know about it.

For example, I think they explain it right on the Lubuntu website http://lubuntu.net/:
Quote:
For advanced internet services like Google+, YouTube, Google Docs and Facebook, your computer needs about 1 GB of RAM.

For local programs like LibreOffice and simple browsing habits, your computer needs about 512 MB of RAM. See minimal for systems below that RAM.


From what I tested XenialDog will run even with 340MB RAM, but when running firefox with multiple tabs, Youtube etc.., swap will be used soon (as you also said) and the system get's much slower.

With 512MB RAM it will be a lot better, but still depends on what programs you use and how many at the same time.

You can test btw, by adding e.g.:
Code:
mem=512M

To kernel boot command line. It will be limited then to 512MB.

Fred
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Pelo

Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 12591
Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Sat 21 May 2016, 02:25    Post subject: Xenialdog is not for running on such computers.
Subject description: Why not, Pelo ? Try it !
 

I have an Acer aspire 1640 512MB .
Even running a Puppy slacko 6.3.0 is not a good idea. Xenialdog is not for running on such computers.
it's impossible ! Without adding anything my RAM is around 500MB occupied. No audio or video running..
I can try XenialDog with My acer, perhaps i am wrong . I am curious. Go ! feed back to-morrow. Smile
But i'am quite sure Puppy Linux has better results. I installed Ubuntu in the past, ubuntu was slower than windows XP after ten minutes.

Processor is a worker. the les he can store beside him (the RAM) he has to go and return to the swap (Hardisk) . He loose a lot of time. This is why RAM was created.
Hard disk is slow, very slow. for typing it's ok, man is really slow to type. But install a Debian system for secretary works ??? If someone ask you to watch a video, what will you do ?
For My Medion 64bits, four processors, 4GB XenialDog is really nice, Smile but for the Medion, not for my poor Acer , with hard disk fully written . That is important too, looking for free space on hard disk .

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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
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Location: holland

PostPosted: Sat 21 May 2016, 04:14    Post subject:  

Pelo wrote:
I can try XenialDog with My acer, perhaps i am wrong . I am curious. Go ! feed back to-morrow. Smile


Yes, please do, such tests are always welcome!

Fred
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Pelo

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PostPosted: Sat 21 May 2016, 12:05    Post subject: around 120 on Acer, compared to 500 with Medion.  

no wireless ! but data are surprising low about Ram used, around 120 on Acer, compared to 500 with Medion.
Frisbee should always be With another network wizard.. I will install one. But really XenialDog will hardly run my old laptop, the poor get very fast to 80° if the CPU works hard
New feed-back later.

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Last edited by Pelo on Sun 22 May 2016, 14:06; edited 1 time in total
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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 3200

PostPosted: Sat 21 May 2016, 18:50    Post subject: Re: around 120 on Acer, compared to 500 with Medion.  

Pelo wrote:
no wireless ! but data are surprising low about Ram used, around 120 on Acer, compared to 500 with Medion.


Possible not getting wireless because rfkill package not installed. Hope new iso can be released soonish with that fix Fred because many may be put off seeing no wireless on their machines.

RAM used shouldn't be showing 500, I feel, unless checked with browser already running - should check immediately on first booting up with no programs running. But maybe each machine is different in how it sets up Shared Mem, which we now know is part of the amount shown in Xenial htop used RAM display.

William

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Pelo

Joined: 10 Sep 2011
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Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Sun 22 May 2016, 02:49    Post subject: Is it a good choice to install a nice Xenialdog  

debate (fight ?) about memory usage is useless for people with one GB or more. Processors and RAM are here to be used, even 70% of Ram used is fluent.. Only games would freeze the computer. Puppy passengers are not gamers

If The poor passenger has an old laptop with only 512MB The debate is quite different ! Is it a good choice to install a nice Xenialdog that will freeze all the time ? Think about the temperatue too. Often it's the first alert you get
The main debate too is that you care what a distro is made with, the passenger cares only what he is able to do with. .
(i use passenger because most users in the forum only search to administrate their Distro, not to use it)

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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
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Location: holland

PostPosted: Sun 22 May 2016, 04:59    Post subject:  

Pelo wrote:
If The poor passenger has an old laptop with only 512MB The debate is quite different ! Is it a good choice to install a nice Xenialdog that will freeze all the time ? Think about the temperatue too. Often it's the first alert you get


Do I understand well that Xenialdog doesn't work well on your old Acer?
(I mean you fully tested?)

I am going to test later (when I have the chance) on a 512MB computer.
What I did for now is sort of simulating 1 core and 512MB RAM on my HP Compaq 6710b laptop dual core (I think it's around 8 years old) by adding this to my kernel commandline:
Code:
nr_cpus=1 mem=512M


Probably not a totally fair comparison with a "real old" 512MB computer, there are more factors of course.

Result: It runs pretty well, even with running firefox (just a few tabs opened) temperature OK.
See screenshots.

Fred
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 Description   firefox_running
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Last edited by fredx181 on Sun 22 May 2016, 13:30; edited 1 time in total
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fredx181


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PostPosted: Sun 22 May 2016, 12:23    Post subject:  

=========================================
*** New iso image uploaded ***
=========================================

Reason is mostly because the custom XenialDog repository is down, fixed now in new release by changing it to dropbox, see below 6.

Choice of two ISO's: XenialDog-openbox_jwm-2016-05-21-firmware-all and XenialDog-openbox_jwm-2016-05-21-firmware-basic.
Difference is that firmware-all has package "linux-firmware" installed, recommended if you need e.g. wireless.

Firmware-all:
Iso: XenialDog-openbox_jwm-2016-05-21-firmware-all.iso Size: 289MB
Md5sum: XenialDog-openbox_jwm-2016-05-21-firmware-all.md5

Firmware-basic:
Iso: XenialDog-openbox_jwm-2016-05-21-firmware-basic.iso Size: 244MB
Md5sum: XenialDog-openbox_jwm-2016-05-21-firmware-basic.md5

*** Changes, fixes and information: ***

1. New version of xvidcap, 1.1.7a,:
Changed: removed dependency of pulseaudio, (works fine with oss driver (/dev/dsp) )
This way install space required will be a lot smaller also.
See also here:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=902369#902369
2. New version of precord, 9.0.4:
Changed: Added dependency: lame
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=902369#902369
3. New version of jwm-setup, 0.0.2:
See info and changes here:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=902044#902044
4. Added rfkill, needed by frisbee (specially if using a HP machine)
5. New version of gnome-mpayer-1.0.7, with DVD support now:
6. Changed Xenialdog repository address (old address is down): installed is apt-transport-https (depends on it for to work with dropbox):
Address for the Xenialdog package repository in /etc/apt/sources.list is now:
Code:
deb https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/36381953/XenialDog/Packages/ ./

See also here: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=904709#904709

Download links on first post updated.

Fred
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Pelo

Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 12591
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PostPosted: Sun 22 May 2016, 13:50    Post subject: I had no intention to use XenialDog with my old computer.  

I had no intention to use XenialDog with my old computer.
About temperature, It's a default of Acer laptops (well known) .
It's a distro that i appreciate with my 4GB Medion Akoya. I tested it with Acer to bring you some data, but no Web , no browser active, that will not help you.
Old puppies are the best, for old computers.
I told i will try again with a different wizard, frisbee fails to connect? but it's not unusual.. Let me some time. On Sunday, there was swimming Europe championship, i watched it on my TV Smile
Reality :
I don't have ethernet connection, because i am 600 kms far from my ADSL box.
CD player is unserviceable
Temperature get to 80° in five minutes if processor (only one) 'mouline' hum in english very active a long time.

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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
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Location: holland

PostPosted: Sun 22 May 2016, 14:45    Post subject:  

Pelo wrote:
I told i will try again with a different wizard, frisbee fails to connect? but it's not unusual.

Yes, frisbee can be a little buggy.
If you see all buttons greyed, it's probably a case of not recognizing your wireless adapter.
If buttons not greyed, just try "Restart Networks" button, I experienced that suddenly the wireless networks could appear then.
Or, as William wrote, it could be because rfkill is not installed (needed by frisbee), this is fixed in the new ISO release.
Btw, if (as you said) even slacko doesn't run well then I'd say there's a real problem with your Acer.

Fred
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Pelo

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PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2016, 00:28    Post subject: Pwireless should do the job  

Pwireless should do the job. But i do not intend to spend much time testing XeniaDog on my old computer. I use it from time to time. Its a second hand one (from my daughter), saved from destroy.
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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 3200

PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2016, 04:12    Post subject: Re: Is it a good choice to install a nice Xenialdog  

Pelo wrote:
debate (fight ?) about memory usage is useless


Pelo, please do not try to stir up trouble with such very dubious (fight?) remark. It is not humorous, particularly in recent circumstances, and I do not appreciate the attempt, which is certain troll-like behaviour and completely wrong anyway.

William

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mcewanw

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PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2016, 04:37    Post subject:  

fredx181 wrote:

Or, as William wrote, it could be because rfkill is not installed (needed by frisbee), this is fixed in the new ISO release.


Downloading now Fred. Many thanks.

William

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