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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
Light-Debian-Core-Live-CD-Wheezy + Porteus-Wheezy
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fredx181

Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 863
Location: holland

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 14:47    Post_subject:  

Hi
Great initiative!
My first post at the puppy forum, couldn't resist to tell you, saintless, how wonderful this is.
Can't wait for your wheezy next version
I've been trying to make a debian live system as small as possible (used remastersys) but couldn't make it less than 200M.

Here's a hint for the persistence option:

Take a look here:

http://live.debian.net/manpages/current/en/html/live-boot.7.html

for example (grub(4dos)):

kernel /deb-live/vmlinuz boot=live live-media=removable live-media-path=/deb-live persistence persistence-media=removable persistence-label=debsave

where is:
- live-media-path=/deb-live >> path where squashfs file(s) found
- live-media=removable >> search for "/deb-live" directory only on removable drives (do not use this when on hdd)
- persistence >> use persistence (used to be persistent on squeeze)
- persistence-media=removable >> search for persistence file or partition only on removable media such as usb (do not use this when on hdd)
- persistence-label=debsave >> will search for partition labeled "debsave" or a file (simular to the old "live-rw") named "debsave"
NOTE: this file "debsave" (or whatever) file must not be on the same partition as the, in this example, "/deb-live" folder, as stated before, that it's mounted read-only, hope this can be solved, would be great!

@saintless
for me persistence file is mounted on /lib/live/mount/persistence/loop1 and persistent partition on /lib/live/mount/persistence/sdxx (not on overlay,this is mounted as tmpfs, not sure what for)

Cheers!
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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2603
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 14:47    Post_subject:  

Light-Debian-Core-Wheezy-T1.iso 149 Mb with two kernels + live-build tools uploaded for testing. First post updated with more information.

Mount-sfs script is still the same. Will be updated in the next version with Sunburnt's improvements.

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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2603
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 14:52    Post_subject:  

fredx181 wrote:
@saintless
for me persistence file is mounted on /lib/live/mount/persistence/loop1 and persistent partition on /lib/live/mount/persistence/sdxx (not on overlay,this is mounted as tmpfs, not sure what for)

Cheers!

Thank you for the information and the persistent options, Fredx181.
I still learning how wheezy structure is changed. With information from you and others I hope we will get to the bottom.
The new version is uploaded, first post updated. There is 1 Gb save file ready for download to be used after extracting the content.

Cheers, Toni

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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 15:30    Post_subject:  

Toni much appreciated that you made that save file.
I also downloaded the Light-Debian-Core-Wheezy-T1.iso

Does T stand for Test most likely? I maybe test tomorrow
because next week I am very busy. I get back when I know
how it works on my gear.

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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2603
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 15:31    Post_subject:  

fredx181 wrote:
NOTE: this file "debsave" (or whatever) file must not be on the same partition as the, in this example, "/deb-live" folder, as stated before, that it's mounted read-only, hope this can be solved, would be great!


It is solved with the uploaded version, but not the best way as I wish to.
Take a look at the script in /etc/profile.d
The partition with your /deb-save (or /lib/live/mount/medium) is remounted as rw on boot. Unfortunately not soon enough to mount persistence file from this partition.
Anyway searching for better fix.

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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2603
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 15:38    Post_subject:  

nooby wrote:
Does T stand for Test most likely?

Yes, Nooby.
I'm not planning to make T2 too soon. Lets collect some information from tests for about a month and see what problems we will find.

Cheers, Toni

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fredx181

Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 863
Location: holland

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 17:36    Post_subject:  

saintless wrote:
fredx181 wrote:
NOTE: this file "debsave" (or whatever) file must not be on the same partition as the, in this example, "/deb-live" folder, as stated before, that it's mounted read-only, hope this can be solved, would be great!


It is solved with the uploaded version, but not the best way as I wish to.
Take a look at the script in /etc/profile.d
The partition with your /deb-save (or /lib/live/mount/medium) is remounted as rw on boot. Unfortunately not soon enough to mount persistence file from this partition.
Anyway searching for better fix.


Just tried your new T1 wheezy...
Yes, /lib/live/mount/medium is rw mounted now,which is an improvement at least Smile
Persistence still doesn't work if on same partition but to be fair it's no big deal for me (I found it works allright when on other partition, so it's ok for me)

Another thing you didn't mention, or I am missing something:
When boot seems to get stuck I needed to do Ctrl+Alt+F1 to be able to type startx and get to desktop.
Normal autologin does not work?

One more thing about the persistence options
live-media-path=.... is not needed to specify if the squashfs file(s) are in "/live" folder (/live is the default)
Same goes for "persistence-label=..." (persistence is the default)
These options can be handy if you have several "frugal" installs and/or several savefiles.

Good luck
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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 5890
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 18:03    Post_subject: Re: Light-Debian-Core-Live-CD-Wheezy
Sub_title: New version uploaded 11.12.2013
 

saintless wrote:
edit 11.12.2013 - Uploaded Light-Debian-Core-Wheezy-T1.iso 149 Mb.

snip

You will get to command prompt as root. Type startx to enter GUI. This will be fixed for the next version to autologin.


Booted directly to JWM as root here.

Ran apt-get update (after deleting the file you mentioned) and installing Iceweasel now.
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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 5890
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 18:16    Post_subject:  

Persistence works .......
Live Wheezy.jpg
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Live Wheezy.jpg

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anikin

Joined: 10 May 2012
Posts: 511

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 21:14    Post_subject:  

A quick thought - the squeeze based LD seems to be lighter and easier to use. Debian is so flexible - just change a few lines in apt-get configuration and your OS will upgrade itself to Wheezy, Jessie, or SID and can be rolled back to Squeeze, if the changes are not to your liking. The procedure is well documented and easy to follow. Is it worth the trouble, to pursue two projects? James C, you're the debianist here, you've played with SID - what you say?

One more, I've done some googling and found tons of info on Debian Live. The whole world seems to be revolving around it. Clonezilla and Gparted Live are based on LD, so that you know. The findings make me believe, that it's easier to build a live system (with greater precision), than reverse engineering an existing one. Have a look at these two articles:
http://l3net.wordpress.com/2013/09/21/how-to-build-a-debian-livecd/
http://willhaley.com/blog/create-a-custom-debian-live-environment/.
A collection of usefull config options:http://www.clonezilla.org/clonezilla-live/boot-parameters/live-config.php
Here's some more:http://syn.theti.ca/2013/06/22/tutorial-wheezy-live-iso-hybrid-with-persistence-on-usb/
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tony

Joined: 14 Jan 2006
Posts: 317
Location: Montreal.ca

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 22:09    Post_subject:  

HI,

another request from a puppian.

Can someone advise on a wallpaper setter and how to use it.

I'm fed up with the black screen at boot.

Regards Tony.
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sunburnt


Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 5039
Location: Arizona, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Wed 11 Dec 2013, 22:29    Post_subject:  

I asked Sergey. I like to know where people are from, it makes this a bit more personal.
I have a Russian girlfriend from Saint Petersburg. Her son "Sergey" is still living there.

Sergey; I assume that live-build only makes a build of the running Deb. version.?
# It would seem a good idea to be able to build using an iso as the base distro.

I installed "live-build" on Toni`s Squeeze last night ( took a while )
Tried making a live distro., took hours, but it failed as the next morning I can`t find it.
None of the changes are being saved to the next boot. But I did make a save file...

I`ll try again tonight with Wheezy. Maybe OpenBox instead of JWM, or maybe PekWM.
Maybe IceWeasel in place of H3W. Xfe suite is a good starting point, but Geany`s better.
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sunburnt


Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 5039
Location: Arizona, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Thu 12 Dec 2013, 00:52    Post_subject:  

I got Wheezy working with the save file, shows it mounted.
Did "update" and installed live-build, all okay.

The instructions for tutorial2 in the Live manual say this:

mkdir tutorial2, so I made it on sda3
cd tutorial2
echo "task-lxde-desktop iceweasel" >> config/package-lists/my.list.chroot

Now this last line is impossable as the path doesn`t exist.
There is a config in the Wheezy tree, but I assume they want a path in /tutorial.
So I made the path with sudo, but Wheezy won`t let me make the file: my.list.chroot

# Any suggestions.? Or am I doing this wrong.?

The last step is to run: sudo lb build 2>&1 | tee build.log

Thanks for any help guys. Terry
.
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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2603
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Thu 12 Dec 2013, 02:58    Post_subject:  

fredx181 wrote:
Another thing you didn't mention, or I am missing something:
When boot seems to get stuck I needed to do Ctrl+Alt+F1 to be able to type startx and get to desktop.
Normal autologin does not work?

Mentioned in the first post update. Just use autologin in your boot menu list code and you will get to X as root. It will be fixed in the iso boot code for the next version.

Cheers, Toni

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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2603
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Thu 12 Dec 2013, 03:19    Post_subject:  

Hi, Anikin,
anikin wrote:
Is it worth the trouble, to pursue two projects?

anikin wrote:
The findings make me believe, that it's easier to build a live system (with greater precision), than reverse engineering an existing one.

Yes and No to both questions. It depends what you like to have as a result.
For example Sergey uses the method you offer and he gets very good results.
I see Sunburnt also tries this method. Lets wait to see his result.
With reverse-engineering method (thanks, Sunburnt, I like this better than Dr Frankenstein in his lab Smile )I have as a result squeeze-no-xorg.squashfs 37Mb and wheezy-no-xorg.squashfs 65 Mb. This is the base to start adding applications on top of them. Maybe i have to upload them as a base for others to create what they like from Debian-Live.
I'm sure it can be done the same way or even better by building it with chroot but you will have to built an image which will be have some files to clean after. This means to do again reverse-engineering to slimm down the size and the size is the point of this project. After adding more programs you will have to clean more files again the same way.
Starting with standard-debian-light.iso gives me a list what packages I have inside and if you ask me the process is easier.
We have squeezy 68Mb iso and wheezy 149 Mb iso booting to X with working internet. Don't forget wheezy has two kernels inside. If I remove one of them the size will be 120 Mb or even less.
Anyway this is the way I choosed to fallow and to share. I prefer not to start with another one before finishing what I plan. If someone gets better results it will be wonderfull.
I still think of Light-Debian as a way to help puppy when you can't run some application on puppy. If we start adding more and more programs the size will grow up and grtow up and we will need more and more cleaning. This means to make a cleaning script and it will be done, but the problem is squeeze and wheeze has different structure. Still learning what we can remove from wheezy. If we can automate the rebuild and cleaning squashfs proces for both squeezy and wheezy with one aproach it could become fine small distro similar to puppy in size and better package manager.

Cheers, Toni

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