official (momanager) language packs

For efforts in internationalising Puppy and solving problems in this area
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L18L
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Re: latest ffmm

#121 Post by L18L »

vicmz wrote:... I have only a few of those. Many of the scripts I checked don't even have a .pot file at /usr/share/doc/nls/ ! :shock:
Allright, never mind, :lol: it's not that important...
For me it is important for understanding (original!) MoManager:
- creates actual pot file from actual script (xgettext)
- creates po file from pot file (msginit)
- merges existing translations in mo file (msgmerge)

Just because a alsaconf.pot could not be created automatically the rule was introduced:
if a pot file exists in /usr/share/doc/nls/<app>/ then it will be used.

... and there is the danger that the pot file is not actual any more.

So the important rule (for developer) simply is:
If momanager can create the pot file (the developer or the first translator will you see it running momanager) then do NOT store a pot file for this script.

They are in devx :wink:

Code: Select all

# pwd
/mnt/+mnt+home+devx_precise_5.7.1.sfs/usr/share/doc/nls
# 
# ls
alsaconf            grub4dosconfig  notecase          proxy-setup     xarchive
ffconvert           gtkam           parted            pwallpaper
freememapplet_tray  hardinfo        pdiag             retrovol
gecko-mediaplayer   jwm             peasyscan         ROX-Filer
gphoto2             network_tray    powerapplet_tray  welcome1stboot
# 
..and you may have additionaly others, too.

Thanks for the feedback which was good for clearing this issue. :)

akarui.tenshi
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue 30 Oct 2012, 01:22

translation confusion...

#122 Post by akarui.tenshi »

Good morning,
I found a serious error when using MoManager (maybe is not an error)... I tried to create a language pack for the language "Català" (ca_ES) and everything was alright, then i found a language pack in Portuguese. However this language pack is in the Portuguese of Brazil (pt_BR) and not in Portuguese of Portugal (pt_PT), so I tried to modify it, but translations pt_BR and pt_PT can not cohabitate in the same language pack, because MoManager recognizes both languages ​​just as 'pt'

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Bert
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Re: translation confusion...

#123 Post by Bert »

akarui.tenshi wrote:Good morning, However this language pack is in the Portuguese of Brazil (pt_BR) and not in Portuguese of Portugal (pt_PT), so I tried to modify it, but translations pt_BR and pt_PT can not cohabitate in the same language pack, because MoManager recognizes both languages ​​just as 'pt'
Good morning akarui.tenshi,

I think it's a good thing pt_BR and pt_PT cannot cohabitate in the same language pack...
You can make the choice what the target language has to look like : 'pt', or pt.BR' or 'pt_PT'. This choice is made in "Preferences" (bottom of momanager window. ("transLANG=...")

Hope this helps.
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L18L
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Re: translation confusion...

#124 Post by L18L »

Goodday and welcome :D
akarui.tenshi wrote:... i found a language pack in Portuguese. However this language pack is in the Portuguese of Brazil (pt_BR) and not in Portuguese of Portugal (pt_PT), so I tried to modify it, but translations pt_BR and pt_PT can not cohabitate in the same language pack, because MoManager recognizes both languages ​​just as 'pt'
languagepack_pt-2013 located at
http://distro.ibiblio.org/quirky/pet_packages-noarch/
made by forum member vicmz
has both

Code: Select all

# pwd
/initrd/mnt/dev_save/langpack_pt-20130110/usr/share/locale
# 
# ls
pt_BR  pt_PT
#
and just pt, ex: /usr/local/apps/ROX-Filer/Messages/pt/LC_MESSAGES

Thus they do exist (maybe manually created by vicmz [hello vicmz :D ] )
.. and momanager can only, how Bert wrote, create
pt or pt-BR if LANG=pt_BR
pt or pt-PT if LANG=pt_PT

...maybe mismatch between _ and - :?:

The question remains: Can you use them and how?

Theory is:
If your LANG is pt_PT then pt_PT is used else pt
If your LANG is pt_BR then pt_BR is used else pt

I am seeing differences in
/usr/local/apps/ROX-Filer/Messages/pt-PT/LC_MESSAGES/ROX-Filer.mo 78k
/usr/local/apps/ROX-Filer/Messages/pt-BR/LC_MESSAGES/ROX-Filer.mo 102k

( /usr/local/apps/ROX-Filer/Messages/pt-PT/LC_MESSAGES/ROX-Filer.mo could be just a link to ../pt/...)

@akarui.tenshi,
your experience in using with LANG=pt-PT vs. pt-BR?

akarui.tenshi
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Re: translation confusion...

#125 Post by akarui.tenshi »

L18L wrote:Goodday and welcome :D
hello, I have been here for a while, however, only now I decided to become an active member... :p
L18L wrote:languagepack_pt-2013 located at
http://distro.ibiblio.org/quirky/pet_packages-noarch/
made by forum member vicmz
Yes, it's the pt_Br language pack...

@akarui.tenshi,
your experience in using with LANG=pt-PT vs. pt-BR?[/quote]

My experience? well... for me, the english interface is ok... but for a portuguese users there are differences between the pt_BR and the pt_PT ( an example: "file" in pt_BR is "Arquivo" but in pt_PT is named "Ficheiro")... the same happens to the catalan of spain (language that i also speak) and the catalan spoken in some parts of France...
I know a little bit of programming and i'm trying to understand how MoManager and puppy linux manage the translations...
Bert wrote: I think it's a good thing pt_BR and pt_PT cannot cohabitate in the same language pack...
You can make the choice what the target language has to look like : 'pt', or pt.BR' or 'pt_PT'. This choice is made in "Preferences" (bottom of momanager window. ("transLANG=...")
when i choose pt_PT or pt_BR, the .desktop files work fine, but some translations like the 'sss' doesn't work

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vicmz
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Portuguese and Català

#126 Post by vicmz »

Hello L18L, Bert, akarui.tenshi

When I first made the Portuguese langpack, Momanager didn't have a setting to read from 'pt' folder for both 'pt-BR' and 'pt-PT', like in Spanish one 'es' folder is enough for the more than 20 countries including Spain. The SSS won't work properly because I didn't put separate desk_strings files for pt-PT and pt-BR. I'll try to fix it so that anyone interested can keep adding translations. I'm about to travel so maybe you'll have to wait until tomorrow.

akarui.tenshi,

By making a catalanish langpack you'll give many people the chance to renew old (and not-so-old) computers instead of waiting to earn enough to buy new ones. This is extremely important in our time. When I first used Puppy I could simply have remained English and let other people do it in the future, but I thought, 'why not now?' Something similar happened for Italian and Portuguese, although I don't speak these languages natively I wanted to start something for other people to have a base in the future. Sadly, I couldn't find the time to make more translations. As you know, langpack maintainers release a langpack version with new/updated translations every now and then, but I'm already the mainainer for Spanish. Also, users morscerta (Brazil) and SpeedyDuck (Italia) had said they wanted to continue these langpacks, but there's no news from them yet. There's been the idea of splitting langpack_pt into separate versions for European and Brazilian Portuguese, you could then make this for real, since morscerta is meant to do Brazilian Portuguese. Note that Abiword and a few applications don't have a translation to European Portuguese, if the source of the current versions doesn't include one you'll have to do them from the beginning. I'll help you as much as I can.

L18L,

Can I ask you a question? How can I modify the 'es' keyboard in Puppy so that instead of letter 'ñ' I can type dead_tilde? Currently, when I write Portuguese I use spellcheckers, I have to right-click every word that is meant to have dead tilde (informação, ecrã, definições). By switching to abnt-latin2 I have dead tilde, I can even type 'ñ', but then question marks (¿?) and exclamation marks (¡!) are missing, for my keyboard layout is not Portuguese.

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L18L
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Re: keyboard layouts

#127 Post by L18L »

vicmz wrote:Can I ask you a question?...
Yes but I cannot give you an answer and hope forum member oui can.

---
Are you sure the Korean dog is not a cat :lol: and the Indonesian a bird :?:
wuff wuff

oui

#128 Post by oui »

Hi

Thank you L18L for your intervention.

West-European languages (and more) are absolutely no problem! Yes, using Puppy:

áâàäã
Last edited by oui on Thu 10 Oct 2013, 13:34, edited 1 time in total.

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vicmz
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#129 Post by vicmz »

Oui,

Thank you. It means I need another keyboard. I've tried to get a US-layout one but couldn't.

L18L,

Korean bark is pronounced 'mong mong', I don't know what's mong mong or guk guk in Indonesian but certainly meong meong is cat sound. :lol:

About the Portuguese langpack, I tried to build a new one with FFMM and got 221 .desktop files in /usr/share/applications.in (only 45 of them had Portuguese translations, the other files have... Spanish translations) and the 'es' folder along with the 'pt' one for ROX-filer - surprise! Momanager interprets Spanish as part of Portuguese language. :shock: I knew many people confuse both languages, but, come on! :lol: Alright, I suppose I need a separate clean install for working exclusively on Portuguese stuff. :D
Last edited by vicmz on Thu 10 Oct 2013, 06:05, edited 1 time in total.
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vicmz
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#130 Post by vicmz »

Well, here it is, a European Portuguese langpack, small because the amount of translations found/made so far but it's a start point. Check and tell:
http://yadi.sk/d/cSTs-X57Agh6b
NOTE: the .mo files are stored at /usr/share/locale/pt/LC_MESSAGES. If they are stored on the pt_PT folder they don't work, or at least not in the latest Puppy Precise.
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oui

#131 Post by oui »

hi vicmz

My keyboard hardware is Ch (Swiss),
I see that the Pt keyboard layout from Puppy is about the same as my Ch layout :lol: :

¬¡⅛£$⅜

akarui.tenshi
Posts: 4
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#132 Post by akarui.tenshi »

vicmz wrote: the .mo files are stored at /usr/share/locale/pt/LC_MESSAGES. If they are stored on the pt_PT folder they don't work, or at least not in the latest Puppy Precise.
es_ES: Lo mismo también ocurre con los ficheros 'sss'
en: The same also applies to the files 'sss'

i had made a little language pack to the pt_PT, in very early stage (alpha stage :p), it doesn't include any .mo file

http://yadi.sk/d/Le8vVO0ZAi7Ac

vicmz: Some desktop translations i consider that aren't right... like 'trash' in fact in pt_PT the right translation is 'lixo' but all Windows users are accustomed to seeing 'reciclagem'...

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L18L
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keyboard

#133 Post by L18L »

oui wrote:I see it is possible to write all Spanish letters like ñ or ¿ or ü. What do you want more?
vicmz,
I have just succesfully tried

Code: Select all

# setxkbmap pt
# informação definições
this was typed in not pasted :D

Code: Select all

#  setxkbdmap us intl
bash: setxkbdmap: command not found
#  setxkbmap us intl
# Zæx©vbñµç

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vicmz
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#134 Post by vicmz »

Thank you guys. No, AltGr combinations never work for me. The reason why in 'es' keyboard I can't type ~ (oh no! My new phone doesn't have dead tilde either!) and in 'pt' keyboard I can't ask questions ¿? or show emotions ¡! is that in my keyboard layout some buttons are merged, whereas in other layouts the same buttons are split into two. I have to get a keyboard that has exactly the same quantity and arrangement of buttons. New keyboards split the Enter key into to but the long Shift key remains.
akarui.tenshi wrote:
vicmz wrote: the .mo files are stored at /usr/share/locale/pt/LC_MESSAGES. If they are stored on the pt_PT folder they don't work, or at least not in the latest Puppy Precise.
es_ES: Lo mismo también ocurre con los ficheros 'sss'
en: The same also applies to the files 'sss'

i had made a little language pack to the pt_PT, in very early stage (alpha stage :p), it doesn't include any .mo file

http://yadi.sk/d/Le8vVO0ZAi7Ac

vicmz: Some desktop translations i consider that aren't right... like 'trash' in fact in pt_PT the right translation is 'lixo' but all Windows users are accustomed to seeing 'reciclagem'...
Thank you for the feedback. When I do more translations I'll send them to you so that you can check. Do the other translations work? Rox filer, Abiword, etc. Some files in my langpack version where put manually, for example hunspell dictionaries.
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vicmz
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#135 Post by vicmz »

akarui.tenshi,

This is version 2 of the langpack I posted today, including your translations and spellcheck dictionaries:
http://yadi.sk/d/VUGWHNOCAjD5W
You can see the contents of the PET by using the Extract-Makepet right-click tool.
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akarui.tenshi
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L18L... i have a doubt

#136 Post by akarui.tenshi »

Hi... L18L i have a doubt,

what is the meaning of this expression:

LANG="`grep '^LANG=' /etc/profile | cut -f 2 -d '=' | cut -f 1 -d ' '`"

I think that this expression means
LANG (the current language of puppy) "cut f 2" (use only two bytes to recognize the language?)

I'm confused, because, for example (in my case), pt_BR and pt_PT both of them have the same 2 first bytes 'pt' but they aren't the same language, they have differences like the US english and the UK english...

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L18L
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Re: L18L... i have a doubt

#137 Post by L18L »

akarui.tenshi wrote:Hi... L18L i have a doubt,

what is the meaning of this expression:

LANG="`grep '^LANG=' /etc/profile | cut -f 2 -d '=' | cut -f 1 -d ' '`"

I think that this expression means
LANG (the current language of puppy) "cut f 2" (use only two bytes to recognize the language?)

I'm confused, because, for example (in my case), pt_BR and pt_PT both of them have the same 2 first bytes 'pt' but they aren't the same language, they have differences like the US english and the UK english...
cut -f 2 -d '=' means
cut field number 2 where field delimiter is =
thus everything after =

Code: Select all

cut --help
helps

I do not understand the meaning of the next cut
"everything before blank" ?
should be dot.

if line
LANG=pt_PT.UTF8
in /etc/profile
then LANG will be pt_PT

This line in /etc/profile is updated by script

Code: Select all

chooselocale
.

Where did you find this "LANG=...." ?

Do continue to post all of your doubts here please.
You are the first translator to a language where the letters after the underscore are important. So you might find some bugs. :wink:

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L18L
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momanager

#138 Post by L18L »

What's new?

Code: Select all

#131013 L18L delete harmful pot files
#131014 L18L WINDOW_WIDTH no more in preferences
#131015 L18L output directory MOMADIR for MoManager-* files configurable by preferences
#131013 L18L delete harmful pot files
These are the files that prevent momanager from creating an actual pot file.
Nothing harmful happens because they continue to exist inside devx file...

#131014 L18L WINDOW_WIDTH no more in preferences
window width is "computed" from screen width....1180px max.

#131015 L18L output directory MOMADIR for MoManager-* files configurable by preferences

These files are not needed if you are the maintainer of the language_pack.
They are needed if you want to contribute a single translation and send it to the maintainer or the developper of the app.

All files created by momanager (but not the languagepack) are written into this directory.
Type in whatever you wish as directory name, this directory will be created if it is not already existing.
Example1: MOMADIR=/root/MoManager-files (Bert's suggestion)
Example2: MOMADIR=/mnt/home/momanager-files (outside of save file)
Example3: MOMADIR=/tmp/momanager-files (no persistance!)
Example4: MOMADIR=/dev/null (no existence at all 8) )
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Bert
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#139 Post by Bert »

MoManager 20131015 is the best ever!

It 'remembered' my settings. Nice.
It stretched itself, filling about two-thirds of my screen. Nice.

So far , it didn't go after the bad ('harmful') guys in /usr/share/doc/nls, but I'm confident it will, when creating a new pet.

Just to illustrate the greatness of this new FFMM: I installed a new puplet, added the devx and, without thinking too much about what I was doing, clicked 'MoManager' in the menu... Up came the original MoManager...it still works, but feels like an old snail crawling through tired molasses...

Just incredible how L18L has implemented little incremental improvements over the months and how MoManager has benefited from all those careful steps!

Of course I was eager to use the new option to save the momanager-dump to another place than /root. I chose /mnt/home/momanager-files as the new directory and lord-and-behold, it was created. But, the first translation I saved was not sent to this new folder, instead it arrived in the old place: /root, which already looked like a composting pile with all these translation files littering it.
It will maybe take a few more translations to persuade MM to send the dump to /mnt/home/...?

To paraphrase current political news: "A source close to the steering committee, who prefers to stay anonymous, told us that FFMM has already been chosen as the default puppy internationalization tool." :lol:


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L18L
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#140 Post by L18L »

Bert,

thank you for the nice words!

But I could not have done it without you
who has always given feedback and made good suggestions.

folder in /mnt/home,
I did not test it before, just /root/MOMA.
Now I changed it in preferences

Code: Select all

CONS_HEIGHT=20                # number of characters
#MOMADIR=/root/MOMA            # (existing or not) directory for storing resulting files
MOMADIR=/mnt/home/MOMA-files  # (existing or not) directory for storing resulting files
..and it has been used instantly (

Code: Select all

# pwd
/initrd/mnt/dev_save/MOMA-files
# ls
MoManager-de-UExtract-2.3-in  MoManager-de-UExtract-2.3-in.tar.gz
# 
)

other puplet
I have been trying it in luci528 without success (because window just 1 byte wide)

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