PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement <CLOSED>

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James C
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#21 Post by James C »

Q5sys wrote: Still archiving... http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/phatslacko/
Had to do the same in some threads with the famous or infamous Puppyite ...... still got the stuff on the hard drive. :lol:

gcmartin

#22 Post by gcmartin »

I had not visited this thread since its outset day. Its opening is a clear intention to draw attention to some aspects of the distro that could have been overlooked.

Then looking today, I felt comments here attacks the very good work that 01Micko has presented the community. And, I reacted. Yes, I do find those posts as methods of diminishing his contribution and an attempt to use this thread to achieve such.

I am aware of Q5sys's own Slackware 64bit efforts.

I stand by my claim.

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#23 Post by jamesbond »

Well I don't know how others read this thread (in the beginning), but I must admit that when I read the original first post (that was a few days ago, before it got edited), I got the same impression as James C and starhawk - I thought this is gcmartin's creation, especially knowing that gcmartin liked FatSlacko features. The name change only made it so (I thought gcmartin took FatSlacko, remastered it and released it as PhatSlacko). Only after more careful read and reading others' comments, and doing a google search to find 01micko's release annoucement myself I became aware that it is actually 01micko's work (and a good one at that Image).

As for "telling development what to do!" - my take on it is that it is a fine line between "suggesting/request" and "telling", and different people may not view the same comment in the same way. As for me, I can definitely say that I've got my share of that "suggestion/requests", sometimes repeatedly despite my explanation of why it won't get done :wink:

Back to the main topic, I think it is not fair to compare PHATSlacko with Apple and Microsoft OS. Doing so is a disservice to PHATSlacko and discourtesy to 01micko. Let me point out what I mean:
a) Does the competitor (Apple/Microsoft) provides full office suite out of the box (and by full I don't mean stuff like WordPad or Calculator or MS Paint)
b) Does the competitor provides full-featured that can play most media formats out there?
c) Can the competitor be used to run live system from CD/DVD/USB flash drive?
d) Can one copy of the competitor system be used to boot multiple *different* computer systems?
e) How about hardware support? Does the competitor supports as much hardware devices as PHATSlacko (without having to install / download 3rd party drivers)?
f) Can the competitor be run on machines with less than 1 GB of RAM and less than 10GB of harddisk space while providing the same functionality as PHATSlacko (lest someone think that this configuration is useless in todays "big desktop system", remember in many desktop virtualisation systems, one tries to minimise the OS footprint consumed by the desktop VM).
I can go on and on, there are many finer points, but at the end of the day I am in the opinion that PHATSlacko provides functionalities way beyond those of its competitor - so saying that it is a viable replacement of its competitor is an understatement :lol:

cheers everyone !
Fatdog64 forum links: [url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=117546]Latest version[/url] | [url=https://cutt.ly/ke8sn5H]Contributed packages[/url] | [url=https://cutt.ly/se8scrb]ISO builder[/url]

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#24 Post by Q5sys »

gcmartin wrote:I had not visited this thread since its outset day. Its opening is a clear intention to draw attention to some aspects of the distro that could have been overlooked.

Then looking today, I felt comments here attacks the very good work that 01Micko has presented the community. And, I reacted. Yes, I do find those posts as methods of diminishing his contribution and an attempt to use this thread to achieve such.

I am aware of Q5sys's own Slackware 64bit efforts.

I stand by my claim.
Yes I currently am doing work with a base of 64bit slackware. So is JamesBond... So is Kirk... So is TazOC. None of that has anything to do with 01Mickos work on his 32bit variants of Slackware. I've built stuff for the 32bit Slackware releases, I've given 01Micko suggestions. Some of which after thinking about he's agreed and implemented.
I want this forum to have a strong 32bit slackware release... and I think we currently have a great one.

None of that has anything to do with my comments regarding your actions. My comments about your actions have nothing to do with the skill of 01Micko and/or the quality of his release.

I made no such attacks against 01Micko or any of his releases. And since anyone can view this thread in its history they can see that I have not.

None of this addresses the issue of the following:
1.) 01Micko had a thread for his release of PHATSlacko which at this point already spans 4 pages; and is the proper place for informaiton and bug reporting and announcements.
2.) You decided to create another thread 'announcing' PHATSlacko, and failed to mention that it was created by 01Micko.
3.) JamesC , made a post where he commented on 01Micko being the developer
4.) Starhawk thought briefly that you were the developer, because you failed to mention 01Micko in your post.
5.) I notice that you edited your original post to include a mention of 01Micko.
6.) Starhawk confirms that he thought for a moment that you were the developer.
7.) You flame me and Starhawk for being hostile again 01Micko (which we were not)
8.) I address the fact that you edited your post.
9.) You effectively call me a liar.
10.) JamesC Confirms that the informaiton about 01Micko was missing from your original post.

You said you stand by your 'claims'... I stand by the facts.

But the important question. Why are you creating posts for other developers releases when they have ALREADY created threads for them?

gcmartin

#25 Post by gcmartin »

What is your problem in understanding. Go look at the first day's post to this thread.

You continue to try to impose some logic contrary to the Opening Thread's post.

For the last time Q5sys, LOOK AT THE TITLE AND THEN READ THE THEME!

This thread is NOT doing what you continue to try to emphasize. It is an announce which does NOT ask for or request bug posting or anything. You are mis-guiding the reality. You comments are aimed as I claim, herein.

I stand by my claim!

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#26 Post by Q5sys »

gcmartin wrote:What is your problem in understanding. Go look at the first day's post to this thread.
I cant go back and look at the first days post. Because I cant go back in time and see what the post was before you changed it.
gcmartin wrote:You continue to try to impose some logic contrary to the Opening Thread's post.
No you've changed the opening post to include information it did not have at the time. So yes, now it has that information. Previously it did not.
gcmartin wrote:For the last time Q5sys, LOOK AT THE TITLE AND THEN READ THE THEME!
I can read the post you've edited. I cannot go back and look at tte post that existed before you changed it.
gcmartin wrote:This thread is NOT doing what you continue to try to emphasize. It is an announce which does NOT ask for or request bug posting or anything. You are mis-guiding the reality. You comments are aimed as I claim, herein.

I stand by my claim!
You stand by being a dishonest person and being very deceitful by changing your posts after the fact and then trying to call others liars.

You have changed your post as I've claimed. I've provided screencap proof of your editing later posts. I do not have a copy of your original post, however Both JamesC and Jamesbond have both stated that the original post did not contain credit to 01Micko and was worded in a confusing way to make it appear that you were the developer.

We can see the first post as it exists now that you've edited it. We cannot see the original post where you did not give 01micko credit.

So I guess your claim is that myself, JamesC, and JamesBond are all wrong?

I ask again: Why are you creating posts for other developers releases when they have ALREADY created threads for them?

gcmartin

#27 Post by gcmartin »

There is an allusion that is being past on here which tends to

JamesBond
Thanks for your comments. But, I think you have to admit, that nowhere in the title or its opening thread does it, either, now or ever, say anything about Microsoft/Apple comparison. Opening thread has alway provided the idea that should anyone try this distro, they will be able to do similar/same as he does with an OOTB Microsoft/Apple PC. Right??? Look again. None of that information has been changed. The credit to 01Micko has ALWAYS BEEN THERE! I even made it boldly clearer.

All of this thread was intended to be a help to with a message of his distro. I consider this 32bit distro a shining example of the full featured distros that are produced in this community. And a shining example of how Puppy Linux provides great services for its users.

You, yourself will attest to that, I’m sure. This thread has the same singular mission as it has had from the outset.

Q5sys
In review, I find nowhere that you have made ANY attempt to bring value thru word or deed to PhatSlacko. No contributing anything.

But, you have done something in the Slacko community. I can draw attention to, both, this and another dismal effort to derail 01Micko’s contribution in PAE distro offerings by using a beta copy of his and proclaiming no value, when this very community has shown over and over that there is value in both perceived and actual system performance and behavior. That very effort by you appeared to be aimed at diminishing the value of his work there, too.

If you can show us somewhere that you have done something to promote any value to PhatSlacko, it would be worth a reconsideration on my part of whether you are not and did not try to defame his contribution by using this thread to do so.

Lastly, I have done similar with TaZoC work and with Fatdog over the years as well as have drawn attention to other works by developers in this community. I have NEVER claimed credit for anyone’s work in this community. And with those developers I have had occasion to work with, I’ve always done so to their credit....not my own. I legitimately feel they deserve credit for the contributions they make to all of us. That is my legacy. It is consistent. And each developer I have worked with, directly or indirectly, will say the same, I'm sure.

I am about as honest as anyone you'll ever know.

Q5sys, I stand by my claim.

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#28 Post by Q5sys »

gcmartin wrote:Look again. None of that information has been changed. The credit to 01Micko has ALWAYS BEEN THERE! I even made it boldly clearer.
So you are calling myself, JamesC and Jamesbond Liars for stating that the information was not there before you edited your post?

gcmartin wrote:But, you have done something in the Slacko community. I can draw attention to, both, this and another dismal effort to derail 01Micko’s contribution in PAE distro offerings by using a beta copy of his and proclaiming no value, when this very community has shown over and over that there is value in both perceived and actual system performance and behavior. That very effort by you appeared to be aimed at diminishing the value of his work there, too.
I did not attempt to derail any PAE offering. So you're lying there. I made a thread and posted a multitude of tests regarding PAE vs NON-PAE kernels and performance impact. Stating factual tests does not mean Im derailing anything. I have no problem with PAE, it has its place, I do not however feel that PAE should be the default version. 01Micko apparently agrees, since the primary download of versions of Slacko are NON-PAE. The PAE version is an option choice for people. Furthermore I didnt use a beta copy of any of his work. So you're lying there too. I tested offical releases, and posted them for everyone to see. And 01Micko commented in that thread. If he felt I was attacking his work he would have been in his right to state so. He did not, in fact he made the comment that he was going to reference my work so users could decide for themselves. See This thread and this post.

gcmartin wrote:If you can show us somewhere that you have done something to promote any value to PhatSlacko, it would be worth a reconsideration on my part of whether you are not and did not try to defame his contribution by using this thread to do so.
No I have not created threads about PhatSlacko because I feel the thread that 01Micko created is sufficient to talk about his thread. I see no reason to go create more threads when we already have a thread in place to talk about that release. As such I have made positive comments about Phatslacko and 01Micko's work in this very thread. I guess you're selective reading skill caused you to not read what I said.

gcmartin wrote:I legitimately feel they deserve credit for the contributions they make to all of us. That is my legacy. It is consistent. And each developer I have worked with, directly or indirectly, will say the same, I'm sure.
You're talking about 'Your Legacy'?! I dont even know how to comment on someone who feels they have a 'legacy'... I'm just a simple person.
gcmartin wrote:I am about as honest as anyone you'll ever know.
If you are the measure of Honesty... The world is doomed.



still archiving...

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#29 Post by Q5sys »

If 01Micko comes forward and says that I have made comments that he feels are negative or hostile or otherwise an attempt to discredit his work... I will publicly apologize to him, as that was not my intention at any point through any of my posts in this thread.

All he has to do is show me where I have attacked him and/or his work , and I will publicly retract those statements, and make a public apology to him.
Last edited by Q5sys on Sat 23 Mar 2013, 20:35, edited 2 times in total.

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Introducing PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement

#30 Post by Monsie »

Hi all,

I am trying to make sense of this thread, trying to understand the dynamics of the situation.... I am not interested (at this point) in taking sides or casting blame here.

That said, an accusation has been made that gcmartin is editing his post(s) in this thread apparently to alter the content and tone of what he said --in response to feedback from others. Given what others have said about the confusion as to who created the PhatSlacko 5.5 re-mix, this seems to be a valid concern. However, if that is the case, then it seems to me that earlier posts by gcmartin should be stamped as having been edited x number of times...

Is it possible to edit one's posts surreptitiously after others have posted in the thread? What is going on here?

Respectfully,
Monsie
My [u]username[/u] is pronounced: "mun-see". Derived from my surname, it was my nickname throughout high school.

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Re: Introducing PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement

#31 Post by Q5sys »

Monsie wrote:Hi all,

I am trying to make sense of this thread, trying to understand the dynamics of the situation.... I am not interested (at this point) in taking sides or casting blame here.

That said, an accusation has been made that gcmartin is editing his post(s) in this thread apparently to alter the content and tone of what he said --in response to feedback from others. Given what others have said about the confusion as to who created the PhatSlacko 5.5 re-mix, this seems to be a valid concern. However, if that is the case, then it seems to me that earlier posts by gcmartin should be stamped as having been edited x number of times...

Is it possible to edit one's posts surreptitiously after others have posted in the thread? What is going on here?

Respectfully,
Monsie


Yes it is possible to edit your post without that little "edit" line showing up.
That feature of the forum seems to get turned on and off. I'm not sure why. It seems to only get turned on after there has been an issue of threads getting edited after.
I dont know why its not on all the time. I can only guess there is some resource reason.
Example below.
See the difference between these to:
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-edit.png
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-original.png

Here is another example from this thread previously. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 124#694124
You'll see that I commented about my edit to the post... but the 'edit line' did not show up, even though there was another post after.
It seems however that it was just turned on since my post prior to your post now shows an edit line.



EDIT: added example.

EDIT2: addded 2nd example

EDIT3: Testing to see if the edit-line option is on.
Last edited by Q5sys on Sat 23 Mar 2013, 21:13, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Introducing PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement

#32 Post by James C »

Q5sys wrote:
Monsie wrote:Hi all,

I am trying to make sense of this thread, trying to understand the dynamics of the situation.... I am not interested (at this point) in taking sides or casting blame here.

That said, an accusation has been made that gcmartin is editing his post(s) in this thread apparently to alter the content and tone of what he said --in response to feedback from others. Given what others have said about the confusion as to who created the PhatSlacko 5.5 re-mix, this seems to be a valid concern. However, if that is the case, then it seems to me that earlier posts by gcmartin should be stamped as having been edited x number of times...

Is it possible to edit one's posts surreptitiously after others have posted in the thread? What is going on here?

Respectfully,
Monsie


Yes it is possible to edit your post without that little "edit" line showing up.
That feature of the forum seems to get turned on and off. I'm not sure why. It seems to only get turned on after there has been an issue of threads getting edited after.
I dont know why its not on all the time. I can only guess there is some resource reason.
Example below.
See the difference between these to:
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-edit.png
http://q5sys.info/edited_posts/gcpost-original.png

Here is another example from this thread previously. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 124#694124
You'll see that I commented about my edit to the post... but the 'edit line' did not show up, even though there was another post after.
It seems however that it was just turned on since my post prior to your post now shows an edit line.



EDIT: added example.

EDIT2: addded 2nd example
You edited twice yet yet your post doesn't have the edit line? Curious.

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Re: Introducing PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement

#33 Post by Q5sys »

James C wrote:
You edited twice yet yet your post doesn't have the edit line? Curious.
I know with PHPBB3 forum the edit line only shows up IF someone else posts after you. But its not on by default board wide. Its an option in the Admin Control Panel which can be turned on and off.
I'm unsure of its exact implementation in PHPBB2 forums.
It may need to be turned on for specific threads. I have no idea. All I know is that in the last thread where this became an issue (the PAE thread)... it wasnt on until I made a comment to the mods about posts getting edited... then it suddenly was on for that thread.

It is my belief that it should be turned on board wide as default setting... to prevent this very problem.

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#34 Post by James C »

If I'm following along correctly with this thread I'm either too stupid to have read the first post correctly and just missed any mention of 01micko and a link to Phat Slacko...which led to my posting the link to the original Phat Slacko thread or I'm dishonest about the fact that the first post has been edited.I just would like some clarification as to what I'm apparently being accused of.

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#35 Post by Q5sys »

James C wrote:If I'm following along correctly with this thread I'm either too stupid to have read the first post correctly and just missed any mention of 01micko and a link to Phat Slacko...which led to my posting the link to the original Phat Slacko thread or I'm dishonest about the fact that the first post has been edited.I just would like some clarification as to what I'm apparently being accused of.
I believe the accusation is that gcmartin is saying that he did credit 01Micko in his original post and had a link, and that you, myself and Jamesbond are all lying when he say that he edited his original post to add that.

I think that's what he's saying since he is stating outright that he never edited his first post other than to 'clarify' what was already there.

But I'm certain the accusation will change again... like everything else in this thread apparently.

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#36 Post by James C »

Q5sys wrote:
gcmartin wrote:But, you have done something in the Slacko community. I can draw attention to, both, this and another dismal effort to derail 01Micko’s contribution in PAE distro offerings by using a beta copy of his and proclaiming no value, when this very community has shown over and over that there is value in both perceived and actual system performance and behavior. That very effort by you appeared to be aimed at diminishing the value of his work there, too.
I did not attempt to derail any PAE offering. So you're lying there. I made a thread and posted a multitude of tests regarding PAE vs NON-PAE kernels and performance impact. Stating factual tests does not mean Im derailing anything. I have no problem with PAE, it has its place, I do not however feel that PAE should be the default version. 01Micko apparently agrees, since the primary download of versions of Slacko are NON-PAE. The PAE version is an option choice for people. Furthermore I didnt use a beta copy of any of his work. So you're lying there too. I tested offical releases, and posted them for everyone to see. And 01Micko commented in that thread. If he felt I was attacking his work he would have been in his right to state so. He did not, in fact he made the comment that he was going to reference my work so users could decide for themselves. See This thread and this post.
I'm fairly comfortable in saying that 01micko is not really bother by any criticism of PAE..... since I'm probably the most anti-PAE member of this forum.Remember my favorite quote from Linus Torvalds.......
PAE really really sucks.
http://www.realworldtech.com/forum/?thr ... stid=76973

People can disagree without things turning personal. :)

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Re: Introducing PhatSlacko 5.5 - A Microsoft-Apple Replacement

#37 Post by James C »

Q5sys wrote:
James C wrote:
You edited twice yet yet your post doesn't have the edit line? Curious.
I know with PHPBB3 forum the edit line only shows up IF someone else posts after you. But its not on by default board wide. Its an option in the Admin Control Panel which can be turned on and off.
I'm unsure of its exact implementation in PHPBB2 forums.
It may need to be turned on for specific threads. I have no idea. All I know is that in the last thread where this became an issue (the PAE thread)... it wasnt on until I made a comment to the mods about posts getting edited... then it suddenly was on for that thread.

It is my belief that it should be turned on board wide as default setting... to prevent this very problem.
This forum appears to suffer from quite a few glitches......things may be turned on but only work occasionally.

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#38 Post by Q5sys »

James C wrote:People can disagree without things turning personal. :)
Apparently to some people, if you disagree with some application of technology you're not only attacking their work, but you are attacking them personally.

This is why I prefer the academic mindset of peer review. It's not personal, its about the subject.

gcmartin

#39 Post by gcmartin »

Let's get things straight because Q5sys continiuues to attempt his own twist.

My Opening POST TODAY mentions Q5sys, directly. Its about what I percieve to be a discredit to the work of 01Micko.

i call no one stupid or liar. I have had this post around for awhile. Q5sys continues to try to back away or disguise what I found offensive. And he also doesn't seem to understand the title, or the theme as he continues to make attempts to discount the contribution by arguing about what information is available for public review.

This is his problem. This is what I refer

I haven't lied or dismissed anyone else here. On opening day this thread was opened and made clearer. He objects in such a way as to dimiinish 01Micko work. I find his objections to be his method of diminishing that work. This thread is about that contribution. It was titled and themed around that contribution.

His effort is not about timing or posting. Its about diminishing!!!

Maybe no one else is going to point this out to him. But, I do!

I stand by my claim!!!

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#40 Post by Q5sys »

Gcmartin,
You can continue to make claims over and over, but the facts presented in this thread can be clearly viewed by everyone.
I've made a statement that I'm willing to apologize to 01Micko if he feels I have insulted him or his work. So far YOU are the only person saying that I'm taking away from 01Micko's work. I hope 01Micko will make a statement as to his opinions on this issue, but thats a choice that he has to make.

1) I have made no negative comments about 01Micko or his work.
2) You continue to insist that I have.
3) I have asked you to show me where I have.
4) You refuse to show me where I have insulted 01micko or his work.
5) You continue to claim I am insulting 01Micko and his work while providing no proof.

Instead of showing me where I've insulted 01Micko... you decided slander me with false claims... which you refuse to provide proof for.


Just like in the PAE thread, you make claims over and over and you refuse to back up them with proof.

However, there are multiple people in this thread who have commented about your actions regarding editing posts and changing what you've posted. By insisting that you have not added this information, you are calling Myself, JamesC, and Jamesbond liars.

Lastly you still have not given a reason why you created a thread for another developers work when a thread already existed to promote that release.

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