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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
Fatdog64-611 Final (Updated 12-14-2012)
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 4767
Location: GB

PostPosted: Mon 03 Dec 2012, 16:29    Post subject:  

What ho, pre!
No, neither of those boot codes originate from Puppies, although I've seen the vga=normal suggested somewhere about six months or more ago on this Forum. They were codes I used to use with Knoppix 1.0.0 ! But it was said somewhere that these are common to the Linux kernel. Any road up, they don't do any harm and I have had them work occasionally in the situations you describe.
As for the 754, - No. Mind you, I've had endless trouble with 939 BIOSes. Had to unsolder one once with an electric paint stripper, flash it externally using the /F (force) switch on an alien board, fit a socket and put the BIOS chip in that. It worked for a while, but it gradually dawned on me that the 939 is a design disaster, probably a stop-gap until the Phenom and multiple cores arrived. Not like AMD to pull a fast one like that. Shame really because the multiple core designs are an even bigger disaster, some of Intel's latest are devouring 120W. So much for their lies about running cooler. That is one dud company that has never conquered the thermal issues associated with faster, smaller and thinner - sometimes I even wonder if there's anyone there familiar with Ohm's/Kichoff's/ all-those-other-guys-Laws in school physics?!
The big attraction of 754 and 939 is they have two IDE ports. I was reading elsewhere today the old urban myths about SATA being trotted out again. Now, I'm not sure about SATAIII, but there is NO actual speed gain between ATA100 (ATA133 is like hen's teeth) and SATAI&II. If one reads very very carefully. it's the spec. for SATA that's a lot faster - real drives barely manage ATA transfer rates. It's the old rotating machinery paradox. In principal, SSSD s should be faster, but only if the bus can handle it and their lifetimes in terms of read-write cycles might be uncertain? Early flash memory was suspect in that regard, although I've had no problems with multiple writes. Perhaps we won't know for some years yet?
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ggg

Joined: 26 Apr 2011
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Mon 03 Dec 2012, 16:47    Post subject:  

.
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DrDeaf

Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Mon 03 Dec 2012, 20:11    Post subject:  

No known issues with 610. Everything works well, and 601 did as well. No optical drive installed, but this machine is booted clean from ISO to RAM.

I edited the hardware report extensively for brevity, but I'll post any further info if anyone wants. Again, this is just to say, no problems known with this hardware.

Processors-
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3520M CPU @ 2.90GHz : 1200.00MHz
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3520M CPU @ 2.90GHz : 1200.00MHz
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3520M CPU @ 2.90GHz : 1200.00MHz
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3520M CPU @ 2.90GHz : 2901.00MHz

Memory-
Total Memory : 16130616 kB
Free Memory : 15092068 kB
Buffers : 55536 kB
Cached : 461268 kB
Cached Swap : 0 kB
Active : 523404 kB
Inactive : 445112 kB
Active(anon) : 478944 kB
Inactive(anon) : 67188 kB
Active(file) : 44460 kB
Inactive(file) : 377924 kB

PCI Devices-
Host bridge : Intel Corporation Device 0154 (rev 09)
VGA compatible controller : Intel Corporation Device 0166 (rev 09) (prog-if 00 [VGA controller])
USB Controller : Intel Corporation Device 1e31 (rev 04) (prog-if 30)
Communication controller : Intel Corporation Device 1e3a (rev 04)
Ethernet controller : Intel Corporation Device 1502 (rev 04)
USB Controller : Intel Corporation Device 1e2d (rev 04) (prog-if 20 [EHCI])
Audio device : Intel Corporation Device 1e20 (rev 04)
PCI bridge : Intel Corporation Device 1e10 (rev c4) (prog-if 00 [Normal decode])
PCI bridge : Intel Corporation Device 1e12 (rev c4) (prog-if 00 [Normal decode])
PCI bridge : Intel Corporation Device 1e14 (rev c4) (prog-if 00 [Normal decode])
USB Controller : Intel Corporation Device 1e26 (rev 04) (prog-if 20 [EHCI])
ISA bridge : Intel Corporation Device 1e55 (rev 04)
SATA controller : Intel Corporation Device 1e03 (rev 04) (prog-if 01 [AHCI 1.0])
SMBus : Intel Corporation Device 1e22 (rev 04)
System peripheral : Ricoh Co Ltd Device e823 (rev 07) (prog-if 01)
Network controller : Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. Device 8176 (rev 01)

USB Devices-
3.0 root hub
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frankge

Joined: 02 Dec 2012
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon 03 Dec 2012, 22:05    Post subject: desktop icons
Subject description: explanation
 

Many thanks for you patience with this new kennel member. I am trying to find out about the security and accessibility of windows 7 64-bit drives which are seen as icons on the desktop of fatdog64 601 booted from a live cd.
Could you please help me understand the following: Clicking on said icons, mounted or unmounted, then right-clicking "edit item", a "locked" check box appears. Just exactly what will be locked. Does it lock the win 7 drive only in linux or does it carry over to windows?
Are there other methods available in fatdog64 to limit acces of windows drives?
I'appreciate your reply
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rcrsn51


Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 8555
Location: Stratford, Ontario

PostPosted: Mon 03 Dec 2012, 23:40    Post subject: Re: desktop icons
Subject description: explanation
 

frankge wrote:
I am trying to find out about the security and accessibility of windows 7 64-bit drives

There is no such thing as a "64-bit drive". Instead, you should refer to them by their filesystem type. They are probably NTFS.

Quote:
Clicking on said icons, mounted or unmounted, then right-clicking "edit item", a "locked" check box appears.

If you click on any other desktop icon, you will see the same Locked option. It refers to the behaviour of the icon itself, not to how the drive is treated.

Quote:
Does it lock the win 7 drive only in linux or does it carry over to windows?

Neither.
Quote:
Are there other methods available in fatdog64 to limit acces of windows drives?

Here is a trick to make NTFS partitions read-only in Fatdog.

1. Go to the folder /bin
2. Rename the file ntfs-3g as ntfs-3g-xxx

Last edited by rcrsn51 on Tue 04 Dec 2012, 13:20; edited 1 time in total
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1365
Location: florida

PostPosted: Tue 04 Dec 2012, 00:23    Post subject:  

Quote:
At prompt ran xorgwizard-old.

Next problem, tried this with and without graphics card, and never succeeded in configuring much of anything. I keep getting the defective report screen with resolution and refresh rates missing at the end.


Yep, xorgwizard-old is broke, I haven't used it for ages. Fatdog64 by default runs without an xorg.conf. We really don't want use a xorg.conf file. So I think we'll do away with xorgwizard and xorgwizard-old. Xorg determines which resolution to use based on the EDID data from the monitor, so if monitor doesn't report EDID data or reports it in correctly, Xorg has to guess about the resolution. For non vesa drivers (drivers that are xrandr compliant) resolution can be set with xrandr or the Display Properties in the control panel. I'll fix the pfix=vesa boot option to make an entry in /usr/X11R7/lib64/X11/xorg.conf.d/. That's where want to make changes to Xorg. Thanks for reporting this.

Quote:
Can I get VESA to go beyond 1024x768 in FATDOG? If so, how?


Maybe, you'll need to find out if your card supports vesa modes of that resolution and if your monitor supports that resolution. You can look in /var/log/Xorg.0.log or run ddcprobe, which will list both. Then you'll need to make a file, /usr/X11R7/lib64/X11/xorg.conf.d/20-gpudriver.conf:

Code:
Section "Monitor"
    Identifier             "Monitor0"
EndSection

Section "Device"
    Identifier             "Device0"
    Driver                 "vesa" #Choose the driver used for this monitor
EndSection

Section "Screen"
    Identifier             "Screen0"  #Collapse Monitor and Device section to Screen section
    Device                 "Device0"
    Monitor                "Monitor0"
    DefaultDepth            16 #Choose the depth (16||24)
    SubSection             "Display"
        Depth               16
        Modes              "1024x768" #Choose the resolution
    EndSubSection
EndSection
   


After that make sure there's no /etc/X11/xorg.conf file. You may or may not have to use the nomodeset kernel boot option depending on your hardware, but nomodeset is a safe bet with vesa. We need to update our FAQs with this information. I expect most 64bit systems (probably less than 5 years old) to be EDID compliant and setting the resolution won't be needed for vesa. Well, hopefully we won't need vesa ether, usually that happens Nvidia or something really new.
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Horst

Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Tue 04 Dec 2012, 10:02    Post subject: HowTo resize pupsafe file  

Hello,

I'm about to install Lazarus from debian packages and went out of space.
Freepascal ist already running fine.
Now i'm trying to find the program to resize pupsafe file.
I think i need new glasses ( already -17 dpt ) .

I'appreciate a reply
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rcrsn51


Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 8555
Location: Stratford, Ontario

PostPosted: Tue 04 Dec 2012, 10:41    Post subject: Re: HowTo resize pupsafe file  

Horst wrote:
Now i'm trying to find the program to resize pupsafe file.

Menu > Control Panel > System > Fatdog64 Savefile Tool
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mini-jaguar

Joined: 13 Nov 2008
Posts: 457

PostPosted: Tue 04 Dec 2012, 13:01    Post subject:  

It works, but I would like to do this:
Put Fatdog64 in a folder, and have the .sfs and save files there too.

Now say I make a folder called "fatdog", put the vmlinuz and initrd files in there, I can easily add /fatdog/ to the lines in the grub text that load the above mentioned files and it works, I've already tried this and it works fine.

But the problem is that it won't load any save or .sfs files I put in the folder, as opposed to other Puppies where this works fine.

Is there any commands I can add to the grub to make it load the save and .sfs files placed in a folder and not the higher level of the directory?
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rcrsn51


Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 8555
Location: Stratford, Ontario

PostPosted: Tue 04 Dec 2012, 13:12    Post subject:  

mini-jaguar wrote:
Is there any commands I can add to the grub to make it load the save

Menu > Control Panel > Utilities > Savefile Argument Builder.

Also, read the FAQS about boot options.
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1365
Location: florida

PostPosted: Tue 04 Dec 2012, 13:23    Post subject:  

Quote:
Is there any commands I can add to the grub to make it load the save and .sfs files placed in a folder and not the higher level of the directory?


There is for the save file. See the Boot options page in the FAQs.

Example grub entry:

title Fatdog64-610 (on /dev/sda6)
rootnoverify (hd0,5)
kernel /610/vmlinuz savefile=direct:device:sda6:/610/fd64save.ext4
initrd /610/initrd


The savefile argument means to use a savefile named fd64save.ext4 located in /fd610 directory of /dev/sda6, save directly to it.

EDIT: Just saw rcrsn51's post. Ditto on the Menu > Control Panel > Utilities > Savefile Argument Builder.
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prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1255

PostPosted: Wed 05 Dec 2012, 17:26    Post subject:  

kirk wrote:
...Xorg determines which resolution to use based on the EDID data from the monitor, so if monitor doesn't report EDID data or reports it in correctly, Xorg has to guess about the resolution...
The monitor in question is a 21" perfectly-flat CRT manufactured by Sony and rebranded by SGI. It reports that it is a GDM-5411. Something in Fatdog 610 must recognize that it has 1600x1200 resolution because that is what leads to the microscopic fonts.

It does report EDID data, just not the version you are expecting. A look at the history of EDID indicates the current version will not have a long product life. Windows can recognize it after drivers for nVidia or ATI are loaded. Prior to that it defaults to generic.

Aside: I use the old CRT because of the good dynamic range of the phosphors. This one can be calibrated to a known gamma for retouching work on photographs. Getting this on modern LCD displays can be hard, expensive or impossible. You can also find these CRTs still in use among various graphic designers.

One incidental side benefit is that any thief who makes off with it can be caught when he ruptures himself.
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don570


Joined: 10 Mar 2010
Posts: 3075
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed 05 Dec 2012, 20:38    Post subject:  

I tested Fatdog64-521.iso with Right-click-6.0.2.pet
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=67013


My conclusion --->

It mostly works but needs mhwaveedit to be installed
and more icons need to be installed available.

____________________________________
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1365
Location: florida

PostPosted: Wed 05 Dec 2012, 23:08    Post subject:  

Quote:
Something in Fatdog 610 must recognize that it has 1600x1200 resolution because that is what leads to the microscopic fonts.


If that's the highest supported resolution, then that's what we want. If the fonts are too small, switching to a lower resolution is not a good solution. Open the Control Panel, click on the Desktop tab and click on Set global font size. Select a higher dpi for your fonts and restart X to see what it looks like.

Or Xorg can automatically calculate the font size, maybe we will do that. You just delete or rename /root/.Xresources and restart X and see if that looks good.
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prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1255

PostPosted: Wed 05 Dec 2012, 23:57    Post subject:  

@kirk,

I think there is a misunderstanding here. I was talking about font sizes outside of the X window system. I know about adjusting font sizes under X. (In that case, adjusting icons, etc. is also necessary. Reducing the resolution may be a sensible option in some cases, even if it isn't in the case you are thinking about.)

Even when the frame buffer does not get messed up, the text console fonts, which were previously readable, suddenly become microscopic during the boot sequence, making it hard to tell what is going on when there is a problem in getting to X and a desktop, or in the reboot/shutdown sequence, when there is a failure to save.

The general problem I'm getting at is one of robustness when things go wrong. This applies not just to software, which can't anticipate every problem, but to the system of software, hardware and people dealing with issues. If I wanted software which does everything for me when things go right, and leaves me helpless when something goes wrong, I might have stayed with M$.

Puppy has always impressed me with the ability to fall back to some lower level of operation where it is possible to isolate a problem well enough that knowledgeable people can fix it quickly.

For example, Barry's Simple Network Setup was not the first try at that function, or even the second. It would not have come into existence without considerable preceding history. Even today, when things go wrong, I check on how Dougal's network setup handles it. At least this narrows the range of places to check for faults. Sometimes it works when SNS fails. Those cases are becoming rarer, but both tools remain available in 5.4.2. I've known experienced network people to become very frustrated while trying to make Windows automatic network tools work.

Losing the ability to fall back to text console video setup strikes me as a mistake.
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