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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge
Precise Puppy RC2, October 20, 2012
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
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oldyeller


Joined: 15 Nov 2011
Posts: 802
Location: Mishawaka IN

PostPosted: Tue 16 Oct 2012, 21:40    Post subject:  

Hello Everyone

The Kennel is such a nice place to play, especially with all the new pups coming out like Precise, Slacko, Dpup and many more yet to come.

I like precise even though with the pae kernel I will not be able to use it very will on my machine. but that is ok will test even though things don't work so well.

I have tested puppies that I only use once and than that is it. Like to test new ones who others have done to help keep things going. I don't do a lot of different things with all the programs only use just a few so that is what I test for if what I use works. than let them now if it does or does not.

Your right on puppyluvr Cool Cool

Cheers
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rjbrewer


Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 4422
Location: merriam, kansas

PostPosted: Tue 16 Oct 2012, 22:53    Post subject:  

RC1 is running very well on my MSI netbook.

It's nice to finally have a woof build with an mplayer
that can play full screen.

It would run even better on the 1.6 Gb Pentium M
processor in my Inspiron 700M.
Unfortunately it won't run with this horrible BUG known as
a PAE kernel.
It's downright ridiculus that a machine that will easily run
Win7 or Mac SnowLeopard is off limits to a Puppy version
just so a few wealthy weirdos can use insane amounts of
ram.

The whole PAE notion is a total antithesis of the original
stated purpose of Puppy's creation.

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Msi Wind U100, N270 1.6>2.0Ghz, 1.5Gb ram.
Eeepc 8g 701, 900Mhz, 1Gb ram.
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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 5753
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Tue 16 Oct 2012, 23:32    Post subject:  

+1

My hardware goes up to 16 Gb of ram and I don't run a PAE kernel..
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rjbrewer


Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 4422
Location: merriam, kansas

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 00:30    Post subject:  

James C wrote:
+1

My hardware goes up to 16 Gb of ram and I don't run a PAE kernel..


I probably should have added a smiley to the "wealthy
weirdo" comment; I depend on the rich for survival Smile .

Aside from machines that can't boot PAE; no machine that
uses Intel 945 graphics can use the extra ram .

Win 8 is planning on using PAE, and many people are "up
in arms" about it.

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Inspiron 700m, Pent.M 1.6Ghz, 1Gb ram.
Msi Wind U100, N270 1.6>2.0Ghz, 1.5Gb ram.
Eeepc 8g 701, 900Mhz, 1Gb ram.
Full installs

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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 5138
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 00:48    Post subject:  

+2

PAE support is a good option to offer for computers that support it, but what are the computers Precise Puppy is designed for? Just those computers?
Quote:
The Linux kernel includes full PAE mode support starting with version 2.3.23,[12] enabling access of up to 64 GB of memory on 32-bit machines. A PAE-enabled Linux kernel requires that the CPU also support PAE.

I have never seen Puppy use 1GB of memory in normal operation.
Seems to be a feature that lets you see the total ram on a computer, but Puppy will never need to use it.

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shinobar


Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 2630
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 01:57    Post subject: libav-extra-0.8.3-up.pet  

The ffmpeg on the precise puppy has no capability to encode MPEG4-AVC(h264/aac).
I prepared libav-extra-0.8.3-up.pet to enhance extra encoding audio/video.
http://shino.pos.to/party/bridge.cgi?puppy/precise/

The pet contains the libraries from the next 11 ubuntu packages.

libavcodec-extra-53_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libavdevice-extra-53_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libavfilter-extra-2_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libavformat-extra-53_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libavutil-extra-51_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libdirac-encoder0_1.0.2-4build1_i386.deb
libopenjpeg2_1.3+dfsg-4_i386.deb
libpostproc-extra-52_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libswscale-extra-2_0.8.3ubuntu0.12.04.1_i386.deb
libvo-aacenc0_0.1.1-2_i386.deb
libvo-amrwbenc0_0.1.1-2_i386.deb

NOTE: Use 'libvo-aacenc' instead of 'libfaac' for the ffconvert MPEG4-AVC encoding.

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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2346
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 03:08    Post subject:  

I would like to test Precise RC1 but unfortunately, having just downloaded it, I have discovered that the PAE kernel does not run on my machine (a Fujitsu Siemens Amilo laptop with Pentium M processor)

I'll do my best to try it from a usb stick on my partners desktop when I can push my way onto that sometime.

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ozsouth

Joined: 01 Jan 2010
Posts: 139
Location: S.E Australia

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 03:40    Post subject: PAE & non-PAE  

Guys, this is based on Ubuntu, which now has a policy of only issuing PAE versions, due to most PCs being able to run it. I think Barry is simply following suit. There are lots of great non-PAE puppies still being developed. I use Luci-001.005 (non-PAE) from Playdayz on a laptop with 3gb ram - it's an update of 529 & it's great. Check it out.
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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2346
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 05:01    Post subject: Re: libav-extra-0.8.3-up.pet
Subject description: libxvid aspect ratio problem resurfaced
 

shinobar wrote:

I prepared libav-extra-0.8.3-up.pet to enhance extra encoding audio/video.

NOTE: Use 'libvo-aacenc' instead of 'libfaac' for the ffconvert MPEG4-AVC encoding.


Tried it on the immediately previous non-PAE Precise and libvo-aacenc worked OK on a quick test. However this libav/ffmpeg version seems to have brought back an old well-documented problem when using libxvid where you get the error message "Invalid pixel aspect ratio 0/1". EDIT: Though I have still to try it on the latest Precise RC1, which I shall do later.

The common workaround is to not use libxvid but instead: "-vcodec mpeg4 -vtag xvid", however that isn't apparently quite as good as libxvid without extra parameters also being added. The alternative seems to be to use libxvid but with the -aspect parameter in a -vf construct. For example:
Code:

-vf "scale=480:320,aspect=3:2


but that is a real pain because it needs to be recalculated for each resolution used. As things stand, however, I'll just use the "-vcodec mpeg4 -vtag xvid" simple alternative (which does work) even if it is slightly inferior to libxvid .

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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2346
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 07:01    Post subject: ogv video type  

I haven't had a chance to test the new Precise yet owing to PAE kernel not working on the computer I usually use.

Just wanting to note that the previous version doesn't recognise video container ogv, which is the recommended extension for Theora video with vorbis ogg audio. So I wish to request that be fixed if not already done so since it is one of the optional containers used in pAVrecord Video/webcam recorder for which I'm producing a version to work on Precise.

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Greatnessguru


Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 104
Location: rural McBain MI USA (near Cadillac MI)

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 08:23    Post subject: SeaMonkey 2.13.1: important SVG bug fixed  

Barry,
Please be sure to include SeaMonkey 2.13.1.

SeaMonkey 2.12.x has a nasty SVG bug:
Bug 790144 - SVG "stroke" hangs SeaMonkey 2.12.x and Firefox 15.0.x. Regression.
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=790144

That hang seems to happen with any SVG file
containing any kind of line that also has the
"stroke" thingy specified, which is needed
for the line to appear!

Therefor, I would classify SeaMonkey 2.13.1
as an "Essential bug fix".

Thank you very much,
Eddie Maddox
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Ray MK


Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 764
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 08:55    Post subject:  

Report Video 1.3 - Wed 17 Oct 2012 on Precise Puppy 5.3.96 - Linux 3.2.29 i686

Chip description:
2.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82852/855GM Integrated Graphics Device (rev 02)
oem: Intel(r)852MG/852MGE/855MG/855MGE Graphics Chip Accelerated VGA BIOS
product: Intel(r)852MG/852MGE/855MG/855MGE Graphics Controller Hardware Version 0.0

X Server: Xorg Driver used: intel
X.Org version: 1.11.3
dimensions: 1024x768 pixels (270x203 millimeters)
depth of root window: 24 planes

Generally all seems good - very nicely setup - (fonts etc)
FYI - sys-report.
sys-info-121017.gz
Description 
gz

 Download 
Filename  sys-info-121017.gz 
Filesize  12.03 KB 
Downloaded  486 Time(s) 
report-video-full.gz
Description 
gz

 Download 
Filename  report-video-full.gz 
Filesize  6.77 KB 
Downloaded  494 Time(s) 

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aragon

Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 1698
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 10:01    Post subject:  

The actual choice of the coulour-sheme might attract some, but in my opinion it's a little usability-nightmare.

As an example please try to find the marked text in the attached pic. For my eyesight it's nearly impossible.

aragon
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2012-10-17_154751.png


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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 781
Location: Union New Jersey USA

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 10:03    Post subject: Revised Report & Just Following Suit  

Hi Guys:

My initial report, http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=658725#658725 indicated the absence of problems even though my computer has Ati Radeon 3100 Graphics. In the main, this is still correct. However, I noticed that sometimes the colors used in dialogues made them difficult to read. See attached. So I decided to experiment to find out if any of the amd_fglrx drivers might work, even though they weren't built for this kernel. [In Exprimo, the driver built under the 3.4.2 kernel actually worked with the 3.6.2 kernel]. Neither amd_fglrx-12.8-precise-k3.2.28 nor k3.2.29 worked. Both rendered the OS sort of unstable: to activate the driver, you have to exit X and type aticonfig --initial; exiting X hung the system. Closest was the aforementioned fglrx driver from Exprimo. It just sometimes reduced graphics to a crawl.

@ ozsouth: There are obvious advantages to having a Puppy which is able to utilize Ubuntu application binaries. But Puppy isn't Ubuntu. We are not trying to compete with Windows7 by providing an alternative fancy and equally bloated system. Puppy's advantage, whether employed on modern, state-of-the-art, or older, resource-limited computers is its low-ram & CPU usage and the ease with which applications can be initiated. With the possible exception of hardware drivers, there are no applications which if built under PAE-enabled kernels won't run on non-PAE enabled kernels. The only advantage a PAE-enabled kernel has over a non-PAE enabled kernel-with-smp is that the former can make use of more than 4GB of RAM. That advantage is of little significance in an OS designed to function with as little as 128 to 256 Megs of RAM, and fly with 1Gb of RAM. As far as I know, there are no computers which can manage more than 4Gbs of RAM which aren't also able to handle 64-bit operating systems. Comparison tests between software run under PAE-enabled and non-PAE-but-smp-enabled computers reveal at best an imperceptible (mili-second) advantage to the former in some cases, and even a disadvantage in others, while 64-bit systems have a clear advantage. So while it makes sense to build 64-bit systems, and 32-bit-smp-enabled systems, it is unlikely that there are a significant number of computers users which actually would benefit from a PAE-enabled system. And certainly not using a Puppy.
T2 builds such as Quirky/Racy or even Carolina are not substitutes for a Ubuntu-binary-compatible Puppy. As building a non-PAE Ubuntu compatible Puppy is possible --it's already been done a couple of times with the 3 Series Kernels-- and as Barry K is an innovator rather than a follower, as I said before I hope he reconsiders concentrating his efforts on a PAE-enabled kernel.

mikesLr
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666philb


Joined: 07 Feb 2010
Posts: 1693
Location: wales

PostPosted: Wed 17 Oct 2012, 12:10    Post subject:  

hi mikeslr,

i believe your radeon 3100 card requires a different driver , amd now have two drivers, and the one i compilied and is in the repo, is the wrong driver for you. i didn't realise there where 2 drivers for amd or i would have mentioned it on my post. http://support.amd.com/us/gpudownload/linux/legacy/Pages/legacy-radeon_linux.aspx

the driver is easy enough to compile it yourself, a .pet would be nice though Smile

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