Pussy: potentially a Puppy with a perfect package manager

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sickgut
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#1641 Post by sickgut »

Today i got the idea to scan through Ubuntu Studio's package selection, not because i want to create anything remotely similar but while i am sorting out the audio and video stuff i thought doing this would give me a few ideas and also introduce me to packages that i have no seen/ used/ heard of.

im cross referencing the package names with what is available in the debian repos and i think i have found 5 or 6 that would be good to include in Pussy. While i have been using Linux for quite a few years, i have generally stuck to a limited selection of packages for my own general use and so i am not really savvy to exactly what is out there and ready to use on Linux.

While i have experience with the audio side of things, i have none at all with video/ graphics sort of apps and if any video/ graphics experts would like to PM me or post here the names of the programs they use then i would greatly appreciate it.

nooby
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#1642 Post by nooby »

Here is a suggestion. Sadly it requires Java something
so that is a security risk? The 3D CGI program Make Human.

http://www.makehuman.org/

They have a Debian download. Would be cool if you tested
if that works with your PussyLinux. http://www.makehuman.org/release

Just a friendly suggestion. The reason I have not been able to test
is that I don't understand the Java install. Computer challenged among other faults
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though


camfix
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#1644 Post by camfix »

Hi guys;
After a brief unpleasant hospital visit I'm back.
I downloaded the Cinelerra pet.I am missing several "dependencies". Where do I find em ? How do I install em ?
Thanks Ev

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#1645 Post by sickgut »

camfix wrote:Hi guys;
After a brief unpleasant hospital visit I'm back.
I downloaded the Cinelerra pet.I am missing several "dependencies". Where do I find em ? How do I install em ?
Thanks Ev
Pussy doesnt use pets
the whole point of pussy was to make a puppy like OS that retains the debian method of software install.

syntax for installing software is to open a terminal and then type:

apt-get install programname

however you will need to run apt-get update first to refresh the program listing so the apt utility knows what progs are available.

you can browser the software you can install using this method by visiting:

http://packages.debian.org/stable/

For instance if you find an application in that list named: super-ant-raider
then to install that app you type: apt-get install super-ant-raider

This method automatically downloads and installs all dependencies etc.

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#1646 Post by sickgut »


Thanks buddy, seriously i mean that.... im finding new applications all the time... htere are so many free(ish) linux programs out there that i doubt i will ever get to test them all. This Pussy DVD is going to be absolutely epic.

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#1647 Post by sickgut »

nooby wrote:Here is a suggestion. Sadly it requires Java something
so that is a security risk? The 3D CGI program Make Human.

http://www.makehuman.org/

They have a Debian download. Would be cool if you tested
if that works with your PussyLinux. http://www.makehuman.org/release

Just a friendly suggestion. The reason I have not been able to test
is that I don't understand the Java install. Computer challenged among other faults
I dont worry about security risks, coming from a hacking background myself i know all to well that if some wants to breach security then they will do it no matter what measures you take, other than unplugging this system from the network.

I will check out that url. Thanks for your input.

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#1648 Post by sickgut »

This is doubling up a little but this is an update of the apps i have added to Pussy. THey are all the stock programs from the debian squeeze repos... anything that isnt in the debian squeeze repos will be added later and be installed statically in a directory that contains all the static apps.
Hopefully this list will grow to 5 or 6 times larger.

Packages added so far are:
xsane - scanner software for X
mozilla-plugin-vlc - play media embedded in websites like .wav or .mp3
rosegarden - music composition and MIDI workstation
audacity - digital audio workstation/ wave editor
mypaint - paint program
jack - MIDI connection kit
jack-tools - tool for jack
qjackctl - utility to manage jack
bitscope - monitor jack
patchage - patch bay for jack
beep - type beep at the console and the pc speaker will beep
bb - demo of libaa ascii graphical library set to music
xsidplay + libsidplay2 + sidplay-base - X and console C64 music player
dcraw and fraw - read raw image data from files or cameras
cups-driver-gutenprint (included cups) - more printing functionality
escputil - epson printer maintenance utils
photon - a static HTML gallery generator
blender - no idea, some people have requested it before 3D modeling??
wimgs3d - same kinda thing as blender i think
ardour - digital audio workstation
vkeybd - Virtual Keyboard program (MIDI keyboard)
hydrogen + hydrogen-extra-drumkits - MIDI drum sequencer
timemachine - JACK audio recorder for spontaneous and conservatory use
bristol + bristol-data + monobristol - retro soft synth(s) monobristol is the GUI
fluidsynth + qsynth - softsynth, qsynth is the front end
aconnectgui - alsa/ jack connection kit
seq24 - MIDI sequencer
sooperlooper - looping sampler
jack-rack - effects "rack" for jack
fluid-soundfont-gm - 149MB of soundfonts

gimp plugins:
gimp-data-extras- An extra set of brushes, palettes, and gradients
gimp-dds - DirectDraw Surface) plugin for the gimp
gimp-resynthesizer: Gimp plugin for texture synthesis
gtkam-gimp -gimp plugin to open digital camera pictures
gimp-gutenprint - print plugin for the GIMP
gimp-gmic - GIMP plugin for GREYC's Magic Image Converter
gimp2.0-quiteinsane: A Qt based SANE plugin for GIMP 2.0
gimp-plugin-registry - repository of optional extensions for The GIMP
gimp-gap - gimp animation package
gimp-ufraw - gimp imported for raw camera images
abr2gbr - Converts PhotoShop brushes to GIMP
gimp-dcraw - GIMP plug-in for loading RAW digital photos

video editing:
kdenlive kino openmovieeditor stopmotion dvgrab

Packages that will be added statically or with some other trickery
due to not being available for debian squeeze:

freebirth shaketracker jackbeat qb64 (quick basic 64)

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#1649 Post by sickgut »

Due to the fact that Pussy has wine installed and working, i welcome everyone to suggest free Windows apps that work on wine. Do you have a cousin or uncle or sibling that develops Windows games or other interesting Windows progs that work on wine? then let me know, i will be more than happy to include the program in Pussy

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#1650 Post by cthisbear »


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#1651 Post by sickgut »

cthisbear wrote:"free Windows apps"

Teamviewer???

http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx


Linux

http://www.teamviewer.com/en/download/linux.aspx


""""""

Portable apps

http://portableapps.com/apps

Chris.
Thanks for the url to the portable apps especially. Obviously i will install native Linux versions of software if possible first, but if there is no linux version then i have no problem including progs that run on wine, after all its a nice test to see if your wine is working and also good to showcase just how well linux can run some windows apps.

Expanding on this subject i am considering including a windows version of one of the popular web browsers for the express purpose of messing with websites that track the kind of OS you are using, the browser and the screen resolution etc. I spose some people would appreciate that, most wouldnt.

I will also try to isolate some of the more interesting network tools from the Backtrack OS that could lend themselves to be shoehorned into Pussy. I dont know the specific licensing of those apps, and also there is a difference between installing them on Pussy and configuring them correctly.

This brings me to another point, i was wanting to do the DVD version of Pussy in one release and be done with it, however due to the sheer enormity (ie, the number of packages being added) of the project, it looks as tho there will be 2 releases. One will be an early release that simply includes all the new apps, and the final release will make sure that all these new apps are working correctly and configured correctly and with default settings made to default itself to settings that will be practical for the type of desktop environment etc that is being used.

The USB .img image wont be made available for the first release but it will be made available for the final release. Depending on the final size of the end product, the USB .img version may end up being an image for 8GB USB sticks/ SD cards and not for the smaller 4GB ones. This is because the DVD size im hoping to work to is 4.3GB or something... whatever it is that fills a DVD-R. 4GB USB sticks are smaller than a DVD and the working space of most of them is more like 3.8GB rather than 4GB. The 8GB USB stick image will have persistence enabled and a function in the catroll-panel that deletes the save file and creates a new one so that the USB stick can be restored to default settings.

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#1652 Post by sickgut »

instead of spamming the thread with endless package list updates to keep yall informed about what im adding to Pussy to make the new DVD version, i am keeping an up to date manually maintained "log" of what is already added on the website.

http://www.thepussycatforest.info/linux ... s-list.txt

if that is too much to remember then just goto the website:

http://www.thepussycatforest.info

click "pussy linux" then you can find the pussy dvd packages text file among all the other pussy related files

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#1653 Post by sickgut »

After adding maybe one third to a half of all the extra apps, RAM usage has jumped from 116mb to 154mb on boot (256mb virtual box session with 600mb swap partition)

there are a few things like gnome-bluetooth that start during the boot process and hog resources even if the user isnt using any bluetooth devices or accesses the program. By removing just this one package, i saved nearly 9mb of RAM usage.

I would like to add as much functionality as possible but not at the expense of efficiency. Most background running apps like this used to have an option you could set where they would either load and stay ready during boot, or would spawn on demand... with spawning on demand slower but doesnt hog resources when not in use....

Also i do not have any mobile phone or bluetooth capable device, nor have i used one. So i need to ask a question:

Does the current Pussy Xtra support bluetooth already?

If anyone has the ability to test this then i would be extremely grateful to find out how Pussy handles this. If it doesnt support bluetooth then i will need to add some kind of bluetooth functionality to this new Pussy DVD version i am working on, and i would appreciate any advice as to what bluetooth apps are preferred by Pussy/ debian/ ubuntu/ Puppy users (whatever works best an be shoehorned onto Pussy).

I have no idea how bluetooth works, and i cant test this myself, i havent installed anything specifically in Pussy to support bluetooth but no one seems to have complained about it either, so please forgive my newbie question :)

Other things i am going to possible need help with are CUPS (printing) and SAMBA (Linux to other OS networking). Saintless has CUPS configured correctly in his remastered iso and jbv released a squashfs with a correctly configured SAMBA... i may have to borrow from them if they dont mind :)

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#1654 Post by sickgut »

Having rediscovered the /etc/init.d/ directory, i will be adding a catroll-panel option to start and or stop any of the services listed in that dir that is practical.

For instance, timidity is running all the time in Pussy, however you can stop it by typing: /etc/init.d/timidity stop
and you can start it again by: /etc/init.d/timidity start

Suddenly what seemed so hard an hour ago is now so easy, using the above method is how i will manage what is loaded in and running and what is not, and also give the user the power to change this and the new catroll-panel section that deals with all this will be based around these very simple commands.

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#1655 Post by sickgut »

Added every kind of available firmware package from debian squeeze repos and RAM usage actually went down rather than up.

rokytnji
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zram

#1656 Post by rokytnji »

sickgut wrote:Added every kind of available firmware package from debian squeeze repos and RAM usage actually went down rather than up.
Just for info. Giving you some info on using zram in debian. I don't know though if you are interested in including/incorporating this in Pussy Linux. Some AntiX members I knowconfigure this on their low ram pc's. I was the instigator though for this. If too much trouble for Pussy Linux. Just ignore my post.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZRam

http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/20 ... 00210.html

http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/post/150355/#p150355

Glad to see you are getting well. Getting old aint for sissies. :) I aint no sissy either. :wink:

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Re: zram

#1657 Post by sickgut »

rokytnji wrote:
sickgut wrote:Added every kind of available firmware package from debian squeeze repos and RAM usage actually went down rather than up.
Just for info. Giving you some info on using zram in debian. I don't know though if you are interested in including/incorporating this in Pussy Linux. Some AntiX members I knowconfigure this on their low ram pc's. I was the instigator though for this. If too much trouble for Pussy Linux. Just ignore my post.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZRam

http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/20 ... 00210.html

http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/post/150355/#p150355

Glad to see you are getting well. Getting old aint for sissies. :) I aint no sissy either. :wink:
this is copied and pasted from wikipedia:

"zRam is an available feature for certain distributions of Linux, that was previously called "compcache". It increases performance by avoiding paging on disk and instead uses a compressed block device in RAM in which paging takes place until it is necessary to use the swap space on the hard disk drive. Since using RAM is faster than using disks, zRam allows Linux to make more use of RAM when swapping/paging is required, especially on older computers with less RAM installed."

Thankyou for telling me about zRam, i will definitely include this with Pussy. This will be freaking sweet if i can get it to work right.

Thanks again

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Re: zram

#1658 Post by sickgut »

sickgut wrote:
rokytnji wrote:
sickgut wrote:Added every kind of available firmware package from debian squeeze repos and RAM usage actually went down rather than up.
Just for info. Giving you some info on using zram in debian. I don't know though if you are interested in including/incorporating this in Pussy Linux. Some AntiX members I knowconfigure this on their low ram pc's. I was the instigator though for this. If too much trouble for Pussy Linux. Just ignore my post.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZRam

http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/20 ... 00210.html

http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/post/150355/#p150355

Glad to see you are getting well. Getting old aint for sissies. :) I aint no sissy either. :wink:
this is copied and pasted from wikipedia:

"zRam is an available feature for certain distributions of Linux, that was previously called "compcache". It increases performance by avoiding paging on disk and instead uses a compressed block device in RAM in which paging takes place until it is necessary to use the swap space on the hard disk drive. Since using RAM is faster than using disks, zRam allows Linux to make more use of RAM when swapping/paging is required, especially on older computers with less RAM installed."

Thankyou for telling me about zRam, i will definitely include this with Pussy. This will be freaking sweet if i can get it to work right.

Thanks again
there isnt adebian-squeeze package for this, ill attempt to shoehorn a wheezy package of it onto Pussy after i have everything else sorted and tested ill make a backup and try a wheezy package

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#1659 Post by sickgut »

Im starting to scape the bottom of the barrel with the apps, i dont want to just include any old thing or over duplicated/ triplicated functionality that will confuse the user.

Im doing the app adding in stages, first the debian-squeeze ones from the debian repos using apt-get and then everything else (static packages from vendors and or other Linux OSes or versions of debian other than squeeze).

I have kept an up to date log of all the apps i have added to Pussy DVD on the website:

http://www.thepussycatforest.info/linux ... e-list.txt

if anyone has the time to take a look and then suggest anything that i may have overlooked, then let me know.

You can browse the packages available for debian squeeze at http://packages.debian.org

Pussy is based on debian squeeze and i want to make sure i have included all the best apps from the squeeze repository

[Edit: with all the packages added, i did a test run of slimming and then squashfs-ing everything and only 1.6GB has been added to the size of the ISO. That was nearly 3GB unsquashfs and slimmed. So far we are only using half the space of a DVD iso :) ]

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#1660 Post by sickgut »

re: cleanmode browsing.

My real vision for Pussy DVD is that people will use it as a Live DVD to showcase the power and compatibility of a modern Linux without risk for wiping or changing the data on the HDD.

This however kind of defeats the purpose of cleanmode browsing. I am asking everyone here what you would like to see in this new version. Cleanmode browsing makes sense if you have a save file and or have installed Pussy onto a HDD or you are using a USB version.

However pure Live DVD cleanmode is just an overhead as cleanmode unzips the browser into the ram when there is no save file. This doubles the ram usage of the browser until the browser is exited and then its deleted from the ram, leaving no trace. No problem for new computers, but it is on low ram systems.

I would also like to know if Pussy users would like to have cleanmode browsing enabled on all the installed browsers, or just one. If its just one, then seamonkey will be used for clean mode and other browsers like firefox/ chrome/ opera/ midori will be installed conventionally.

Im asking this because some people dont get the clean mode idea and it has complicated their usage of an internet browser.

At them moment im leaning towards keeping the usual cleanmode seamonkey intact (but with a version upgrade to the latest) and install other browsers normally.

Keep in mind that using Pussy as Live with no save file pretty much gives you all the benefits of cleanmode browsing anyway.

I do see one good argument for keeping one cleanmode browser and the rest installed normally. If you use a save file then there will most likely be sites you visit that you want all your passwords remembered. You would use a normally installed browser for this, then if you want to do something sensitive on the internet like banking (and there are more than one person likely to use the computer) then you would want to use cleanmode, but it would be a shame to loose all the remembered passwords for all of the sites that arent of a sensitive nature.

With all the browsers setup for cleanmode, they all use the same internet temp files hidden in your root folder, and using the clean option once will still wipe everything from all the browsers and that could be a pain.

So this is why im suggesting keeping one as having the cleanmode function and the rest without it. All the temp cache for one cleanmode browser could be saved to a different dir and so the info from other browsers is safe even when you use cleanmode one the one browser that is setup for it.

please have your say....

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