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otropogo


Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 702
Location: Southern Rocky Mt. Trench

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012, 16:43    Post subject: Knoppix 7.0.2_en LiveDVD rules!  

I've often criticized Knoppix lately for it's annoying flaws, slowness to fix them, and interminable delays between the annual CEbit disk release in German and the final download. But this year it's time for kudos to Klaus Knopper.

Admittedly, the release of the downloadable English version was delayed by many weeks. But it was worth the wait. Not only that, but there followed very quickly a minor revision from v.7.0.1 to 7.0.2. Both booted for me, but I quickly switched to the latest, and haven't had any cause to go back.

This is without a doubt the smoothest, fastest, most impressive LiveDVD ever!

Following my long-held rule of booting only from removable media, after burning and booting the DVD, I immediately installed it to an 8GB USB thumb drive using the installation module in the 'Knoppix' directory.

The DVD boots not too shabbily on my two faster systems, about 4 minutes to the LXDE desktop, IIRC. But the USB installation is a speed demon, booting to the desktop in under 40 seconds on my two fastest PCs (three and seven years old, respectively).

You need a minimum of 8GB of flash because the files included take up 3.9GB, and you'll need some extra GBs for installing further apps to the persistent image file. I LiveCD version wasn't yet available when I did this a week or so ago, but it's planned.

Knoppix 7 LiveDVD is reported to contain 9GB of apps in compressed form. However, my limited experimentation suggests that many of these, especially the more complicated database programs (such as Grass GIS) are there in barebones structure only, and require significant downloads and assignment of storage space before they'll actually run. This may severly limit users of an 8GB thumbdrive. But hopefully, prices of the slower no-class no speed shown flash media will continue to plummet, so we can all get a pocketful of 32GB drives.


The most astonishingly pleasant surprise was finding that I could use the thumbdrive installation created on my Toshiba laptop to boot three! different desktop machines, using different monitors interchangeably.

Only one of the three PCs requires some tweaking of the display resolution, which comes up spread over two monitors.This is a problem encountered with previous Knoppix version, and may be caused by the DualHead2Go dual monitor adapter and/or the Radeon X1550 display adapter.

But a complete desktop image can be assured at boot up by entering a known working resolution (eg. knoppix screen=1600x1200x24), or experimenting. Once the toolbar and start menu are on screen, adjusting the display resolution requires only opening the preferences/monitor settings window in LXDE and reconfiguring.

The utility doesn't seem to have a test mode, so you may end up with a black screen, if a wrong choice is made. But with a one minute reset-reboot time, this isn't a big issue for the two or three failed attempts you might have before finding the right setting.

Adding new apps was easiest for me with the Software Centre. In it I easily searched for, found, and installed UFRaw, Rawstudio, and KlamAV (I miss Fprot though, finding KlamAV a bit complicated to use). Rawstudio and UFRaw work great.


NB: the firewall isn't active by default, so it's probably a good idea to set it up and save it after the persistent image file is created.

Oh, and if you have a 64-bit PC and more than 3GB of RAM, you can access all of that RAM by booting Knoppix 7 with the argument 'knoppix64', which loads the 64 bit Linux 3.3.7(?) kernel.

But because of size considerations (ie. the limits of a DVD disk) K7 doesn't include support for 64-bit applications, for that capability you'd have to install the necessary libraries, etc., and possibly get a bigger thumbdrive.

BTW if you find the choice of wallpapers (called 'background' in Knoppix7) unappetizing, I suggest you bring your own. I've got the Puppy 4.0 wallpaper installed. The screensaver selection, OTOH, is quite stunning, and you can leave it at the default 'random' setting and enjoy the changes.

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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012, 19:54    Post subject:  

I'm waiting for the Knoppix 7.0.2 CD version.
DVD is too big for me Smile

I wonder about Phyton 2.6 One 3D CGI program I tried on Ubuntu
need Phyton 2.6 but maybe Knoppix need to download such too
and don't have it on default?

Can Puppy use Phyton 2.6 ? Maybe one need a Dev version?

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otropogo


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012, 21:32    Post subject:  

nooby wrote:
I'm waiting for the Knoppix 7.0.2 CD version.
DVD is too big for me Smile

I wonder about Phyton 2.6 One 3D CGI program I tried on Ubuntu
need Phyton 2.6 but maybe Knoppix need to download such too
and don't have it on default?


Can Puppy use Phyton 2.6 ? Maybe one need a Dev version?


The 7.0.2 DVD packages list shows the DVD containing both Python 2.6 and 2.7., and since the 6.7 LiveCD packages list shows Python 2.6, I imagine the CD version of 7.0.2 will have either 2.7 or 2.6, or both.

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Enrique Corbellini


Joined: 20 May 2009
Posts: 93

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012, 23:10    Post subject:  trying to understand what happens  

is it we are assuming strong PCs and big programs were really needed? does this mean that Puppy was certainly only for old PCs?
IBM and other industries can always make big computers for big companies, without having to involve the single user who only wants to surf the web and a few more little things, I believe.
Where I live, if a person wants to have a new computer to surf the web and save personal storage, can’t buy a PC with less than 2 Gb of RAM and 100 Gb’s hard disc. Does this make sense?
I sincerely admire your dedication to develop and test new software for big machines, but I wouldn’t like to find you 2 years after wondering “why did I leave part of my life in running a competition in which I have no part?”
I live in a poor country, a third world one, poor enough so we can’t develop really needed new hardware here. Today’s afternoon I used a neighbor’s PC with the help assistance of an eco-partner, I mean, we went installing Puppy in a PC because of its ecological characteristic (hardware economizing).
There we saw how our neighbor’ sons still need a strong PC, but only because their pretention of using big video-games on it.
But how is it we use this too big computers in ecological communities, when we don’t need resources wasting? it happens the same thing with water, soil, food, and everything else, do I explain myself clearly?
When someone of our eco-partners chooses a computer for his (or her) real needs, he must use an old PC, getting the risk of breaking it in few months... why is this neccesary?
Why can’t we buy new computers with few resources inside them??

It doesn’t happen the same if we think about the usage of energy. This partners use solar panels to fill their needs of electricity, no one sells them “old cables or golden big new ones instead”.
There’s an England group that developes “handmade cars and other vehicles using wood and other natural elements”. And who of us never heard about motors that work with air or electricity instead of oil?

So, we don’t know what’s going to happen with computers, but if you hear something about a group trying to develop their own PC processors, please let us know. This group, if trying to exist, will probably find easy ways to reach its objective, since if solar energy enemies (oil companies, big enemies indeed) couldn’t stop the ecologists, amd and intel won’t stop eco-processors' developers, due to the same reason, whichever it is.

We are thankfull to you, all of the puppy users, because of your being with us all of these years, and now we’d like to make happen the second step: become even better PC users than we were in the past.
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otropogo


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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012, 02:38    Post subject: Re: trying to understand what happens  

Enrique Corbellini wrote:
is it we are assuming strong PCs and big programs were really needed? does this mean that Puppy was certainly only for old PCs?
IBM and other industries can always make big computers for big companies, without having to involve the single user who only wants to surf the web and a few more little things, I believe.
Where I live, if a person wants to have a new computer to surf the web and save personal storage, can’t buy a PC with less than 2 Gb of RAM and 100 Gb’s hard disc. Does this make sense?
I sincerely admire your dedication to develop and test new software for big machines, but I wouldn’t like to find you 2 years after wondering “why did I leave part of my life in running a competition in which I have no part?”....


It has very little to do with old PCs anymore, or with 'big' PCs. I have three PCs running right now. The youngest is about three years old, with 4GBs of RAM, the oldest is about 8 years old, with 2 GB of RAM. I have two more that I also use, that are ten and 12 years old. One has 1GB and the other 500MB of RAM.

Sure, surfing the web doesn't require that much RAM or 100GB+ hard drives.

And if you want to do something like digitizing printed material, which could be very useful in a poor country, as making and distributing paper copies is very expensive, then you want a fast processor with lots of RAM.

Puppy is fine for cruising the WEB and engaging in forums. But if you need to amass and manipulate large amounts of data, such as mapping information, or medical records, which poor countries surely need as much as rich ones, you're going to need lots of computing power.

What you don't seem to understand is that these bigger PCs with more RAM are cheaper than the old ones from five, ten, and fifteen years ago. The cost of the hardware is getting less and less significant, compared to the cost of marketing and tech support. Old RAM for a five year old PC costs much more than new RAM that's far faster. New Terabyte drives cost less than hard drive a fraction of their size a few years ago.

Old computers are worth less than nothing now. They end up in bins and are shipped to third world countries to be recycled, even though they work perfectly. They're not worth the cost of inspecting, testing, and distributing to people who would want them.

So you should be glad that the world is showered with new big computers with lots of RAM and terabytes of storage. And don't worry, once the Chinese have saturated their own market (I was there last year, and was shocked to run into recent university graduates there who don't own a PC, have no access to one, and can't afford the cost of using an Internet cafe to keep in touch by e-mail) they'll be flooding the rest of the world with cheap PCs too.

There was a project recently to supply a very basic laptop to schoolchildren for $100. So far as I can tell, it wasn't much of a success.

If there's one way access to computers might be made easier, it would be by standardizing parts to be modular, especially for laptops. But I don't see that happening. Countries like India or China, with their huge populations, could launch such a project and simply push it through. But the end result might well be to cripple the development of their commercial computer industries.

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012, 07:41    Post subject:  

http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/interviews-28/interview-with-patrick-volkerding-of-slackware-949029/

Good interview with Slacware creator

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Enrique Corbellini


Joined: 20 May 2009
Posts: 93

PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012, 10:09    Post subject: Re: trying to understand what happens  

otropogo wrote:

And don't worry, once the Chinese have saturated their own market (I was there last year, and was shocked to run into recent university graduates there who don't own a PC, have no access to one, and can't afford the cost of using an Internet cafe to keep in touch by e-mail) they'll be flooding the rest of the world with cheap PCs too.

Last month I visited an ecological community of my country (Uruguay, South America).
It’s in a beautiful small town called Aiguá. Much more beautiful than the capital city Montevideo. This community is one of the few ecological communities that exist in my country.
They don’t use PCs.... that simple. They practice other sort of communication. They use solar energy for everyday life, and motors to work, building ecological houses.
This way of living sounds like a paradise to me, but when trying to go living with them, a problem appears: they don’t have a project to work on, they are only optimist people who believe in future, but they don’t write what they are going to do the next 2 years from now on.
The rest of these ecological communities do more or less the same thing. You have to believe in ecology as if it was some sort of religion, instead of science.
So, as I’m not a religion practicer, I had to momentarily pospone my moving to that place, and look for a more scientific ecological practicing without leaving the city. Not so bad.... I found other interesting possibility. Global ecological promoters as a U.N. office and the New Zealand government (yes, that far from here country), offer us some money (little for them -1st world-, lots for us -3rd world-) to start ecological projects based on science. I found two places in the capital city to start projects like these, but none in Aigua or other inner land yet. I don’t get sad because of that, since I believe some time is needed to make things happen.
But we plenty use PCs inside these scientific projects. And even more than that... we wonder how a computer’s worker should live if becoming an ecological practicer. We know this hypothetical person must be eating healthy food and enjoying trees and nature, but we don’t know what else should be doing yet.
I’m starting to speak with organizations like ceuta.org.uy (technological appliers to ecology) about these things. We accepted the U.N. proposal of developing a project, and we are still studying the one proposed by New Zealand.
Whatever are the computers going to be finally accepted to work inside these projects, they are going to be ecological hardware and software, don’t you thing so?
Would you like to get involved inside this? don’t you think it’s nice?
I think we could even speak to chinese students about these things. We can speak to 2nd world's anywhere students about projects like these, offering everyone a way to participate inside them.
We are permanently learning examples of communities around all of the world, and want to give our part in this searching for a new life.
Thanks for answering.
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otropogo


Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 702
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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012, 14:47    Post subject: Re: trying to understand what happens  

Enrique Corbellini wrote:
...
Last month I visited an ecological community of my country (Uruguay, South America).
...
Global ecological promoters as a U.N. office and the New Zealand government (yes, that far from here country), offer us some money (little for them -1st world-, lots for us -3rd world-) to start ecological projects based on science.

...
Oh, come on! When did Uruguay become a "3rd world" country? That's ridiculous. I can guarantee you that I would sooner eat in a restaurant in Uruguay than one in (mainland) China.

...
Quote:
... we wonder how a computer’s worker should live if becoming an ecological practicer. We know this hypothetical person must be eating healthy food and enjoying trees and nature, but we don’t know what else should be doing yet.


Sounds more like religion than science to me. Surely you have to determine what foods ARE healthy and how to safely enjoy trees and nature before making it a moral imperative...

And you certainly can't do it by leafing through old hardcopy that happens to come into range.

Quote:
I’m starting to speak with organizations like ceuta.org.uy (technological appliers to ecology) about these things. We accepted the U.N. proposal of developing a project, and we are still studying the one proposed by New Zealand.
Whatever are the computers going to be finally accepted to work inside these projects, they are going to be ecological hardware and software, don’t you thing so?


It sounds logical, until you consider what on earth "ecological hardware and software" could possibly mean. For hardware, it's not so hard - perhaps it should be biodegradable, or better yet, edible and good for your health? For software, it's much harder to imagine. First, how can software be unecological? I'm stumped.

Maybe one should start by putting the "eco" aside and concentrate on being "logical" first.

Quote:
Would you like to get involved inside this? don’t you think it’s nice?
I think we could even speak to chinese students about these things. We can speak to 2nd world's anywhere students about projects like these, offering everyone a way to participate inside them.


Sure, but what is your organization's website? You mention receiving a UN grant, but not the name or nature of the project supported, ditto for the New Zealand proposal. So how can anyone reading this "participate"?

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Enrique Corbellini


Joined: 20 May 2009
Posts: 93

PostPosted: Tue 12 Jun 2012, 12:38    Post subject: Re: trying to understand what happens  

otropogo wrote:
Oh, come on! When did Uruguay become a "3rd world" country? That's ridiculous. I can guarantee you that I would sooner eat in a restaurant in Uruguay than one in (mainland) China.

The words “1st, 2nd and 3rd world” refer to terminology created during the cold war. That war finished when the Berlin’s wall falling, but those words remain used due to they give some clarity when trying to understand global characteristics of the world.
In Uruguay we certainly eat better than in China, but their political behavior remains more similar to Cuba and North Corea while uruguayan’s one is more similar to U.S.’s. But certainly we aren’t part of the first world.... so small and weak for that.
I don’t know why New Zealand considers us a poor country... may be we should ask them that. But at least it’s true we aren’t rich people.
...
Quote:
Sounds more like religion than science to me. Surely you have to determine what foods ARE healthy and how to safely enjoy trees and nature before making it a moral imperative...

I’m glad to hear this. You are invited to our large conversations and reflections about what’s good food and what’s health.
For example we had big discussions about if the world’s organization called Kokopelli really gives a way to get good food or not. Would you like to give your opinion?

Quote:
It sounds logical, until you consider what on earth "ecological hardware and software" could possibly mean. For hardware, it's not so hard - perhaps it should be biodegradable, or better yet, edible and good for your health? For software, it's much harder to imagine. First, how can software be unecological? I'm stumped.

To say the truth, a group announced a biodegradable processor some years ago. But here in this forum we already had some words about this topic, http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=76576
And I think it’s not difficult to find unecological software. What do you think about Windows? Due to its big size gets difficult to learn its usage and installing, and worst if you want to reinstall it. And because of Microsoft’s permanent fear of being attacked, they put the user under many passwords, asking him to buy them everything to “get protected”.
Consumism is opposite to ecology, and that’s why puppy makes a good ecological work.

Quote:
Maybe one should start by putting the "eco" aside and concentrate on being "logical" first.

Hope you are not angry! you give interesting opinions Very Happy

Quote:
Sure, but what is your organization's website? You mention receiving a UN grant, but not the name or nature of the project supported, ditto for the New Zealand proposal. So how can anyone reading this "participate"?

We don't put everything we do on the internet, but there's probably enough information for that.
In our case, we had to present our project to an office created between the U.N. and the uruguayan government, called PPD - www.ppduruguay.undp.org.uy/
I have no notice if N.Zealand published information about its projects, but I can send you a copy of the one we have if you are really interested about it.
At the same time you do me your question, a friend in Nicaragua also asked me to help her find a project financer in her country.
My group doesn’t have a web site (didn’t need it yet, it’s nothing against the net), but we can ask for help to our local authorities if more people appears asking to work with projects in other parts of the world.
I was thinking to contact the PPD office to ask them what they know about what the U.N. can offer to my nicaraguan’s friend. Or perhaps looking on the net? right now I’m discovering the PPD exists in Nicaragua too - http://ppd.org.ni/
I don’t know which country you live in, but probably there’s some authority you can ask to do something similar and have a conversation with us afterwards. Idea
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Aitch


Joined: 04 Apr 2007
Posts: 6825
Location: Chatham, Kent, UK

PostPosted: Thu 14 Jun 2012, 06:54    Post subject:  

Enrique

Health

http://www.naturalhub.com/opinion_right_food_for_the_human_animal.htm

http://www.natural-health-information-centre.com/codex-alimentarius.html

A few discussion videos for you.... Wink

http://www.bbc5.tv/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pin8fbdGV9Y&feature=autoplay&list=PLFA50FBC214A6CE87&lf=plpp_video&playnext=21

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvp3RWc4Dlo&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=4aF2J6ZJsdw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whKrENfkMEM

http://www.cmn.tv/news/new-world-currency/

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/inlight_radio/2012/06/14/the-light-agenda

enjoy!

Aitch Smile
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Enrique Corbellini


Joined: 20 May 2009
Posts: 93

PostPosted: Fri 15 Jun 2012, 11:02    Post subject: answered  

Aitch wrote:
Enrique
Health
....
A few discussion videos for you.... Wink
-----
enjoy!
Aitch Smile


I answered you at:

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=634324#634324

because of we are no longer speaking about "other distros"
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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Fri 15 Jun 2012, 13:14    Post subject:  

Yes thanks for creating that other thread that you link to.
Back to other distros.

Someone asked about AVLinux and how to boot it in grub2.
If any of you have knowledge maybe you could help that person?

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nooby

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PostPosted: Sun 17 Jun 2012, 12:04    Post subject: TTYLinux?  

So this one is not GUI it is TTY Smile
http://ttylinux.net/

Quote:

ttylinux, a small GNU/Linux system available for several CPU architectures.
This smallest ttylinux system has an 8 MB file system and runs on i486
computers within 28 MB of RAM, but provides a complete command line
environment and is ready for Internet access.

The goal this project is to make one of the smallest up-to-date Linux
systems that is similar to a larger distribution. An insteresting result is
the ttylinux build system.

End users may want to use ttylinux on old computers for accessing
the Internet, or bootable on a USB disk for a portable system.
Developers may want to use ttylinux for their embedded systems,
or use the ttylinux build system to create their own variant.


so the 64.000USD Q is. How does one frugal boot that one on NTFS? Smile

Okay maybe on USB using dd or some other geek trick.
Have any of you tested it?

Okay one more question. Does it allow one to be root?

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Aitch


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PostPosted: Sun 17 Jun 2012, 20:26    Post subject:  

Enrique wrote:
I answered you at:

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=634324#634324

because of we are no longer speaking about "other distros"


thanks Very Happy

Aitch Smile
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Colonel Panic


Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 1511

PostPosted: Mon 18 Jun 2012, 05:35    Post subject:  

Just installed Solus 1.0, and was pleased to find it upgraded itself, i.e. downloaded and installed all the necessary packages, without my having to indicate anything; it's automatic and you can set the notification interval from the system control panel.

It looks good with a Gnome 2 interface and a nice selection of wallpapers, and seems stable too. Almost ideal, except that it's the old story with Debian-based distros and Flash; Flash keeps crashing or not even starting.

I might start a thread about Flash here when I've got a bit more time as trying to get it to work properly is getting past a joke now. It goes and stays wrong pretty much right across the board in installed distros; Vector Light is the only distro which seems immune at the moment..

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