Lucid Puppy 5.2.8 - Updated ISO Version 005 - APR 05 2012

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rerwin
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#881 Post by rerwin »

Sylvander,
You are very close. I know the "explanations" are a little vague, but the details are more than a novice would understand. Here's the deal (which I tried to explain earlier). Say we have a package that updates a puppy component (file):
  • - Installing a package in a flash-drive installation (which is what we are talking about here) places the new file in the "save" layer, which is below the "snap" (pup_rw) layer.
    - Uninstalling a package places the original (puppy sfs) version of the component in the "snap" layer.
    - The first time the "save" function is used in a session, it saves everything in the "snap" layer into the "save" layer.
    - Subsequent "saves" copy only the components in the "snap" layer that are newer than the copy in the "save" layer.
So, the following could cause trouble:
  • - Uninstalling the components to "snap" layer, then installing them to "save" layer, then doing the first "save" of the session, results in the old versions overwriting the new, thus losing the new package.
    - If the above were done after the first save, the new-package versions of the components would be retained.
    - If you install, then uninstall, then save, the results, as above, will depend on whether the "save" was the first of the session, or not.
The "conflict prevention" logic merely ensures that an uninstall gets saved by the first "save" of the session, and that installations get saved by a subsequent "save" -- but only if both operations are attempted in the same session. If only one of those is done in a session, then the components will exist in only one of the layers, and that's OK.

And you are right about items 5 & 6. It is the package manager (PPM) that interferes with the ideal uninstall-save-install sequence. I originally coded for that sequence (and have it saved, in case we solve the problem), but had to abandon it because I could not figure out how to fix PPM. Expert assistance needed!

Who decides? The logic I coded, not the user.

BTW, "and/or" is unnecessary because "or" is an "inclusive or". Learned that in a "Clear Technical Writing" PI course.

Note that the directions to the user refer to package(s), to mean that multiple packages can be (un)installed as a group. You just cannot mix the two operations without doing a "save" between groups. And you cannot undo the first save, so must reboot to get a new "first save" opportunity for the uninstalls.

One might ask why we don't see more problems of this sort. The exposure is in working with components that are in the main puppy SFS file, because that's where the old versions reside. My guess is that most installations are of components other than puppy files, so that uninstallation only removes the package files, without any replacement. Since my fix packages almost always involve puppy components, they are most subject to the above "conflicts", and thus seem more problem-prone in flash-drive installations than other packages.

Thanks for providing the opening for me explain my reasoning about this. And I am open to word-smithing those messages.
Richard

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l2ulinux
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Lupu 5.2.8

#882 Post by l2ulinux »

playdayz wrote:

First, please try 004 in the first message of this thread.

DL and burn, then booted setup was easy and everthing worked witn no problem. At exit saved to file on HD and rebooted and all worked great. Thanks

rezolt
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Joined: Sat 24 Dec 2011, 06:12

using Plop boot manager

#883 Post by rezolt »

Hello everyone just like the rest of you I have problem with the audio system and some minor glitches of our dear puppy from the past. Today I am going to share some simple tips for those who are not aware of Plop boot manager. Before I was using a Pentium 4 1.7Ghz unit but it broke out because I have gambled around with my BIOS. I was so curious how to upgrade it as an experience but wind up having a dead system. Now I am using an older version of my PC which is my old Pentium 3. I encountered a big problem because the memory part was already obsolete and can no longer be found on the market. So I was forced to used Lucid Puppy because of its small size. Now I am using Wary Puppy 5.2.2 which I find to be great even thought I still experiencing some minor glitch like the hang-ups. Now for some tips, if your system cannot boot directly from a usb device you can use Plop boot manager to boot it. The interface was simple and can be learned by a novice. Now to solve the problem of corruption I have formatted my usb thumb drive as ext3 this solves my frequent corruption of thumb drive. There is one thing I cannot solve, the more I use my puppy the more it becomes sluggish specially if I am connected on the web.

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James C
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#884 Post by James C »

James C wrote:On my last test install http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 162#586162 I forgot to mention that "check drivers" in Quickpet misidentified the Trident video and recommended a Nvidia driver.No problem for me but thought I'd better mention it.
Purely for informational purposes........otherwise all looking good.


VGA compatible controller : Trident Microsystems CyberBlade/i1 (prog-if 00 [VGA controller])
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Sage
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#885 Post by Sage »

rezolt : FUD & BS. PC s don't break unless you throw them out of the window! Time to flash/replace the BIOS and get to grips with the HW. It's shear nonsense to say that parts, incl. memory of any age, aren't available - look on eBay; it's awash with stuff. Machines don't 'slow down' unless you have Winduze present or your ISP has a poor contention ratio. Stop using Intel boxes. Learn to open the case. Hire a six-year-old. Change your ISP.
Some folks might object to my directness, but it's reports like this that put incomers off. It angers me that the capitalist b*st*rds, particularly in one nation, brainwash their young people to believe in magic boxes, preferring to teach them how to open their wallets. The only clever guys in this game are the ones who research solid state sciences and those that write the code, esp. back to assembler and binary levels. Anyone else is entirely capable of building and repairing their own HW - no excuses about lack of time, wife won't let me, electricity is dangerous and all that cr*p.

Before the backlash from across the water, I should again make it clear that I have loads of friends 'over there' and none of them conform to that nation's determination to dumb down its populace. Most correspondents on this Forum do not conform to that norm, either, that's why they are here. All the answers you need are on the InterWeb.

Oh yes - Merry Christmas!

Jasper

#886 Post by Jasper »

Sage,

Yes, "it's shear nonsense" is "sheer nonsense".

Perhaps cthisbear will proffer you some advice?

My regards

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Aitch
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#887 Post by Aitch »

rezolt
Puppy slowing....??
Increase the size of your save file and make a linux swap partition, are the only suggestions I can make [or check that its not a thermal/clogged fan/heatsink problem]
As Sage says, memory can be had from dumpsters or ebay
BIOS is very tricky to tweak successfully, but a few gamehackers have done it....not for the impatient/faint hearted
We have several threads about PLOP boot manager
try http://www.wellminded.com/puppy/pupsearch.html

Aitch :)

KJ
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#888 Post by KJ »

Sage, I agree with your assessment. In over 40 years or so, I have had only a couple PS failures and one MB smoked. Sound advice.

May we all have a safe and happy holiday season. KJ

Barkingmad
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#889 Post by Barkingmad »

Is there a version of the ExiffTools Perl, um, "thing" library???? :?

I have installed Fotoxx photo editing/management programme in Lupu and have a slight problem. I have followed this http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... :) Will

Barkingmad
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forum's playing up can't post message body only titles

#890 Post by Barkingmad »

explaining blank post

Jasper

#891 Post by Jasper »

Hi Barkingmad,

If you included a link then clicked the URL box then if anything went awry that may be the most likely reason for your blank post.

If that was the case then either include the link and ignore the URL box or make sure the link is fully highlighted before clicking the URL box.

My regards

PS Your name is great for a Puppy forum.

Addendum:

Aitch - my compliments on your star trick In your post immediately below. I Know Lobster is a member of The Inner Magic Circle, but it is good to know he has company here.
Last edited by Jasper on Sat 24 Dec 2011, 18:09, edited 1 time in total.

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Aitch
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#892 Post by Aitch »

Barkingmad wrote:Is there a version of the ExiffTools Perl, um, "thing" library???? :?

I have installed Fotoxx photo editing/management programme in Lupu and have a slight problem. I have followed this http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=39324[ thread and have installed the Fotoxx i686 deb package from the Fotoxx developer's site, this runs fine on Lupu but needs ExiffTools for some functions. I installed ExiffTools 8.66 that is linked in the Fotoxx thread but although indexing pictures works, showing Exiff data doesn't -- it just opens a blank window.


I have this combo of Fotoxx and ExiffTools working on a Puppy 4.3.1 install although it needed a couple of other libs which I got from the Ubuntu repos so I kow it can work which is why I thought I might need a version of ExiffTools optimized for Lupu.

Hope someone can understand what I'm trying to say here :)

Will
I've edited the url link - barkingmad, the url closebracket is down by your signature....but you could edit it

Aitch :)

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mikeslr
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My Vote is to Continue Lucid or Try a 64-Bit Lucid

#893 Post by mikeslr »

Hi Playdaz:

Perhaps I'm a minority, and as yet some of the following is speculation, but:

One reason I still have XP on my Quad-Core Desktop and Dual Core Laptop is Dragon Naturally Speaking. If you check the Wine Website you'll find that Dragon Naturally Speaking 10 (Note the 10) received a gold rating. Although not everything works, it installs, runs and enables dictation, albeit only into its inbuilt DragonPad, or Wine's notepad, from which it can be cut and pasted into Abiword. (Libre/OpenOffice produces a file which has a grey background and light gray text). But from my experience, Dragon runs as fast and converts speech to text as flawlessly under Linux as under XP. My experience --and the reports on the Wine Website-- is that the "gold" rating only applies to Ubuntus 10 and 11 and their derivatives. In my case, Pinguy and Zorin, both 32 and 64 bit.
As yet, I have not been able to install Dragon to Puppies, even when resorting to a Full Install, but I may be close. I've had to order another copy of Dragon 10 Standard as, it seems, after about 5 installations Dragon removes its msi file from its installation desk. When it arrives I'll (backup my installation disk and) try with FatDog 64, Lighthouse64 and Lucid. But my gut feeling --based on the above experience and reports-- is that the best hope for success will be with Lucid. FatDog and Lighthouse are T2 Builds and I suspect that there may be something about the way Ubuntu was built or configured that they lack.
Dragon is perhaps one of the most complex programs ever developed. It took about 15 years of improvements for it to actually work efficiently enough to be useful. While not everyone may have a use for Dragon, almost everyone has favorite XP programs for which there are no Linux equivalents. The Ubuntu 10s and 11s may be the best foundations for porting XP programs to Linux under wine.

So my vote is that you continue improving the Lucid/Maverick based Puppy. Or if you find yourself with a couple of hours (':lol:')(':wink:') with nothing better to do, how about trying to woof a Lucid/Maverick 64-bit.

mikesLr

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playdayz
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#894 Post by playdayz »

One reason I still have XP on my Quad-Core Desktop and Dual Core Laptop is Dragon Naturally Speaking.
mikeslr, I received an email from Crossover that they are working on a Linux version of Dragon Naturally Speaking (the windows version with customizations to run in wine). Since it is their specialty they will be able to tweak things to give it a higher probability of running correctly. The email was about testing a beta so i gather that they feel they are close. Crossover is a commercial product, but reasonably priced and they feed all their discoveries back into the Wine project. It is possible to become a tester for Crossover (codeweavers) by "advocating" and testing a particular piece of software, or at least it was when I became one.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lucid 5.2.8.004 Alternate

The original reason for Browser Choice in Lucid was *not* to save space but to provide, uh, browser choice. However, this alternate 528.004 has the Iron browser installed, along with Flashplayer and the Xorg_High hardware acceleration (mesa/glx) drivers. Iron is based on the open-source Chromium source code (as is Google Chrome) but with some of the potentially invasive tracking features disabled. It is not the smallest browser but in all my testing it is the fastest--that is, it both starts up and renders pages significantly faster than the others.

Lucid 5.2.8.004 Alternate -> http://diddywahdiddy.net/Puppy500/lupu-528.004-alt.iso
md5 checksum -> e7019c68db971eb0b9ae502ff0e14f1d

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In other news, there is a new thread for Remastered variations on Lucid 5.2.8 that contains lihks to remasterd versions plus instructions on remastering -> http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=74588

.

jpeps
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Re: My Vote is to Continue Lucid or Try a 64-Bit Lucid

#895 Post by jpeps »

mikeslr wrote: Dragon is perhaps one of the most complex programs ever developed. It took about 15 years of improvements for it to actually work efficiently enough to be useful
I use a dragon dictation app on my ipod touch that works great! I remember the old days when you had to train it.

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James C
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#896 Post by James C »

playdayz wrote: Lucid 5.2.8.004 Alternate

The original reason for Browser Choice in Lucid was *not* to save space but to provide, uh, browser choice. However, this alternate 528.004 has the Iron browser installed, along with Flashplayer and the Xorg_High hardware acceleration (mesa/glx) drivers. Iron is based on the open-source Chromium source code (as is Google Chrome) but with some of the potentially invasive tracking features disabled. It is not the smallest browser but in all my testing it is the fastest--that is, it both starts up and renders pages significantly faster than the others.
.
As you may remember, none of the prior Lucid pets for Iron/Chrome/Chromium would run on my Athlon XP box so I was pleasantly surprised that Iron is working fine in Lucid 5.2.8.004 Alternate.
Looking good on this little pfix=ram live test.
Great job. :)

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mikeslr
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Merry Christmas & Taxes around the Corner

#897 Post by mikeslr »

To Playdaz & all;
In case I don't check in tomorrow, Merry Christmas to all.
Playdaz, thanks for the idea.
To Sage: Not sure how it is on your side of the pound. On my side, before I retired and got lazy, I used to do my taxes on a spreadsheet. After a couple of years a buying and using software it occurred to me that I spent more time wading thru the same stupid questions than inputting significant figures. Uncle Sam thoughtfully mows down untold numbers of trees and annually prints up tax preparation pamphlets which nobody reads. So I worked my way thru one of the them, formatting cells to add, subtract, divide or copy as appropriate. After it crunched the numbers I still had to hand-copy the data to the official forms. But a friend of my who had worked for the IRS recommended that to be the best way to submit one's tax returns, anyway: they can't be read by scanning into a computer and employees of the IRS --who have a quota of returns to audit-- are too busy or lazy to check hand-written returns. Thereafter, I used the previous year's spreadsheet as a template, checking the new pamphlet (and later google) to see what changes occurred in the tax code. Keep in mind, I ran a business but did not have any significant investments. But if I had had, it would just have meant a few more rows and columns.
So we don't need tax preparation software, merely templates for Libre/OpenOffice.
But then, we wouldn't be doing our part to regain or maintain full employment. You keep overlooking the simple fact that whether you are a Fiscal Conservative or a Keynesian Liberal, our economic system is predicated on the belief that an increase in consumption of goods and services is vital to business success and popular happiness.

mikesLr

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playdayz
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#898 Post by playdayz »

As you may remember, none of the prior Lucid pets for Iron/Chrome/Chromium would run on my Athlon XP box
James C, I am sorry to say that I missed this. And i am totally puzzled. I made the 004 Alternate by booting the 004 regular and installing the latest Iron pet http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 868#584868

What happens if you install that pet and enter "iron" in a terminal? There will be some warnings and errors but no fatal error for me.

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James C
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#899 Post by James C »

playdayz wrote:
As you may remember, none of the prior Lucid pets for Iron/Chrome/Chromium would run on my Athlon XP box
James C, I am sorry to say that I missed this. And i am totally puzzled. I made the 004 Alternate by booting the 004 regular and installing the latest Iron pet http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 868#584868

What happens if you install that pet and enter "iron" in a terminal? There will be some warnings and errors but no fatal error for me.
Haven't tried the latest Iron pet ( I'd already made my own Chrome pet that worked) but from one prior post http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 952#556952
I have been unable to get any of the Chrome, Chromium or Iron pets to run on my Athlon XP box or my old P3 test box. If tried from the terminal I generally get.....

Quote:
Illegal instruction


No problem on P4's, etc. though.I don't really like Chrome but I've made my own pets that do work.Pretty old version so no real reason to upload though.
But reading more in the same thread it appears that libgconf2-4_3.1.6 pet solved the problem and Chrome/Iron started working.Finally. :lol:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 956#556956


I've always heard that the memory is the first thing to go..... :lol:

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playdayz
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#900 Post by playdayz »

But reading more in the same thread it appears that libgconf2-4_3.1.6 pet solved the problem and Chrome/Iron started working.
Good. That's it. The recent pets assume that the libgconf from Instant Update 002 is installed. (I didn't know that could result in illegal instruction though.)
I've always heard that the memory is the first thing to go.....

What were we talking about? ;-)

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