Puppy Linux Discussion Forum Forum Index Puppy Linux Discussion Forum
Puppy HOME page : puppylinux.com
"THE" alternative forum : puppylinux.info
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The time now is Sat 02 Aug 2014, 02:36
All times are UTC - 4
 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Misc
List of distros frugal install on NTFS HDD with menu.lst?
Moderators: Flash, JohnMurga
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
Page 1 of 2 [21 Posts]   Goto page: 1, 2 Next
Author Message
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 07:06    Post subject:  List of distros frugal install on NTFS HDD with menu.lst?
Subject description: Does there exists such a list or why don't we make one?
 

Maybe not many would look for such a list but it would be handy to be able to link to it if there existed one.

To be useful it would need to include the menu.lst code so people knows how to replicate others successes booting. And also how to make save of persistence? or of it can only boot but now save.

I mean frugally on NTFS but it is helpful if one add those that only boot on linux partitions but then one have to mention that is what one tested it on.

Puppy is the champ so that one comes first on the list.

Knoppix does too and DSL and TCL and so on.

Is that a cool thread or totally worthless?

_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though

Last edited by nooby on Wed 04 May 2011, 02:46; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
puppyluvr


Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 3186
Location: Chickasha Oklahoma

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 09:58    Post subject:  

Very Happy Hello,
I have investigated this while building MultiPup..
So far the only distros that I cant get to boot from grub were Ubuntu and Luitlinux.....
They would boot, but fail to configure...I could prob get it, but I quit trying..
Just read the isolinux file from the ISO and edit grub to suit...

Many distros require the data files be on the top level, ie the root of the partition...DSL for example....

_________________
Close the Windows, and open your eyes, to a whole new world
http://puppylinuxstuff.meownplanet.net/puppyluvr/
Puppy Linux Users Group on Facebook

Puppy since 2.15CE...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 10:26    Post subject:  

puppyluvr wrote
So far the only distros that I cant get to boot from grub were Ubuntu and Luitlinux.....

I have heard of Ubuntu but not the last one. Okay I did manage to get Ubuntu to boot before they went Grub2. So 8.04 or 8.10 maybe will boot in frugal live mode on NTFS but there is no way to save such things like keyboard and Firewall set up or which Flashplugin one use.

So sadly the most known Linux fails.

Slackware based seems to be among those that allow it.

Vector, Wolvix, Groblin, NimbleX, Slax and so on.
Debian based except Ubuntu like Simply Mepis and AntiX and such.

I only got one Arch based distro to boot but had to do ISO boot in frugal on NTFS but many of the otehr Arch I failed.

Maybe most would boot on Ext2 or Ext3 partition but I want to be Dual booting with the original OS and not change any partition. It changes the recovery safe guards them set up to know nobody have tampered with their set up. So no resizing are allowed on the hdd.

Sure one can have USB and format the USB flash or HDD in every way one want but I am not good at partitioning USB, it is a hit an miss every time I try.

So I trust that Puppy TCL and Knoppix and AntiX can boot but I would want us to list every other that boot and tell how we did it. That would be cool to be able to link to as a help if somebody say that Puppy is the only distro allowing frugal so that is something too odd to even consider then one can show that a lot of developers have allowed frugal boot by setting up their Distro so it works.

_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
rcrsn51


Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 8942
Location: Stratford, Ontario

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 10:56    Post subject:  

puppyluvr wrote:
Just read the isolinux file from the ISO and edit grub to suit....

It's no longer that simple. If you look at the Live CD for a recent Ubuntu, you will see that isolinux is just running the initial menu. The OS is actually booting from Grub2.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 11:28    Post subject:  

Haha that is why I want Puppy to be able to install itself as a grub2 distro on a USB flash and then one can change the files to another distro and that way one can test all these Peppermint and other derivates from Ubuntu/mint varieties.
_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
amigo

Joined: 02 Apr 2007
Posts: 2226

PostPosted: Thu 24 Mar 2011, 13:51    Post subject:  

The trick to a frugal installation is not in the bootloader. It's in the initrd -that's where the code is which looks for the file system image(s) to be used to set up a bootable system. You could make any distro you like to run like that -you just need a proper initrd and kernel for each one.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Thu 24 Mar 2011, 13:59    Post subject:  

Amigo I trust you on this.

Does that mean that if a distro don't boot frugally then the Dev did not know about frugal or that they did not care or did know and did not want it to boot frugally due to some political reason?

Does it mean that any with enough knowledge can create their own initrd that boot any distro by patching the initrd and reburn the iso?

How difficult is it to do this? or such changes? Just to change a reference or do you need to do real programming or just change a word or value and then reburn the iso?

Let me explain, my naive question. Often they fail to boot due to them looking for the "signature" a special file with the signature and it is there but on the HDD but the initrd look for it on the CD or USB so if one could just patch that look to the HDD instead Is it that easy?

_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
d4p


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
Posts: 406

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 00:46    Post subject:  

"Puppy is the champ so that one comes first on the list."

May be yes, but you have to count also boot directly from iso.
Booting from iso is very nice for multiboot system, guarantee without conflict, and possible full install from iso.

"I mean frugally on NTFS but it is helpful if one add those that only boot on linux partitions but...."

Frugal booting or direct booting from iso is possible.
I have -giga multiboot usb external HDD- using GRUB4DOS:
1st partition: Portable XP full installed on NTFS partition (see Usboot.org)
2nd partition: All isos & frugals on NTFS partition (work the most, see the list below)
3rd partition: All isos & frugals on Fat32 partition (only 3 or 4 os sofar must be on this partition)
4th partition: linux partition ext3
This is the list that sofar it work on my usb external HDD:
----- Windows system ------
Portable XP, minipe, micrope, win7 & vista recovery disk, hbcd.
----- Windows Installations -------
xp install, win7 install
----- virus scanner ------
eset32sys rescuecd, norton av rescue 2011, bitdefender rescue, avast BartPe v2, kaspersky 2010, panda safe cd, fsecure, gdatacd 2010, avg rescuecd, acronisantimalwarecd
----- Linux Distros ------
Parted Magic 510, lupu 520, austrumi 232, slitaz 30, tinycore 35, jolicloud, slax 612, linux mint, k- l- x- ubuntu 1010, ctBankix(best Banking online), fedora 14, Pclinuxos 2010, sebayon 55, swiftlinux, ylmf, debian live, peppermint, easypeasy, sms, more and more still alot of space.

download MultiBootISOs-x.exe & run it, open full-menu.lst
http://www.pendrivelinux.com/boot-multiple-iso-from-usb-multiboot-usb/
Some other information:
http://reboot.pro/index.php?app=core&module=search&do=active

"Is that a cool thread or totally worthless?"
Just a big challenge & spending a lot time.

Defrag the HDD can take the whole day to finished it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
aarf

Joined: 30 Aug 2007
Posts: 3620
Location: around the bend

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 01:12    Post subject:  

i agree. grub booting direct from iso in knoppix is more new user friendly than puppy frugal. getting that knowledge and capability to puppy would be a plus.
_________________

ASUS EeePC Flare series 1025C 4x Intel Atom N2800 @ 1.86GHz RAM 2063MB 800x600p ATA 320G
_-¤-_

<º))))><.¸¸.•´¯`•.#.•´¯`•.¸¸. ><((((º>
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 07:16    Post subject:  

Frugal boot of the iso is something I like too but usually one would need to do it on USB and Fat32 and not be able to do it on NTFS on the inner HDD.

A few distros allow it but most would bark that they fail to find the files due to them looking for the CD live on the CD so one have to tell the Devs to allow iso booting from any place and not only the CD drive or the USB.

Or change to BIOS in such a way that it see the inner HDD as an CD drive then?

MultiBootISOs-x.exe ? but can this be run in Wine on Puppy or does one need to fire up windows to run it?

If one are dependent of Ms Windows to boot a Linux OS that is kind of to make one totally dependent on the proprietary moguls.

Linux user at the computer store. I can not buy that computer because it has not Ms Windows on it. But I thought you where totally into Linux? Yes but I need to borrow Windoes to to boot Linux Duh Smile

Just friendly teasing. I try to get used to not never every needing windows anymore.

Grub2 allow for some more booting on NTFS but Puppy Devs don't want to allow Puppy to be used by newbies on Grub2 only by the pro user of Puppy. So one need to learn Ubuntu or TCL or something that have grub2 or one have to learn how to make an USB that allow booting of anything and I am not there yet. So steep learning curve. I fail to get things in place. My brain just lose all the details and fail to structure them in a file so it is comprehensible after it is written. Too many details that need to be taken in sequence.

_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 07:17    Post subject:  

I failed with peppermint how did you set that one up for to work?

Ah it is one of the isos that can be booted on usb if one use that Windows tool.

But how does one boot peppermint from the NTFS HDD in iso or as individual directories sifted out of the iso?

Here is a thing about ubuntu on USB that boots in 8 seconds Sara claim.

To follow her instructions one need a CD with Ubuntu live and then an USB with 4GB or more??? and to prepare it to have the partitions she mention. Too involved for me to get it though.

add full ubuntu (not liveCD) to your multi-boot usb
http://reboot.pro/13104/page__pid__114341#entry114341
(not livecd) Boot full Ubuntu+Fedora+Mint .VHD From USB by grub4dos
http://reboot.pro/13801/page__p__121693#entry121693

Sara seems good at using computers. I barely get what she talks about but very interesting.

She uses a short or abbrev there that I fail to grasp. VHD

is it Virtual Hard Disk Image or something? That one make use of the images that Vbox and such tend to use?

That is why she says she use Full Ubuntu and not the Live ubuntu and why she wants us to download three files from an upload instead of reusing the files from Ubuntu we already have from their dowloads.

Why would it not work for those one already have? Why do I need to user her versions?

_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Ibidem

Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 468
Location: State of Jefferson

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 22:46    Post subject:  

Grub4dos menu.lst follows:
Code:
title FreeDOS FAT16
root (hd0,2)
chainloader /kernel.sys

title FreeDOS FAT32
root (hd0,2)
chainloader /ktc18632.sys

title Dapper
find --set-root /dapper.lst
configfile /dapper.lst

title Puppy Linux
root (hd0,5)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz
initrd /initrd.gz

title Lucid Puppy (Puppy 5.00)
root (hd0,4)/puppy/
kernel /vmlinuz root=/dev/sda5/puppy
initrd /initrd.gz


#title PUPPY HD FULL
#root (hd0,5) 
#kernel /boot/vmlinuz root=/dev/hda6 ro vga=normal

#title Puppy 430
#root (hd0,5)
#kernel /boot/vmlinuz root=/dev/sda6 pmedia=atahd nosmp
#initrd /initrd.gz

title TinyCore Linux
root (hd0,4)
kernel /TCORE/bzImage vga=788
initrd /TCORE/tinycore.gz

#title @PRODUCT@ @VERSION@
#   kernel @KERNELPATH@
#   initrd @INITRDPATH@


#title Ubuntu NetBoot
#root (hd0,4)
#kernel /linux
#initrd /initrd.gz

title NimbleX 2007 - Boot in KDM
root (hd0,1)
kernel /base/vmlinuz vga=791 max_loop=255 init=linuxrc load_ramdisk=1 prompt_ramdisk=0 ramdisk_size=5120 root=/dev/ram0 rw quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=kdm;sleep~604800
initrd /base/initrd.gz


title Kuki Linux config
root            (hd0,1)
configfile      /kukimenu.lst

That shows NimbleX, netboot for Ubuntu, TCL, and Puppy.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
puppyluvr


Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 3186
Location: Chickasha Oklahoma

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 23:46    Post subject:  

Very Happy Hello,
@Nooby,
Quote:
I have heard of Ubuntu but not the last one.

I know you are a "distro surfer" so check it out here..
http://luitlinux.sarovar.org/
It is a Knoppix/DSL spin, I think it is Latvian...I forgot...But it is nice...
50-79mb....
No Puppy Tho... Very Happy

_________________
Close the Windows, and open your eyes, to a whole new world
http://puppylinuxstuff.meownplanet.net/puppyluvr/
Puppy Linux Users Group on Facebook

Puppy since 2.15CE...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
puppyluvr


Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 3186
Location: Chickasha Oklahoma

PostPosted: Fri 25 Mar 2011, 23:54    Post subject:  

Very Happy Hello...again...

This is a snippet from the code in MultiPup that generates a grub entry for Nimblex.. ($menu is a variable for the version of Nimblex IE Nimblex2008..)
Quote:
echo "gfxmenu (cd)/$menu/boot/grub/message
title $menu - Boot in KDM
root (cd)
kernel (cd)/$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=xconf;kdm
initrd (cd)/$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title $menu - Boot in KDE
root (cd)
kernel (cd)/$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=startx
initrd (cd)/$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title $menu - Safe Install
root (cd)
kernel (cd)/$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw safeinst vga=791 splash=silent quiet autoexec=xconf;kdm
initrd (cd)/$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Submenu - Other Boot Modes
configfile (cd)/$menu/boot/grub/extended
title Submenu - Other Desktops
configfile (cd)/$menu/boot/grub/desktops

title Return to Main Menu
configfile (cd)/boot/grub/menu.lst" > $locate/working/$menu/menu.lst;
echo "title Boot in Enlightment 17
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=rune17
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Boot in Enlightment 16
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=rune16
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Boot in Fluxbox
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=runflux
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Boot in IceWM (Ice Window Manager)
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=runice
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Boot in EDE (Equinox Desktop Env.)
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=runede
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Boot in TWM (Tab Window Manager)
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=runtwm
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Main Menu - Most popular options
configfile /$menu/boot/grub/menu.lst" > $locate/working/$menu//boot/grub/desktops;
echo "default=2
timeout=30
title $menu - Boot in CLI
root (cd)
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title $menu - Boot in RAM
root (cd)
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw quiet vga=791 splash toram changes=nimblex.data autoexec=startx
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title $menu - Boot Kiosk Mode
root (cd)
kernel /$menu/boot/vmlinuz-nx08 ramdisk_size=7120 root=/dev/ram0 rw vga=791 splash=silent quiet changes=nimblex.data autoexec=kiosk
initrd /$menu/boot/initrd-nx08.gz
title Main Menu - Most popular options
configfile /$menu/boot/grub/menu.lst"


Man I love Puppy.... Cool

_________________
Close the Windows, and open your eyes, to a whole new world
http://puppylinuxstuff.meownplanet.net/puppyluvr/
Puppy Linux Users Group on Facebook

Puppy since 2.15CE...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Sat 26 Mar 2011, 07:53    Post subject:  

Thanks indeed guys for caring about my crazy thread. Smile

I guess I have to put stress on where the OS is installed and the partition of the media.

Some only work on Fat32 and not on NTFS at all. Some works on Ext2 or Ext3 but neither on Fat32 nor on NTFS.

For us who want to be able to help out a neighbor who have problems with MsWindows we need to be able to install Puppy or other Linux distro without changing their basic OS that they want to keep due to them having programs that only work in a properly installed Windows.

Yes I have tested to get it to work using Wine in Puppy and the program barked very loud that it could not get what it needed for Borland Database Program to work. Only Windows has such.

And the Neighbor has newly paid thousands of Swedish money to get that Program so puppy and other linux has to work on NTFS partition and that can not be changed size of either due to the recovery has recorded teh size and put that in its' memory and refuse to do the recovery if one do the resize.

That is why we see it as boxed in. This is reality and not some propaganda. This is life as it is Smile

To keep the friendship of a nice neighbor one can not start persuading them to give up on Windoes. One have to co-live in Dual Booting. Okay!

So cool list there., And that one work on the NTFS internal HDD on your computer. I have to test. Will be interesting. Much appreciated.

_________________
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 1 of 2 [21 Posts]   Goto page: 1, 2 Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Misc
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.1079s ][ Queries: 12 (0.0054s) ][ GZIP on ]