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 Forum index » House Training » Bugs ( Submit bugs )
Session is 'always' saved -not good
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dru5k1


Joined: 11 Apr 2010
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Tue 15 Mar 2011, 20:08    Post subject:  Session is 'always' saved -not good  

Hi, I'm seeing this problem in 5.2 - running live (cd) with a usb save-file

Puppy will save the session automatically at shutdown, unless you uncomment this action in /etc/rc.d/rc.shutdown - which results in an ugly Xorg error at each bootup

When using puppy live and you make a save-file, you get a 'save' icon on the desktop -so if you install a program or make some web-bookmarks, you can click that and save the changes (you know, this takes half a minute). But the problem is that if you make some kind of blunder requiring a reboot - well puppy automatically 'saves' your blunder, and that is a problem

I've looked at "Puppy Event Manager" and chosen PUPMODE 0, but the answer is not there -still a save at shutdown.. The rc.shutdown fix is an ugly one, and I think that Puppy should do this (no saving unless you say so) in a clean and tidy way

I hope you agree.
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jamesbond

Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 2053
Location: The Blue Marble

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 00:50    Post subject:  

dru5k1 - automatic "save session" is what puppy is designed for. It's neither a problem or a bug.

The big red "save" button - it is only there when one runs puppy on top of flash drives (or multisession-DVD I think), and it's not for what you think --- because puppy always saves session at the end of session, even if you never click that big red button.

If you want to disable this behaviour, then you'll have to modify puppy. There are a few threads in this forum dedicated to that, all you need to do is use google to search for it.

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=disable+saving+automatic+session+site%3Amurga-linux.com&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&client=firefox-a.

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dawg

Joined: 09 Aug 2009
Posts: 113
Location: still here

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 15:49    Post subject: Re: Session is 'always' saved -not good  

dru5k1 wrote:
Hi, I'm seeing this problem in 5.2 - running live (cd) with a usb save-file

Puppy will save the session automatically at shutdown, unless you uncomment this action in /etc/rc.d/rc.shutdown - which results in an ugly Xorg error at each bootup

When using puppy live and you make a save-file, you get a 'save' icon on the desktop -so if you install a program or make some web-bookmarks, you can click that and save the changes (you know, this takes half a minute). But the problem is that if you make some kind of blunder requiring a reboot - well puppy automatically 'saves' your blunder, and that is a problem

I've looked at "Puppy Event Manager" and chosen PUPMODE 0, but the answer is not there -still a save at shutdown.. The rc.shutdown fix is an ugly one, and I think that Puppy should do this (no saving unless you say so) in a clean and tidy way

I hope you agree.

AGREE ABSOLUTELY! It has bothered me too, and I may have complained before. I'm slightly perplexed as to why, unlike all the other useful saving options, this one's never been implemented by default...

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bwh1969

Joined: 25 Oct 2010
Posts: 129
Location: Allentown, PA

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 17:10    Post subject: i also agree  

There is a fix for you to have it prompt you at shutdown. Fluppy makes this happen (or at least it used to), and even gives it a timeout, and if you don't say yes within 60 seconds, it will just shut down with no save.
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jemimah


Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 4309
Location: Tampa, FL

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 17:17    Post subject:  

The only time it's completely safe to save is during shutdown, after all user processes are killed. Otherwise you run the small risk of saving a file at the same time it's being written to which can result in file corruption. Saving during shutdown ensures that all files are cleanly saved.
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pemasu


Joined: 08 Jul 2009
Posts: 5463
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 17:20    Post subject:  

http://shino.pos.to/linux/puppy/pupsaveconfig-1.9.9.pet

It has option with frugal installs not to save at shutdown.

EDIT: ok, it works only if you dont use savefile already.
Like pfix=ram or new install.
My mistake, sorry.
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dru5k1


Joined: 11 Apr 2010
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 18:03    Post subject:  

hmm

if you make some kind of blunder requiring a reboot - well puppy automatically 'saves' your blunder, and that is a problem
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Jasper


Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 1089
Location: England

PostPosted: Wed 16 Mar 2011, 19:44    Post subject:  

Hi guys,

I have deleted my original post here.

On reflection it was probably only helpful with a frugal install.

My regards

Last edited by Jasper on Thu 17 Mar 2011, 17:41; edited 1 time in total
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pemasu


Joined: 08 Jul 2009
Posts: 5463
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Thu 17 Mar 2011, 16:59    Post subject:  

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=505163#505163
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sat 19 Mar 2011, 17:04    Post subject: Re: Session is 'always' saved -not good  

dru5k1 wrote:
Puppy will save the session automatically at shutdown, unless you uncomment this action in /etc/rc.d/rc.shutdown - which results in an ugly Xorg error at each bootup
...
The rc.shutdown fix is an ugly one, and I think that Puppy should do this (no saving unless you say so) in a clean and tidy way

It's not that ugly... you can just add to rc.shutdown
Code:
rm /initrd/pup_ro1/etc/.XLOADED
...
It would be trivial to make this configurable (via the boot manager).

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dru5k1


Joined: 11 Apr 2010
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Mon 21 Mar 2011, 22:46    Post subject:  

thank you Dougal! that's really helpful
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Digital_Dissident


Joined: 02 Mar 2010
Posts: 25
Location: U.S.- E. Coast

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 00:57    Post subject: Agreed- Should Ask
Subject description: Why Isn't the DEFAULT to Always Ask?
 

I just booted Wary Puppy 5.1.1 using a saved session file for the first time and, much to my chagrin, discovered this automatic saving of the session.

Is there a reason it can't ask whether you'd like to save the session, the way it does when no saved session file was invoked at boot-up? (By default)

(And also ask at the beginning whether or not to enable the periodic automatic saving that was mentioned in the other thread linked in one of the above posts ITT)

That would be much appreciated.
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jamesbond

Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 2053
Location: The Blue Marble

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 03:51    Post subject: Re: Agreed- Should Ask
Subject description: Why Isn't the DEFAULT to Always Ask?
 

I usually don't answer to this kind of question, but today I loosen myself a little bit and swallow this bait.

Digital_Dissident wrote:
I just booted Wary Puppy 5.1.1 using a saved session file for the first time and, much to my chagrin, discovered this automatic saving of the session.
Much to your chagrin eh? Tell me which other mainline operating systems that do not automatically save session? (Ubuntu, Fedora, Windows, OSX, Solaris, AIX, Android, iOS, Symbian, etc)?

Quote:
Is there a reason it can't ask whether you'd like to save the session, the way it does when no saved session file was invoked at boot-up? (By default)
Because the default is, when I tell my wordprocessor to save my 200-page thesis, and the computer is *accidentally* turned off, I would expect that my thesis is still there when I restart it?

Quote:
(And also ask at the beginning whether or not to enable the periodic automatic saving that was mentioned in the other thread linked in one of the above posts ITT)

That would be much appreciated.
I don't disagree that ability not-to-save session is useful - in fact, I agree its useful. But to ask why it isn't the default, is the same of asking why the default desktop background color is blue (and not green), or why the default browser is seamonkey (and not firefox, opera, dillo, surfer, etc), etc.

It's because people use their systems differently, and the designer of the OS has to make a decision one way or another. You can't satisfy everyone. If this puppy's "bug" is "corrected" the way you want it, I (for one) will be the first one (and I'm sure I'm not the only one) who will ask - "why the &^%$##@ the OS ask me whether to save everytime I shutdown? Of course I want my changes to be saved, otherwise I will always boot from LiveCD".

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Sylvander

Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Posts: 3400
Location: West Lothian, Scotland, UK

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 04:55    Post subject:  

1. To prevent periodic [default is every 30 min] "saves" [actually a "copy"] back to a pupsave file on a [partition on a] Flash Drive.

2. When the pupsave is held on a Flash Drive:
What to do to be given the choice at shutdown "to save or not to save".


3. When the pupsave is on a HDD...
The following is so you can then use the methods in 1 & 2 above.
How to edit the isolinux.cfg file within a Puppy ISO file [used to make the "live" Puppy optical disk], so as to make the Puppy treat its pupsave on a HDD as though it were a pupsave on a Flash Drive.

4. See also this to further explain 3 above.

5. And see also this, which can/should be used PRIOR to making a pupsave file, as an alternative to the above methods.
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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 23 Mar 2011, 07:31    Post subject: Re: Session is 'always' saved -not good  

Dougal wrote:
dru5k1 wrote:
Puppy will save the session automatically at shutdown, unless you uncomment this action in /etc/rc.d/rc.shutdown - which results in an ugly Xorg error at each bootup
...
The rc.shutdown fix is an ugly one, and I think that Puppy should do this (no saving unless you say so) in a clean and tidy way

It's not that ugly... you can just add to rc.shutdown
Code:
rm /initrd/pup_ro1/etc/.XLOADED
...
It would be trivial to make this configurable (via the boot manager).


Oh, I hope you can explain what it does, I feel too dense just now to figure it out.

How does it relate to the links that Sylvander provide here above my post?

Should he add your solution to that list?

Don't get me wrong. I love to know this I am not critical or ironic or something. I really want to know how to decide when and how and so on to save.

Yes I should do back ups but I fail to do it.

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