Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

don570 · Joined: 10 Mar 2010 Posts: 3019 Location: Ontario

Subject: Password entry

I think the best and safest way is to ask the user what
kind of keyboard he has.

There are 3 basic categories of keyboards,
QWERTY, AZERTY and 'others' As far as inputing the basic key
characters all QWERTY keyboards are the same except that "German'
keyboards switch the y and z. From reading on wikipedia I believe
all AZERTY keyboards are the same if one restricts input to
the basic character set.

Many Asians use a QWERTY compatible keyboard.

So I've designed a password window that I think is usable and safe.
Download it and see what you think.
http://www.datafilehost.com/download-e3a808ab.html

People who don't have a compatible keyboard are told to go 'Back'.
They could also be told to choose "Shutdown' or 'Reboot'
from the start menu and go through the legacy method of entering a
password.

Once a person chooses his password, the password has to be
examined for 'bad' characters, then the accepted password is transposed to
simple ascii characters appropriate for the encoding process.

In the case of the QWERTY keyboard this is a simple procedure because of
the restriction on y and z (Although I don't know about Asian keyboards...
you're the expert there)

In the case of AZERTY keyboards the transposing would be difficult but
not impossible. I'll give a couple of examples

France would be transposed to Frqnce
John55 would be transposed to John%%
Jacques would be transposed to Jqcaues

I think this can be hidden from user so he doesn't become
confused.

Pupsaveconfig would be successful in keeping most computer
users away from the console mode. That would be a great step
forward for Puppy linux. Smile

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shinobar · Joined: 28 May 2009 Posts: 2367 Location: Japan

don570 · Joined: 10 Mar 2010 Posts: 3019 Location: Ontario

I hadn't thought about the situation a business or tourist who is
travelling from country to country where there is different keyboards.

So what I would do is explain this particular situation
to the AZERTY keyboard user, possibly giving him
an 'alternative' password to try in case of an emergency abroad.

But since the QWERTY keyboard is so dominant in the world,
I wouldn't even tell the QWERTY user about the problem. It would just
sow confusion in the mind. I am a North American so I know
how fragile the brain is. Wink

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don570 · Joined: 10 Mar 2010 Posts: 3019 Location: Ontario

What if AZERTY keyboard user was to forget his 'alternative' password?

i.e. forget that France transposes to Frqnce,

That could be another great feature of Pupsaveconfig!!

Just input the password and click on button "Alternative Password'
in case of emergency abroad and France would be transposed to Frqnce.
Neat!
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noryb009 · Joined: 20 Mar 2010 Posts: 525

Would it be easier to change the login script? It could first try what the user put in, then try to transpose it into QWERTY, then transpose the original to AZERTY format, and try that?

It would mean there are 3 different passwords that can get in, but it's still pretty safe.

Béèm · Posted: Wed 10 Nov 2010, 05:16 Post subject:

shinobar's post in the French forum draw my attention.
Indeed seeing the many possibilities with accented and special character those should be excluded and a message should be given if the password isn't made with the base alphanumeric characters.

For transparent for a user who travels, I think the password created should have somewhere an accompanying indicator on which keyboard that password is created.

When he comes on another PC with another keyboard, and when entering his password, the system should detect the user isn't at his normal keyboard. The user is encouraged to enter his password as he knows it and the system should convert to the other keyboard for evaluation.

shinobar · Joined: 28 May 2009 Posts: 2367 Location: Japan

Béèm · Posted: Wed 10 Nov 2010, 09:02 Post subject: Re: Keyboards in Brussels

shinobar · Joined: 28 May 2009 Posts: 2367 Location: Japan

Lobster · Posted: Wed 10 Nov 2010, 10:49 Post subject:

Once again we being offered the ability
to configure in our desktop environment.
Many thanks.
Good plan Cool

I found more info but not sure what to download?
http://shino.pos.to/linux/pupsave.html

The latest file I found is Jan 2010? Not right?
Sorry Embarassed

Béèm · Posted: Wed 10 Nov 2010, 12:05 Post subject: Re: Keyboards in Brussels

Bert · Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 915

This is what Belgian azerty looks like. Just slighlty different from the French azerty.

BTW -and off-topic- : Shinobar, Gent, that's where I live!

don570 · Joined: 10 Mar 2010 Posts: 3019 Location: Ontario

I previously wrote in my last post

Bert · Joined: 30 Jun 2006 Posts: 915

The problem is simple enough, but the solutions are indeed not easy at all.

Maybe one way out could be to present a small interactive generic keyboard on-screen? The user then has to click his/her password to access the encrypted save-file.Could even be an interface like seen on portable phones.Or just an alphabetic list of letters and numbers.
But of course I have no idea how realistic this is from the technical point of view.

don570 · Joined: 10 Mar 2010 Posts: 3019 Location: Ontario

To Bert

There has been some work done in this area (the virtual keyboard)
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?search_id=756078164&t=61144

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?search_id=957621040&t=37194

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I think the problem with booting up from a USB stick
in a different country would still remain. The transposing of the
password would still need to be done (I think ????)

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