Puppy Linux Discussion Forum Forum Index Puppy Linux Discussion Forum
Puppy HOME page : puppylinux.com
"THE" alternative forum : puppylinux.info
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The time now is Tue 02 Sep 2014, 22:19
All times are UTC - 4
 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Frugal or full install: which is best for me?
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
Page 2 of 2 [22 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2
Author Message
Mercedes350se

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 632

PostPosted: Sun 18 Jul 2010, 03:52    Post subject:  

looseSCREWorTWO

I wasn't sure if a frugal on the HD would work the way I wanted.

Exactly the information I needed.

Thank you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Sylvander

Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Posts: 3429
Location: West Lothian, Scotland, UK

PostPosted: Sun 18 Jul 2010, 04:27    Post subject:  

@looseSCREWorTWO
What a good post of Fri 16th you gave us. Very Happy
Really clear explanation of the situation. Cool

"unfortunately you lose control of "saves" when you install to a HD. Puppy goes into a different PUPSTATE and things are written directly to the HD as they happen. The geniuses who invented Puppy give the User more control over "saves" to a Flash Drive because of concerns that a Flash Drive may wear out quickly if treated the same as a HD."
I wish, I wish, I wish...
That just like when you use a pupsave on a Flash Drive...
A HDD install [frugal or full] would permit the user to [choose to] manually save DURING THE SESSION rather than auto-save.
And choose whether to save or not at shut-down.

Is it possible do you think?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
looseSCREWorTWO

Joined: 04 Feb 2010
Posts: 812
Location: Australia, 1999 Toshiba laptop, 512mb RAM, no HDD, 431 Retro & 421 Retro

PostPosted: Sun 18 Jul 2010, 08:15    Post subject:  

G'day Sylvander,
It MUST be possible. The Code is there, used whenever the PUPSTATE is set for a USB Flash install. But to get that Code working with a Frugal install on a HDD we'd need help from someone with top-notch Coding skills.

If someone was able to do this with a "stable" Puppy like 431 and it's Retro versions, it could be marketed as the "Safest Linux for Internet Shopping & Banking". Explaining WHY it's so much safer would be a challenge, though, especially to Windows users. And they would potentially be a HUGE market for such a thing.

At one stage I was using a SD Card (a form of Flash media) in an adaptor that plugged in to the Hard Disk connection of my Toshiba laptop. The Tosh lappie doesn't have a HDD, but with the SD Card plugged in there, it started BEHAVING like it was a HDD. This is a problem, because the constant "saves" will wear out an SD Card quick, just as they would wear out a USB Flash Drive real quick.

I tried to trick Puppy into treating it like a USB Flash Drive (by changing the boot code in menu.lst from pmedia=ataflash to pmedia=usbflash) but it didn't work. Puppy must have detected the SD Card was plugged in to the HD connection, and totally ignored my bullshit pmedia=usbflash line.

I mention this because one way to achieve what you want would be to try and persuade Puppy that the HDD is in fact a USB Flash Drive. My attempt at getting Puppy to treat an SD Card-in-ATA-adaptor as a USB Flash Drive didn't work because (I think) Puppy knew it was plugged-in to the ATA HD connection, not the USB Port.

I wonder if there's any way of persuading Puppy that an ATA Hard Drive connection is really a USB Port? If that were possible, then by changing the boot parameter from pmedia=atahd to pmedia=usbflash it should change the PUPSTATE and give you back control of "saves" during, and at the end of, each session.

Steve

_________________
Steve
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Mercedes350se

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 632

PostPosted: Mon 02 Aug 2010, 03:04    Post subject:  

Maybe this thread is a step in the right direction?

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=349102
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
looseSCREWorTWO

Joined: 04 Feb 2010
Posts: 812
Location: Australia, 1999 Toshiba laptop, 512mb RAM, no HDD, 431 Retro & 421 Retro

PostPosted: Mon 02 Aug 2010, 10:38    Post subject:  

Thanks for the info, but those guys are talking about pulling the Linux Kernel apart - which is way over my head. Sylvander's way to prevent Saves is better for me. It only works on Puppy 412 or later and only on USB Flash Installs, but the good thing is you don't need to be Einstein to make it work.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=384393#384393
http://www.pcguide.com/vb/showpost.php?p=446722&postcount=224

PS:
I don't think you're being paranoid to worry about security in relation to Internet Banking. The criminals who will try to steal personal info play a "numbers game" and because 95 percent of the world's computers were running Windows that's what the crooks targetted. However as Linux grows in popularity it will, unfortunately, attract attention from the crooks.

Hopefully before that happens, one of the Puppy Devs will create an Anti-Virus Pet that is simple to install, easy to update and allows us to have a decent Virus Scanner running in the background while we're using Puppy.

_________________
Steve
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 419
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Fri 06 Aug 2010, 08:32    Post subject:  

looseSCREWorTWO wrote:
I tried to trick Puppy into treating it like a USB Flash Drive (by changing the boot code in menu.lst from pmedia=ataflash to pmedia=usbflash) but it didn't work.
In standard Puppy 431 either "pmedia=ataflash" or "pmedia=ideflash" produces "PUPMODE=13", the same as for a USB flash drive, i.e. a "save" Icon appears on the screen, and data is only written to the pupsave file occasionally.

I know this because:
a) the code in initrd.gz does this.
b) I've done it with a frugal install of Puppy 431 on an ordinary HD.
c) I've done it with a frugal install of Puppy 431 on the SSD of an EeePC 701.

gyro
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
looseSCREWorTWO

Joined: 04 Feb 2010
Posts: 812
Location: Australia, 1999 Toshiba laptop, 512mb RAM, no HDD, 431 Retro & 421 Retro

PostPosted: Sat 07 Aug 2010, 01:15    Post subject:  

mmm,
the conditions you describe are not identical to mine. I was using:
- Puppy 431 Retro (different Kernel to Puppy 431)
- an SD Flash Card in an Adaptor "acting" as a HD
- my hardware (year-2000 P3 Toshiba laptop) would be different to yours

With my setup Puppy insisted on treating the SD Card like a HD, when I wanted it to be treated like a USB Flash Drive.

Thanks for the info though

_________________
Steve
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 2 of 2 [22 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.0596s ][ Queries: 12 (0.0049s) ][ GZIP on ]