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xvidtune changes won't stay[SOLVED-by vtpup]
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jrb


Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 1040
Location: Smithers, BC, Canada

PostPosted: Sat 22 Nov 2008, 13:58    Post subject:  xvidtune changes won't stay[SOLVED-by vtpup]
Subject description: How do I get xorg to remember adjustments?
 

HI,
I'm running puppy4.1.1 xorg7.3. When I boot with xorg my screen is slightly off the left side of the monitor. I can use xvidtune from the Setup-Xorg Video Wizard and adjust it easily enough and I have told it to write the changes to /etc/X11/xorg.conf and even checked to make sure its done so. But when I reboot its off the screen again, even though those changes are still listed in xorg.conf.

Anyone got any ideas?

Last edited by jrb on Mon 16 Feb 2009, 14:49; edited 1 time in total
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glassparrot


Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 285
Location: Durango, Colorado - USA

PostPosted: Mon 24 Nov 2008, 01:43    Post subject:  

Don't you have buttons on your monitor for this? It'd be safer to use those than to use xvidtune. I have burned out more than one CRT monitor because of adjusting those kinds of software settings improperly.
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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Fri 13 Feb 2009, 17:02    Post subject:  

NO. Buttons on the monitor is NOT a solution to an included program -- and essential part of system setup -- that doesn't work properly! Physical monitor controls are unable to fully correct this by left shifting.

Test case: Nvidia NV34 [GeForce FX 5500] type card. Dell E228WFP LCD 1680x1050 monitor has screen displaced far to right.

Xvidtune does allow shifting to the proper position, but does not (usually) save settings when "Show" is pressed.

This action has been reported several times in forum threads. I haven't even seen a good workaround yet in these forums. And no explanation of Puppy's method of using xorg,conf, xrandr, and the xorg script.

Does anyone actually know how Puppy uses or reads or modifies xorg.conf, or how Xvidtune manages to shift the screen?

Without that basic knowledge, it's impossible to understand what is needed to get this to work. I've already looked at half a dozen web explanations and man pages on xorg.conf, and none look similar to Puppy's. Puppy's is far more complex structurally, with a bunch of subsections and crossreferences -- but has only a single mode?!

Further Puppy has several versions of xorg.conf (at least on my computer) xorg.conf, xorg.conf0, xorg.conf.NVIDIA, xorg.conf.t2, xorg.conf.bak, xorg.conf.prev. I could understand one backup, but why the rest of them? What's xorg.conf.NVIDIA -- an active version in an nvidia system, or a template or what?

Back to Puppy's wizard script:

Puppy Xvidtune wizard popup at the end does show the correct modeline values that adjusting the controls has supposedly yielded:

Quote:
The new modeline is:
"1680x1050" 146.25 1680 1960 2136 2240 1050 1053 1059 1089 +hsync -vsync

Note, you will have to restart X for it to take effect. If it messes
up X, edit from commandline 'mp /etc/X11/xorg.conf' and comment-out
the 'UseModes' line (do not delete it) in the Monitor section.

To insert this into /etc/X11/xorg.conf, click 'Write' button...
To exit without changing xorg.conf, click 'Quit' button...


but for the first few times I tried this no modeline appears in the actual xorg.conf (relevant section printed below:
Code:
Section "Monitor"
   Identifier   "Monitor0"
   VendorName   "Monitor Vendor"
   ModelName    "Monitor Model"
   HorizSync    31.5-90
   VertRefresh  60
   #UseModes     "Modes0" #monitor0usemodes
   Option      "PreferredMode" "1680x1050"
   EndSection
   
Section "Modes"
   Identifier "Modes0"
   #modes0modeline0
EndSection

Section "Device"
   ### Available Driver options are:-
   ### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",
   ### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz"
   ### [arg]: arg optional
   #Option     "SWcursor"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "HWcursor"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "NoAccel"               # [<bool>]
   #Option     "ShadowFB"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "UseFBDev"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "Rotate"                # [<str>]
   #Option     "VideoKey"              # <i>
   #Option     "FlatPanel"             # [<bool>]
   #Option     "FPDither"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "CrtcNumber"            # <i>
   #Option     "FPScale"               # [<bool>]
   #Option     "FPTweak"               # <i>
   #Option     "DualHead"              # [<bool>]
   Identifier  "Card0"
   Driver      "nv" #card0driver
   VendorName  "nVidia Corporation"
   BoardName   "NV34 [GeForce FX 5500]"
   BusID       "PCI:1:0:0"
EndSection

Section "Screen"
   Identifier "Screen0"
   Device     "Card0"
   Monitor    "Monitor0"
    DefaultDepth 24
    Subsection "Display"
        Depth       24
        Modes       "1680x1050"
    EndSubsection
EndSection

#PuppyHardwareProfile=NVIDIA


However, on the last occasion I tried it, a changed xorg.conf was generated. Unfortunately it did nothing to correct the video problem -- either when re-starting X or rebooting:

Code:
Section "Monitor"
   Identifier   "Monitor0"
   VendorName   "Monitor Vendor"
   ModelName    "Monitor Model"
   HorizSync    31.5-90
   VertRefresh  60
   UseModes     "Modes0" #monitor0usemodes
   Option      "PreferredMode" "1680x1050"
   EndSection
   
Section "Modes"
   Identifier "Modes0"
 ModeLine "1680x1050"   146.25   1680 1960 2136 2240   1050 1053 1059 1089 +hsync -vsync #modes0modeline0
 
EndSection

Section "Device"
   ### Available Driver options are:-
   ### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",
   ### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz"
   ### [arg]: arg optional
   #Option     "SWcursor"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "HWcursor"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "NoAccel"               # [<bool>]
   #Option     "ShadowFB"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "UseFBDev"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "Rotate"                # [<str>]
   #Option     "VideoKey"              # <i>
   #Option     "FlatPanel"             # [<bool>]
   #Option     "FPDither"              # [<bool>]
   #Option     "CrtcNumber"            # <i>
   #Option     "FPScale"               # [<bool>]
   #Option     "FPTweak"               # <i>
   #Option     "DualHead"              # [<bool>]
   Identifier  "Card0"
   Driver      "nv" #card0driver
   VendorName  "nVidia Corporation"
   BoardName   "NV34 [GeForce FX 5500]"
   BusID       "PCI:1:0:0"
EndSection

Section "Screen"
   Identifier "Screen0"
   Device     "Card0"
   Monitor    "Monitor0"
    DefaultDepth 24
    Subsection "Display"
        Depth       24
        Modes       "1680x1050"
    EndSubsection
EndSection

#PuppyHardwareProfile=NVIDIA


This is not just a cosmetic bug, solvable by adjusting the physical monitor controls. It renders the right side of the display unusable. Adjusting the screen at every startup is not even a workaround solution if the screen has to be moved over twenty or thirty steps.

Let's figure this out.
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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Fri 13 Feb 2009, 17:49    Post subject:  

Got you, ya little sonofabug.

Change all instances of "1680x1050" in my example above to "bugswat" and restart X.

There are 3 of them. Solves it.

It's a naming convention issue.

Okay boys, fix it in 4.2.


ps.

as a guess....

"1680x1050" was probably the name of a VESA preset which took precedence over the xorg.conf entry.

Xvidtune and the puppy wizard should name custom modes to anything but the standard VESA resolution values.
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sun 15 Feb 2009, 05:40    Post subject:  

vtpup wrote:
"1680x1050" was probably the name of a VESA preset which took precedence over the xorg.conf entry.

Xvidtune and the puppy wizard should name custom modes to anything but the standard VESA resolution values.

modlines are usually (not in Puppy) named after the resolution+refresh rate. i.e "1680x1050_60".

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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Sun 15 Feb 2009, 11:31    Post subject:  

Yes Dougal, that would work.
I've checked in my Ubuntu installation and it's in this format:

"1680x1050@60"

which also works.

Though I'm wondering about who is "wrong" in all of this.

I read somewhere, I thought in an xorg.conf man page (there are several different versions online), that user set modelines would take precedence over the presets. If so. it might be a bug in xorg, since that doesn't actually happen.

Whether they meant it in terms of naming, or simply action by a different named mode, I'm not sure. But that's certainly enough to cause understandable confusion in the Puppy development.

Anyway, the fix is to rename.

I also think there is something else at work here -- the xvidtunes first three failures to write anything to xorg.conf.

I think that was a procedural error on my part using the puppy wizard component. The Wizard itself throws warnings and instructions that are somewhat ambiguous, and get overlayed with xvidtune messages.

This also ought to be walked through to see if it can be worded and integrated better.

The xvidtune wording of "show" doesn't make much sense as a write command, and then to leave xvidtune. it seems you shouldn't hit "quit" or changes are lost. I guess you have to hit the X in the upper right corner to get out of it with changes intact?

There's also a description saying you must confirm -- it's all pretty confusing. Needs straightening out.

I think I X-ed out of Xvidtune the time I was successful at writing a modeline to xorg.conf, while I hit "quit" the other couple of failed times. I had hit "show" before all exits. But that didn't seem to be enough.

My suspicion is that Puppy has modified or eliminated an actual showing of xorg.conf in the stock xvidtune, where you would normally be asked to confirm the change. That would explain the "show" button's name.
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mechmike

Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 103
Location: Pelham, AL

PostPosted: Sun 15 Feb 2009, 23:24    Post subject: Y'all are way over my head with all this, but...  

Here's my video dilemma...

I have installed Boxpup 4.1.2 on an ancient eMachines eOne. This has a built-in 15-inch CRT monitor with no physical adjustments possible.

The screen is shifted ~15mm to the left. I have a 15mm wide black band on the right, and the left side of whatever is displayed has about the first 15mm "cut off".

Running Xorg at 1024x768. This machine has a built-in 8MB ATI Rage graphics chip

What do I need to do to fix this? xvidtune doesn't seem to change anything (though I've been cautious...)

Thanks!
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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Sun 15 Feb 2009, 23:34    Post subject:  

First save a backup of your present /etc/X11/xorg.conf as /etc/X11/xorg.conf.old

Then, Menu>setup>xorg wizard>xvidtune. Follow instructions.

(Or if you've already done this skip that step and continue here:)

Open etc/X11/xorg.conf as text.

find all references to your resolution that look like this:

"1024x768"

(the part in red varies depending on your own resolution)

There should be 3 of these. If there aren't 3 of them, you did something wrong in xvidtune. Go back and do it again.

If there are 3 of them:

Change that name in all three to anything else you please -- I used "bugswat"

You could even use "1024x768mechmike"

Make sure it's in quotes, just like it was before.

Save the file, and close the editor.

Go to menu>Shutdown>Restart X Server

Enjoy.
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mechmike

Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 103
Location: Pelham, AL

PostPosted: Sun 15 Feb 2009, 23:54    Post subject:  

xvidtune doesn't change or move the display at all. I tried making it wider, narrower, and moving it left and right to no avail. Notrhing changes either when clicking Test or Write. I restarted X and nothing changed.
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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Mon 16 Feb 2009, 00:32    Post subject:  

Different problem then. Open a new thread.
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jrb


Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 1040
Location: Smithers, BC, Canada

PostPosted: Mon 16 Feb 2009, 14:48    Post subject:  

Thanks a lot vtpup,
Nice fix. Simple and it works. To sum up:

1. Open xvidtune from xorg wizard
2. Make appropriate changes
3. Click "Show"
4. X out of xvidtune (not "Quit")
5. Click "Write" in the next screen
6. Navigate to /etc/X11/xorg.conf and open as text
7. Change the 3 mentions of your preferred resolution (1280x1024 in my case) to something else (1280x1024jrb)
8. When you restart the changes are maintained.

Bravo
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Bruce B


Joined: 18 May 2005
Posts: 11130
Location: The Peoples Republic of California

PostPosted: Mon 16 Feb 2009, 23:01    Post subject:  

Vtpup,

I was going to offer my suggestion, considering I think my modeline works and all.

But temptation got the best of me and I 'bugswatted' the thing. Bugswatting works, it brought me from 1024x768 to 1280x1024 with no effort on my part.

Naturally, I put it back. But, least I can be counted among the xorg bugswatters, even if I don't know why it did what it did :)

Bruce

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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Tue 17 Feb 2009, 00:40    Post subject:  

Bruce,
I think that there are pre-built standard VESA resolutions in xorg and their names take the form "dotsacrossxdotsdown". So "1024x768" is a pre-existing name for a pre-built modeline.

If we try to enter a new custom modeline called "1024x768" with new values into xorg.conf, xorg ignores that and simply uses the pre-built modeline it keeps internally..

On the other hand, if we enter the new custom values into a modeline we call "foo1024x768" and put that into xorg.conf, xorg sees that as a non-standard configuration and accepts it, using it for the display.

I imagine the pre-builts are 480x640, 800x600, 1024x768 etc.

As long as we stay away from those names, we can alter our displays in xorg.conf.

Unfortunately, xvidtune doesn't know this, and attempts to write its adjusted custom modeline using the VESA standard prebuilt names.

Thus, making adjustments in xvidtune to the display creates modelines that get ignored, simply because they are named wrongly.
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Bruce B


Joined: 18 May 2005
Posts: 11130
Location: The Peoples Republic of California

PostPosted: Tue 17 Feb 2009, 22:37    Post subject:  

vtpup,

I adjust all with the monitor. The rest is experimental. Here is the theory I've come up with, but haven't tested it clear through.

1) use xvidtune to set the initial values

2) reboot, I find things changed, but not 1 for 1 to the xvidtune values

3) set xvidtune aside, it's done it's job

4) thereafter modify the appropriate values in xorg.conf until I get the results I want. The results are easy to verify. Do I get the H an V size and position I want. It doesn't matter what value it takes to get that. The important thing is the result.

Question: Because I haven't tested it clear through, what do you think?

Bruce

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vtpup


Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 1158
Location: Republic of Vermont

PostPosted: Wed 18 Feb 2009, 11:07    Post subject:  

Hi Bruce,
I think we are seeing different actions by xvidtune -- it must be either different Puppy versions (mine is 4.1.2) and if I remember correctly you are running 4.0.x, or it is some installation idiosyncrasy of either of ours.

In my use of xvidtune, the following action occurs. My "normal" unadjusted monitor, with controls centered shows a screen badly offset to the right -- I lose about 20% of the screen:

1.) I open the xvidtune program and use the "Left" button to center the image on my screen. I cannot use the monitor's physical buttons to fully correct the screen because they do not have enough range. (Plus, I multi-boot, and the other OS's don't need the same adjustment)
So I do not use the monitor's physical buttons to correct the screen at all. I use the xvidtune Left button to do it.

2.) After saving the new modeline to xorg.conf through some "show" and exit button maneuvering (see steps listed earlier) and exiting xvidtune.

3.) I then restart X. Despite the new modeline created by xvidtune in xorg.conf, the monitor screen has returned to its old off-center displacement. I can open xorg.conf and see the new (correct) modeline, but it has no effect on screen position.

4.) If I rename the modeline in xorg.conf, and then restart x, the screen suddenly is correctly positioned. The modeline is now being used instead of ignored.

Now if I am understanding you correctly, you have a different action:

1.) You open xvidtune and adjust your screen position with the software controls. You exit xvidtune and it saves a modeline to xorg.conf.

2.) You restart X. Your screen seems to have been affected by the new modeline, but it is not quite in the same position that it was when you adjusted it in xvidtune.

3.) You propose changing the values in the modeline by hand in order to more accurately reflect the screen position you want.

The BIG differences in what we are seeing, is that in my case the modeline is totally ignored, unless I change its name. But once I change its name, it is exactly what I adjusted the screen to in xvidtune

In your case, the modeline is not ignored, but the values it contains do NOT represent what you adjusted xvidtune to do visually.

I think it is important to note a possible area of confusion for everyone. The part of the modeline in quotes is a name, a label. It has no numeric effect on actual resolution. So if it is named "1024x768" the individual pixel numbers mean nothing to xorg. It is the entire label "1024x768" which is seen as just a name.

To xorg, the name "1024x768" is, however special. It is the name of a preset internal modeline. If you use that name, but give it special changed parameters in a custom modeline (like those generated by xvidtune), those parameters will be ignored, and the internal preset parameters will prevail.

The name "1024x568" is NOT special to xorg, so it will accept the parameters associated with that name. If those parameters result in a screen with 1600 x 1200 pixels. it doesn't care, it just accepts the values and displays a 1600 x 1200 screen. If the parameters are set for a 800 x 600 screen, that's also what you will see. Same thing for screen position.

Does this make sense?
Does it explain the actions you are experiencing?
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