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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
Muppy 008.4c (final release)
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13642
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 17:55    Post subject:  Muppy 008.4c (final release)
Subject description: mini system with optional 6 Gb of software
 

Muppy-Mini is a small, modified version of Puppy.
It is only 150 MB.
It includes Abiword, Opera and mplayer.

The main difference to Puppy is, that I replaced almost all programs and libraries with the latest versions from Slackware 12.1 and the patches from GnomeSlackbuild.org.

This allows you, to install all the modern programs from the Slackware repositories using the packagemanager "gslapt".

You also can use most software compiled for Puppy 4, though Muppy originally was based on Puppy 3.
The integrated Backup tool makes it easy to restore your system, in case you break something.

MInI = MODULAR SYSTEM
Some people do not like, to install many packages manually.
So we have created "addons.sfs", an optional 400 MB addon file, with many libraries, codecs and programs.
So you have grafics accelleration, the 3D compiz desktop, Wine 1.1.4 to run Windows Programs.
It also includes Firefox, several Chat programs (pidgin, ayttm), media players and Gimp.
Even more exotic things are included, like Java and Samba.

The libraries in addons.sfs even allow you, to use other extensions, that include the huge desktops KDE 3.5.10 and Gnome 2.22.3.

We also created an office.sfs with Adobes Acrobat Reader and OpenOffice 3 rc1 (will be replaced in october with the final version).

Muppy has a limit, you can use just 3 addons at once.
So I also created a 1.5 GB addon, that includes all others.
So Muppy-mini, addons.sfs and megapack.sfs give you a Puppy, that consists of 6 GigaByte (uncompressed size) of programs!

MUPPY-LIVE
Muppy-Live is a 800 MB CD.
It combines Muppy-Mini, addons.sfs, games.sfs and Office.sfs in one system, that can be run directly from CD.
I recommend to use this version, if you plan a full harddrive install.
In general, I do NOT recommend full harddrive installs.
But on some very old hardware, it can perform better, than the recommended frugal installation.
Muppy-Live is suited better for the full installation, as it includes all Kernel modules in the main sfs file.
This is different to the Mini, that has them in a seperate "zmsy" (zdrv) file, that is not installed in full installations.

GNOME/KDE
Both Desktops are optional.
I reworked the KDE menusystem, to get a nicely categorized menu with Puppys programs included.
The Gnome integration is not as good as the KDE support.
In Gnome, several programs are listed in "lost+found".
Some system programs like the usermanager do not work.
These issues are very difficult to solve, I hope we can do this together for the next release. I could need help here.

Download:
You can get everything from.
ftp://ks301128.kimsufi.com/Muppy0084/final/C/

UPDATE:
the download no longer is valid, get new information here:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=255118#255118


The folders are seperated in "Live" and "Mini", and also in "english" and "german".
The folder "Addons-Common" includes the optional extensions like Gnome/KDE. They are multilanguage.

Hints (from reports in this thread)

- install the ServicePack.pet before you shutdown and save.
Simply download it with your webbrowser, and click on it in the filemanager, to install it.

- If you cannot get your wireless network up, please update the network wizard:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=235057#235057

- if you use the DVD-edition, type in a consolewindow:
update-desktop-database
That fixes some mime-links.

I want to thank all those people, wo gave me valuable feedback in the older "0084beta" thread.
I think I could fix many issues, but certainly not all.
Please let me know, if your problems were solved, or if further investigatiion is required.
Special thanks go to ttuuxx and wolfpup, who created several packages, which I incorporated.
And of course to Plinej, Zigbert, HairyWill, Barry and all the others for utilities like Pburn, Pnethood or Puppy itself.

The official homepage will be updated somewhen in october, when the updated version 0084D is released with OpenOffice3 final.
To get a general overview over Muppy, you may want to visit it, despite it still describes version 0083:
http://minisys-linux.de/

We also plan to create new versions of "embryo" and "server" within the next month.

Mark

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Last edited by MU on Tue 09 Dec 2008, 19:53; edited 7 times in total
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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 20:16    Post subject:  


Moin Mark
Smart Cool

Hope you enjoyed your recent trip

I am downloading the live edition.
The last edition of Muppy I tried was excellent, looked good and felt solid but had many differences to Puppy that I knew would confuse me (it doesn't take much)

You seem to have a fast server - looks like the download is only going to take 10 minutes . . .

The Slackware compatibility (which for good reasons were partially abandoned in Puppy 4.xx) makes this a sustainable - I was going to say puplet . . . but it is a true fork Cool

As Barry retires [wipes away tear] I am keen on working out new possibilities.

I know this is one.
Will let you know how I get on Smile

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Last edited by Lobster on Wed 17 Sep 2008, 03:09; edited 1 time in total
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13642
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 20:23    Post subject:  

Moin Ed Smile
I was away only for 2 days.
You can find a link to fotos at bottom of this thread:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=32575

I did not post much in the last days, as I was busy in updating and fixing Muppy.
I'm also in contact with someone, wo creates a simplified, cut down version of Live.
This gives me important hints to make it easier for people in future, to create customized versions, or what menu-entries might be removed for more simplicity.
And I worked on the buildsystem for easier localization (follows tomorrow).
So a lot of work "behind the scene".

Mark

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
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PostPosted: Tue 16 Sep 2008, 21:58    Post subject:  

Smile

Well I am in Muppy Live
It connected to the Ethernet DHCP automagically
That's good

It also tried to use compiz, then decided my graphic card (from Sage) was not up to it and booted up easily enough. I will switch over to my Nvidia card which should enable compiz.
Something to look forward to . . .

The desktop reminded me of Knoppix - you get EVERYTHING
As ever you get more with Puppy
I disabled the desklet, conky and switched to JWM
Much simpler (for me)
Muppy is highly customisable.
A lot of software, games. themes, OpenOffice 3
- you name it, Muppy has it

Am I right that if I have 1 Gig of ram - the whole thing will run from ram?
I only have 512MB but the speed of pulling from DVD was OK
much faster than other 'live' DVD's
(tip: if you have a DVD burn Puppy/Muppy to DVD - not CD as they are faster)

My next task is to switch to Firefox (hey it is there - Opera, Seamonkey and Firefox), install Xara and play bubbles again . . .
update: Firefox 3.1 crashed at its first glimpse of the BBC's site
As you know this is probably the latest Flash . . . Can not be bothered to sort out.
Opera has no spell checker. Now using Seamonkey quite happily . . .

I look forward to other peoples impressions.

This really deserves a wider usage and adoption.
Is Muppy on Distrowatch, Digg or any other publicity rounds?
m m m . . .

It amazes me how much work and possibilities exist in Muppy.
I look forward to the simplified Live CD.

Wonderful Very Happy

Woof! Woof!

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Last edited by Lobster on Wed 17 Sep 2008, 03:05; edited 1 time in total
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otropogo
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PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 00:31    Post subject: Muppy-Live and Mini-Muppy ISOs both failed checksum
Subject description: downloaded Live and Mini En, had to stop download and move partials, resumed and failed md5sum
 

@MU

Hi Mark. Have just finished downloading Mini-Muppy and Muppy LIve, and both have failed the checksum.

I had a problem with storage because I mistakenly set gFTP to save to my 2fs file (mnt/hda1) ran out of space and had to stop the download, move the partials to /mnt/home (I have trouble keeping this straight), and resume the downloads.

They finished without any error messages, but the md5sum was completely different.

Any idea what happened? Does it mean I have to toss them and start over?

I downloaded the Muppy-Mini ISO a second time, and this download passed checksum. But the two downloads report exactly the same byte count in properties...

If I burn Muppy Live to CD or DVD, is there any way to check the file integrity after the burn?
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 4784
Location: GB

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 04:56    Post subject:  

Genius strikes again! That's not a "mini", Mark. You seem to have squeezed more into your mini than a lot of major distros manage in four times the .iso .

Very difficult to find much to comment about. A few opportunities to learn a little German in the English version(!), the poweroff issue remains - as with most recent Puppy releases, no xmms for really intractable multimedia, 'live' won't overburn on any of my CD s, and I prefer System Stats or HardInfo to XProc. No showstoppers there, though.

Well done and many thanks, Mark.

Update: the liveDVD is awesome. Tried to do a FULL install but got looping during final boot stages. Seen this before. GRUB seems OK. First line of looping text mentions <touch>, but some problem with starting X - can't read it nor stop scrolling. Will try to fix this but it's not really my forte.
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13642
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 10:09    Post subject:  

sage:
Did you use a 800 MB CD?
i have none here at moment, so I cannot try it on my own.
Pburn showed a size of 791 MB for the german LiveCD, the english one is smaller.
So they should fit on a 800 MB CD?
If not, I had to remove something, but what? The games maybe?

----------------
Please could you tell me, where you encountered german texts?
If will check that and re-upload a version with english texts this weekend, or create a servicepack.pet then.
-----------------
Concerning the error with full installations:
can others confirm that?
Is it a general bug, or maybe hardware specific?
I think I made no changes here, and for the beta there were reports, that full installations worked.
I'd like to get an idea, what might cause your error.
----------------
poweroff: In grub, I use the option: acpi=force
Then my old Pentium 700 powers off at shutdown.
----------------
Lobster
the Live CD would load to Ram, if you had 1 GB of Ram.
If you have less, please try the mini, or let it copy msy_084.sfs to your harddrive for faster access when you create the savefile.

BBC, Firefox crash: oh yes, I can reproduce this.
Please use flash 9:
In the startmenu - "internet" - "activate Flash in your web browser"
That works for me.
Flash 10 in muppy is rc2, but rc1 has the same bug. Hope Adobe fixes it for the final version.
----------------
otropogo

If the checksum is wrong, you need to re download.
For such big files, I recommend wget.
Like:
cd /mnt/hda5/downloads
wget -c ftp://ks301128.kimsufi.com/Muppy0084/final/C/Live-english/Muppy-Live-008.4c-EN.iso


Thanks, Mark

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esmourguit


Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1288
Location: Sur l'ile aux oiseaux.

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 10:41    Post subject:  

Bonjour,

Hello Mark,
I've downloded MuppyMini iso without trouble.
I began translating Muppy Mini in french, but it seems gnumeric is missing. There is an icon on desktop but i've search for gnumeric with no success.
I noticed Tkdiff doesn't work. It start well, but it failed when clicking on OK button.

Cordialement Wink

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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 4784
Location: GB

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 10:44    Post subject:  

I was just looking for something to say, Mark! Otherwise I was blown away by your remarkable gifts.
Don't have any 800 s so used a DVD-RW, not much difference in price. After all, I stick Dingo onto 700 CD s, so 87% of that is wasted.
Yes, acpi=force is my favourite utility!
During booting, "puppyselect ......laus???..."
and after k/b selection:
Richte Netzwerkkarten
weitere...
But I wouldn't loose any sleep over it - it'll do some folks good to realise that this is not an English, as in England, work (although I often wonder what an Englishman is - Saxe-Coberg-Goethe and all that sort of thing!)

The looping thing may be because I'm only offering 398Mb of memory, or because I didn't scrape all the BSD out of the MBR before re-partitioning. Lots of things to try, but I seem to remember it as a Muppy feature??
If you can ask me some very simple questions, utilities to use, files to examine, I don't promise, but I can try to help locate the cause.

Later. When I installed the liveDVD, I was running in Xorg mode with nv drivers and CP active. THis may have been a little too much? What I did: run the CD in pfix=ram, run in XVESA, copy over the X11 files from DVD to HD. It didn't work - still loops.
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Lobster
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PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 11:22    Post subject:  

Quote:
the Live CD would load to Ram, if you had 1 GB of Ram.


I knew it!
I will have to upgrade Confused

Quote:
. . .or let it copy msy_084.sfs to your harddrive for faster access when you create the savefile.


My 14GB hard drive was too full but will do this, as soon as I clear my
stock of sardine videos . . .

One of the things is some deamons appear on the JWM taskbar - I think it is the weather - two daemons appear with clouds . . .

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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13642
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 11:39    Post subject:  

esmourguit

gnumeric is in addons.sfs (for the Mini) and in Muppy-Live.
Version 1.8.2 has become too huge to be incorporated in the Mini.
A french translation PET for Muppy follows in some days, GW already did most of the job Smile

Sage
german: i tink I know, will be just one of the startup files, easy to update.
I'll prepare a fix for the weekend.

The full install problem is more difficult.
I will have to try it here on my own machine, maybe I can reproduce the error.
I hope I can find out the reason this week.

Mark

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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13642
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 11:46    Post subject:  

Lobster:

Startmenu - utilities - Muppydesklets
There ou can disable them.

If that des not work, please remove "a-muppydesklets-" from the "autostart".
Click on the autostart icon on your desktop.
Move "a-muppydesklets-" to the folder "off".

To stop the already running desklets, right click the icon in the tray -> stop daemon.

Mark

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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 12:22    Post subject:  

More: I cleaned the HD with a debug script, started Mini with pfix=ram, FULL install to a 4.1Gb main partition (is this sufficient?) and rebooted. GRUB OK, but
Uncompressing Linux....OK, booting the kernel
Kernel Panic - not syncing: no int found. Try passing init= option to kernel

Any suggestions for suitable 'options' , please?
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 12:27    Post subject:  

sage, can you please post your menu.lst?
4.1 GB are ok.
A full LiveCD contains approx. 2.1 Gb.
Mark

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otropogo
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PostPosted: Wed 17 Sep 2008, 12:51    Post subject:  

MU wrote:
...
otropogo

If the checksum is wrong, you need to re download.
For such big files, I recommend wget.
Like:
cd /mnt/hda5/downloads
wget -c ftp://ks301128.kimsufi.com/Muppy0084/final/C/Live-english/Muppy-Live-008.4c-EN.iso


Thanks, Mark


Thanks Mark. Have just downloaded it again with wget, averaging 347KB/sec., and it passed md5sum check.

Some additional questions for you:

1. a recent post by Sage suggests (I may have misunderstood) the Muppy Live ISO may not fit on a CDR, but must be burned to DVD, and another poster has suggested that it will run much faster from DVD. Would appreciate your comments/suggestions on this issue.

2. can Muppy Mini load and run as a frugal install in 160MB of RAM?

3. Can Muppy Live also be installed as a frugal (I don't have 1GB of RAM available on any of my desktop machines)? If so, does the addon.sfs have to be in the same vfat partition as the main files, or can it be on another partition or on removable media (ie. pcmcia_flash or CD/DVD)?

4. if installed as frugal in tandem with another frugal Puppy, how does Muppy Mini need to be stored on the host partition in order to boot from DOS without GRUB?

I've never been able to get Grub working on my laptop (it insists on trying to boot from the Linux partition, and won't look for the frugal files) , and currently use the following batch file in DOS to boot Puppy 3.01 Retro:

Code:
LINLD.COM image=vmlinuz initrd=initrd.gz "cl=root=/dev/ram0 PMEDIA=idehd acpi=on"


IIRC, I've been told this will still work if I move the Linux files to folders one level below root on idehd, but haven't yet tried it. If this is true, will I get a prompt asking which version I want to boot, or will I need modified DOS batch files for each frugal Pup?
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