First Skype. Now Gizmo

What features/apps/bugfixes needed in a future Puppy
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Aitch
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#21 Post by Aitch »

@Lobster

I find the change of thread title, nearly as confusing as whether the god/dess exists, saga

aside/BTW:
Did you hear about the dyslexic, agnostic, insomniac?...............

He stayed awake all night trying to figure out if dog exists


end/meanwhile, back at the ranch......

I mean, the thread starts out about almost development progress and a need to chat about things generally

anyone else?

Aitch

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Lobster
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#22 Post by Lobster »

Aitch wrote:@Lobster
I find the change of thread title, nearly as confusing as whether the god/dess exists, saga
Tell me about it . . .
Use Gizmo or skype :)
Puppy Raspup 8.2Final 8)
Puppy Links Page http://www.smokey01.com/bruceb/puppy.html :D

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Re: true ... no video in Gizmo for Linux version yet

#23 Post by mcewanw »

mcewanw wrote: I haven't tested gizmo out much myself yet (other than the record message and test numbers) so can't comment on the crashes that some have experienced. It hasn't crashed for me the little I've used it so far.
Gizmo doesn't seem to crash most of the time on my system s (on two machines Puppy 4.00 and Puppy 2.17.1). However, I find (in Puppy 2.17.1 at least) that if I push the fifth icon button to the right near the bottom of the screen, it crashes. I have no idea what half of these buttons are for or I'd describe the problem one better. Just try them and see for yourself (maybe), and avoid it later...

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HairyWill
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#24 Post by HairyWill »

surprise surprise, I'm hairywill
that button is for preferences
you can also access preferences from the menu
both methods cause a crash for me in puppy 4.00

Code: Select all

# gizmo 
gizmo_segv_handle: signum: 11 - SIGSEGV in_segv: 1
gizmo_segv_handle: PID: 8396
gizmo_segv_handle: Exiting..# 
Will
contribute: [url=http://www.puppylinux.org]community website[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6c3nm6]screenshots[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/6j2gbz]puplets[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/57gykn]wiki[/url], [url=http://tinyurl.com/5dgr83]rss[/url]

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Selecting Preferences crashes Dingo

#25 Post by mcewanw »

@HairyWill

Yep, I'd worked out what the button was for, because on Puppy Linux 2.17.1, it actually works (well, it crashed on leaving Preferences, but only the first time I used it. Since then I haven't been able to make Gizmo crash on Puppy 2.17.1). However, I tried it on Dingo again, and it crashes every time; never gets as far as opening the Preferences window.

I don't have broadband or I'd check both of charni's dotpets in Dingo to see if they do the same thing. Actually, I still have one of his two gizmo dotpets still (the one for libstdc++6). I'm hoping the libstdc++5 one might make a difference, though I'm just hoping... with no reason to imagine that should make any difference. But why Dingo and not Puppy 2.17.1 and what about Tombh's WNOP based on 3.01?

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seems to work without crashing in Puppy 2.17.1

#26 Post by mcewanw »

After checking and verifying the Preferences crash problem with Dingo, I rebooted to Puppy 2.17.1 to see how it was there. Although I thought I had experienced a crash in Puppy 2.17.1 when leaving the Gizmo preferences dialog, the effect was very different to that in Dingo. I think now that it hadn't actually crashed on that earlier Pup 2.17.1 occasion, but instead Gizmo was waiting for some internet communication before shutting down. Anyway, one thing for sure is that Gizmo is not crashing at all, as far as I can see, when run on Puppy version 2.17.1, but it crashes everytime under Dingo when Preferences is selected...

I also tried charnisingh's gizmo...stdlibc++6 version, and it crashed in the same way when run under Dingo.

Not having broadband I'm reluctant to download charni's gizmo...stdlibc++5 version to try, but if anyone else has the time to do that it would be good to know if it crashes on Dingo too (assuming it runs on Dingo; charni seems to suggest Dingo has the stdlibc++5 lib too; I haven't checked). Anyway, it "seems" to be a Puppy 4.00 problem rather than a gizmo one according to the above results. I'll be interested to know what tombh reports back about running gizmo on his wnop version.

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#27 Post by Caneri »

Hi All,

I am running a test of gizmo-project-3.1.0.79-req.libstdc++5.pet from Charni's original .pet on tronkel's 2.16CE.

Hooray...it all works and no crash. The menus are all visible and function as they should. I didn't try the voice or my headset yet but this combination is very nice. I always did like Jack's 2.16CE.

Great!
Eric
[color=darkred][i]Be not afraid to grow slowly, only be afraid of standing still.[/i]
Chinese Proverb[/color]

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no libstdc++6 on 2.16?

#28 Post by mcewanw »

Caneri wrote:Hi All,
I am running a test of gizmo-project-3.1.0.79-req.libstdc++5.pet from Charni's original .pet on tronkel's 2.16CE.
Hooray...it all works and no crash.
I presume that 2.16 and earlier don't have libstc 6?
Otherwise, I'd imagine that gizmo...libstdc++6.pet would work without crashing on that system too, since it does so on 2.17.1

The problem seems to be with Puppy 4.00. I suspect that it may be something to do with the gtk2 library version used in dingo, but I'm just guessing. I might try using the gtk2 lib from Puppy 2.17.1 in Dingo, though maybe that combination won't work at all. I'll try that tomorrow and report back; not that it is a solution, but it would be good to know what is causing the problem with gizmo in Dingo.

Actually, it would really be great if someone could try that libstd++5 version in Dingo, just to see if that is a solution. I could easily rebuild a less than 10 MByte version of that version thereafter if it charni's one happened to work. I just don't want to download that by dialup unless it proves worthwhile in the end. Still, my gut feeling is that won't solve the Dingo/gizmo crash problem anyway.

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#29 Post by Caneri »

@Aitch,

olo...rats..lol ;-)
[color=darkred][i]Be not afraid to grow slowly, only be afraid of standing still.[/i]
Chinese Proverb[/color]

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#30 Post by smokey01 »

I have the same problem with Gizmo crashing in puppy 4.0. The bigger problem is now it won't run at all. It reports "GDB could not be found on your system".

Anyway I uninstalled it through package manager then re-installed it, same problem. I guess there are parts of the software that wern't removed as it still remembered my username and password :cry:

I might give Charni version a try and see what happens.

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#31 Post by smokey01 »

I have just uninstalled mcewanw cut down version and installed charni 15M version and to my disappointment it reports the same problem.

"GDB not found on your system". I have just discovered this is a debugging program, not actually part of the gizmo package. :cry:

I am no wiser to what the actual error is except it says it's unexpected.

Anyone got any ideas?

I might try it booting from the CD in case my frugal install has been corrupted.

Charni if you see this I wouldn't mind trying your SFS version. Does it include both orbit and Gconf?

Thanks

charnisingh
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gizmo

#32 Post by charnisingh »

Dear Smokey-1,

please uninstall it completely and manually also and make sure there are no traces lef of gizmo or its dependencies.

install again in this order first-GConf2 then orbit2 and lastly gizmo-project
or best is to use fresh save file

as for as sfs file i have to look into and i will post here again
no i have not uploaded gizmo sfs file so far.

the minimum gizmo containing sfs file i have with me is about 64 mbs as it contains beside gizmo -complete ,
is skype-complete , vlc, xmms,
mplayer and audacity.

the other one containing gizmo-complete is quite big as it contains all my applications which i tried in puppy 4 but it should work from 2.14 onwards it is about 334 mbs. but i have not uploaded any these.

I UNDERSTAND MANY WHO ARE TRYING TO USE GIZMO FIND IF THEY TRY TO CONFIGURE SOME THING WHICH I DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT
AND TOUCH PREFFERENCE BUTTON GIZMO CRASHES, IT IS TRUE AS THERE IS NOTHING TO CONFIGURE FROM PREFFERENCE BUTTON. GIZMO
MAKES ALL THE ADJUSTMENTS AT THE TIME OF REGISTERATION AT THE FIRST TIME CONNECTION AND THE PREFFERENCE BUTTON BECOMES REDUNDANT, SO DO NOT TOUCH THAT BUTTON, OTHERWISE IT IS LIKELY TO CRASH. IN THE NEW VERSION WHICH I USE IN WINDOWS, THEY HAVE REMOVED THAT BUTTON.

let us hope William may come up with a better solution.

thanks and regards.

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Gizmo crashing and the "no GDB message"

#33 Post by mcewanw »

smokey01 wrote:I have just uninstalled mcewanw cut down version and installed charni 15M version and to my disappointment it reports the same problem.

"GDB not found on your system". I have just discovered this is a debugging program, not actually part of the gizmo package. :cry:
OK. I can clear a couple of things up here.

First of all, as far as anyone has reported, there is only one crash occurring with gizmo, and that is in Puppy 4.00 Dinglo. If you try to select Preferences from either File->Preferences, or from the "Preferences" button, gizmo will crash. This occurs whether you use my dotpet or charni's.

When the crash occurs you will get one of two messages (as far as I know).

1. If you are not doing any development work, and don't have the devx_400.sfs loaded up, then the debugger gdb won't be present, so the message you will get when gizmo crashes is: "GDB not found on your system"
Gizmo has nothing to do with gdb not being on your system; it has not corrupted gdb...

2. If you have devx_400.sfs and thus gdb present, the crash message you will see instead is:
"Gizmo Project has quit unexpectedly" etc...

If you don't try and change Preferences settings, the crash does not occur and Gizmo should work fine for you. So, if you are using Puppy 4.00, just don't try and change preferences. It is no big deal.

If you really want to change preferences, anyway, you can do so manually if you wish. You will find all the individual settings in various xml text files inside the following location:

/root/.gconf/apps/gizmo/settings

But I'd suggest backing up the original of any such file before trying to edit manually, for obvious reasons.

Second Point:

There is no major difference between charni's dotpet and my one, except that mine is smaller to download by about 4.5 MByte, which means that its installed size is about 9 MBytes less. So how is it smaller? Well, the executables are identical (they are provided from the gizmo website (we don't compile them), but I have stripped them of unnecessary debugging info. Also, charni, had accidentally duplicated two folders containing exactly the same files. I fixed that, which gave a further space saving. That's all; the two dotpets should work exactly the same.

Finally, when you use petget manager to remove the dotpet, the config files that gizmo itself creates are left behind. They are just simple text files (in xml format), and take up almost no space and I can't imagine that there is any way they could corrupt your system's operation. Leaving behind profile info is very common (mozilla and firefox also do that) - useful if you then reinstall later or upgrade since you don't need to type in all the profile info again.

After uninstalling gizmo you can always remove these small leftovers profiles manually if you wish. As far as I can see they consist of the following directories (i.e. folders):

/root/.gizmo
/root/.gizmo-cache
/root/.gconf

I can't guarantee anything; I didn't write the gizmo application. Rather, like charni, I just put it into a dotpet container for use on Puppy. However, I don't myself think that you have a lot to worry about. In view of the above details, Gizmo crashing in dingo is just a minor inconvenience IMO.

I hope the above helps address your concerns.

I would be grateful if someone would try charni's gizmo...stdlibc++5 version in dingo as an alternative to the stdlibc++6 version to see if it crashes too on selecting Preferences. I expect it will. As I've said, I suspect the version of the gtk2 libs in Dingo somehow don't behave with gizmo (though that is just my guess). I still plan to try the gtk2 libs version from Puppy 2.17.1 in dingo, since there are no crashes in 2.17.1. I'll let you know later if I have any success with that experiment.

Happy Gizmo-ing!

William

charnisingh
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gizmo

#34 Post by charnisingh »

Tanks William,

you did a better job explaining the crash, actually one does not gain any thing by touching that button.

i have just uploaded sfs of gizmo which is inly about 13 mbs. for some who wanted it. it is complete in itself and one does not have to bother with its install.

i think it is pointless to test gizmo-project-stdc++5 for only to check
crash, as it would. gizmo5 version 4.xxxx does have that button any
more.

thanks and regards.

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Re: gizmo

#35 Post by mcewanw »

charnisingh wrote: i think it is pointless to test gizmo-project-stdc++5 for only to check crash, as it would.
Good to hear you have produced an sfs charni.

I still think it is worth trying the stdc++5 version; we only assume it will crash too. Do remember that pressing the Preferences button DOES NOT cause a crash in either Puppy 2.17.1 (or in 2.16CE according to Caneri). I'd try the stdc++5 version myself were it not for the time it would take me to download that one too via dialup (I may yet if no other kind soul does). After all it is very easy to backup a pup_save file and test things like this.

Anyway, the crash problem is hardly a big issue and no doubt the next version of gizmo for Linux will fix it one way or the other (by not having the Prefs button being one way!)

I did by the way try using the Puppy 2.17.1 version of libgtk-x11-2.so.0 in Dingo. It was just a shot in the dark. I hoped Dingo but they do have slightly different kernels (2.6.21.5 in Pup2.17.1 and 2.6.21.7 in dingo). There is probably more to it than that (compiler version libs and so on maybe, I don't know...) Well, Dingo did start up and go into X okay and the JWM menu bar was there, but nothing else (!) and apps wouldn't run with that substitute library. Not so surprising I suppose. Oh well, nothing won, nothing lost there... :-)

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#36 Post by Lobster »

Ok been trying to send voice mail with Gizmo . . .

so far have sent to: Charni, Tom, William Mcewan, Will Davies and Eric
If that works it is VERY useful. It is a charged facility in Skype and works as an internet international voice messaging service.

I have just got my family interested and involved in Skype - going over to Gizmo may be a bit much
However Gizmo do have a phone and SMS service that might temp them :)

Gizm might be Geeks only - the sound quality is acceptable but Skype sound quality is digital - very high quality 8)

My sister had her Skype on and got a surprise call from long lost relatives from Canada (where ever that is)

Do leave me a voice message - if you get gizmo working and I will reciprocate - if all is working :)

Update:
Just had a brief conversation with Hairywill but he was absconded by a lurking wife . . .
The sound quality was high - children and family mayhem in the background! (not low as I first reported) I was taking the voice mail message as an indication of quality . . .

"We have the technology"
I have also been trying to install gizmo on my xandros based Eeepc
(yes I should be running Pupeee - but I am too stupid to work it out - have major difficulties with that despite great support)

I have also noticed something called 'the sun' and I might have to unplug from the internet. Not sure where the switch is though . . . :)

OK next plan is gizmo on a Macintosh
then some contacting Windows users (treat them as if they are human - it lulls them into a false sense of security) :)
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gizmo for older pups in a much smaller install/download size

#37 Post by mcewanw »

Since my previous posts I have downloaded the stdlibc++5 version of gizmo from the gizmo-project website, partly because I wanted to double check if that one would crash in Dingo too, but also because some older Puppy versions will work with it. (Caneri tested charni's stdlibc++5 version in 2.16CE with no crashes at all, so this new one should perform identically, but with the advantage of a much smaller download and install size). It does however still crash in Puppy 4.00 (Dingo) should the user try to access Preferences...

Again, this dotpet has the exact same functionality as charni's, but by stripping the debugging code out of its binaries and removing some duplicated files this new dotpet is once again much smaller: approximately 9 MByte download (so 18 MBytes once installed - so a big final saving of around 9 or 10 MBytes install size).

You'll find it with my other offering (the gizmo...stdlibc++6 version for Puppy 2.17.1 and Puppy 4.00) at:

http://www.puppylinux.ca/tpp/foksyfeyer/gizmo-project/

Please check its md5sum and let me know if you have any problems when using it. Would be interesting to know which earlier Puppies it actually ends up working okay with.

No more skyping around, on with the gizmo.

William.

P.S. Whilst testing I noticed the voicemail from Lobster sitting waiting for me to hear it. Came in loud and clear to my current abode in down south New Zealand. I quickly plugged in my microphone and sent a short confirmation reply (after quickly turning up all the sound mixer settings, because I usually find the volumes very low), so hopefully something got back through. Alas my microphone is a cheapo piece of rubbish.

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#38 Post by smokey01 »

William & Charni, I deleted the three directories and contents as suggested. This fixed the unexpected error and the program now runs again. Clicking the preferences option is a real problem though as it can be accessed in two places. According to The Gizmo web site there are many configurable options that can be managed in preferences so this really need to be fixed.

It's certainly an unconventional way of adding your IM details. Click on the only active address in the address book, type help in the IM and then type 3 to install MSN. It will then ask for your user name and password. Once done I could communicate with my son by IM but we couldn't get a voice call to work. He was on MSN and I was using Gizmo. If I originated the call I could hear it ringing but he could not and vice versa.

I also left a voice mail for Charni. No response yet so I am not sure if you received it.

Gizmo has potential but without some bug fixes and video it cannot compete with Skype. Although Skype is not an open system it is a pretty good package and really does have a large share of the market.

It's a bit like comparing DSL and Slitaz to Puppy. I was horribly offended when I read this recently. There is absolutely nothing wrong with either package, I like them both however there is a huge difference in functionality and features. Size is the only real or fair comparison. Puppy really does compete with the big distros. I would be interested to know what Ubuntu, for example, can do that Puppy can't, functionality speaking.

(soap box mode off)

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#39 Post by mcewanw »

smokey01 wrote:there are many configurable options that can be managed in preferences so this really need to be fixed.
Hopefully the next gizmo release will include video and address the crash issue. In the meantime, I just edit the config files manually. I don't want to use Skype because I prefer using open protocols even when the program (gizmo) itself isn't open source, but that is just a matter of personal choice and preference.
smokey01 wrote: I could communicate with my son by IM but we couldn't get a voice call to work. He was on MSN and I was using Gizmo.
I haven't touched MSN, but I am pretty sure it does not use open protocols for voice, hence gizmo voice won't work with it. Gizmo is just designed to be able to IM such services, not voice calling. It is going to be able to communicate by voice to Google Talk users though (and maybe already can, I haven't tried that yet) - so that is a big plus in my opinion. Google Talk is so easy to install on windows systems that I'm sure many will have it, and of course you can use gizmo to IM google talk users too.
smokey01 wrote: Gizmo has potential but without some bug fixes and video it cannot compete with Skype.
Gizmo already includes video for windows users, so I imagine it is already competing in the larger market. As for the bug we've discovered, it only seems to apply to using Gizmo with Dingo (and not some other Puppy versions), but it is a real nuisance, I agree.

In practice, I believe Skype could be in trouble, unless it starts using open protocols too. I say that, less because of gizmo, than because of google talk adopting open protocols. We all know the market share of google products. I am sure it is no accident that google talk and gizmo have a close working relationship. We'll no doubt find out what happens with skype, one way or the other sooner or later; it would be great if they felt forced to offer open protocols too because of the competition.
smokey01 wrote:It's a bit like comparing DSL and Slitaz to Puppy. I was horribly offended when I read this recently.
Wow, smokey, you take such comparisons very seriously[buy I know that Puppy has a very faithful following, and it no doubt deserves it in every way too - only Puppy can be compared with the big distributions, and generally wins in such comparisons!]. Personally, I love Slitaz [though any comparison has to be taken lightly because of Slitaz's obvious current limitations], as far as I can see it is the only other small distribution that currently shows a lot of promise. It isn't Puppy though; how can it be in such a small size, but it is certainly much better than DSL in that it uses the newer kernels and applications. The main problem with Slitaz is that it doesn't yet offer much in the way of packaged applications and no wireless or modem support as yet (it IS only on its first major public release afterall..., so any comparisons take that into account I'd think] Of course these things will come and I expect it will come down to a matter of choice; I may use both. I also use Ubuntu, but not very regularly, but that's because the CDs are free! :-) [and I like the package managers of both Ubuntu and Slitaz, though I've never worked out how to build an app for Slitaz yet - too busy with Puppy...]

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#40 Post by charnisingh »

Hello Williams,

i have downloaded both of gizmo pets and tested req. libstdc++5
and found no difference as far as working is concerned. i feel you have done a good job.

test was in puppy 4 so crash problem was there but it was there in my
(a non tech) gizmo pkg. also.

6 mb reduction is lot of saving and that too without effecting any of its functions.

there was a time when no body could help me to get GConf2 as a PET
though i wrote to many of forum friends, but one buddy did hellp and that is Mark (MU). but in puppy 4 GConf2 needed some more libs for its working and i used to add those manually till i learned how to modify a PET

anyway that is history now.

thanks for your help.

Charni.

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