wNOP v0.2

[tombh]

Now we're wobblin! Woohoo!

Hey, I was wondering if you could do me a really helpful favour. I want to include the latest fglrx driver in the next version of wNOP but I don't have a new enough ATI card to actually see if I've compiled it properly. Doh! Do you think you might be able to try what we've just done except using this ATI_fglrx-8.2.pet instead of the 7.11 I linked to before? You'd be an absolute star if you can

Don't worry if you're busy as I'm sure someone else will be able to help out, but I guess whilst it's still fresh in your mind. It needs to be done using a fresh boot so you won't be copying over (and potentially messing up) your new-found wobbliness!

Thanks for your all your hard work nic2109

[nic2109]

Tom; I can certainly give that a try. But it won't be for a couple of days now. Is that a problem?

Bewilderingly I find that I have other things to do. Hard to believe I know, but it's actually true.

My new-found wobbliness is lovely, but not much else seems to happen. I am having this with my other laptop too - also a Dell but with Intel graphics which worked straight-away.

Very few of the promised effects actually happen. I've no snow, no fire, no cube other than while it rotates, no fish in the cube when it's rotating. And so on.

I'm suspecting that there's more to do to activate them but I cannot see where it might be.

[tombh]

There's no rush at all, please don't even feel you have to do it.

Bewilderingly I find that I have other things to do. Hard to believe I know, but it's actually true.

Made me chuckle. There's a lot to this life thing I know!

I did see on the Compiz thread you were getting some help off wow for your lack of effects. How far did you get? Did he tell you that first you have to set up key combinations for most plugins? And that the window key is the super key and that you have to enable that through Puppy's Mouse/Keyboard wizard. Actually you can just choose key combos that don't use the Super key. Some effects like blur and water require pixel shaders or some other such marvellous gizmo in your card and not all video cards have 'em.

[nic2109]

There's no rush at all, please don't even feel you have to do it.

Bewilderingly I find that I have other things to do. Hard to believe I know, but it's actually true.

Made me chuckle. There's a lot to this life thing I know!

I did see on the Compiz thread you were getting some help off wow for your lack of effects. How far did you get? Did he tell you that first you have to set up key combinations for most plugins? And that the window key is the super key and that you have to enable that through Puppy's Mouse/Keyboard wizard. Actually you can just choose key combos that don't use the Super key. Some effects like blur and water require pixel shaders or some other such marvellous gizmo in your card and not all video cards have 'em.

So; I put Real Life on "hold" (again) and found time to try out your new .pet. The results were "interesting".

It worked partly and in an unexpected way, but it won't wobble.

Following your instructions left me right out of X and even when I did

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xwin [startxfce4]

it wouldn't play. So I tried

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xorgwizard

and that DID work. It brought up the correct resolution and refresh rates (which is a first) AND then the C-F bit which found the card and suggested Auto. So I was hopeful that it would fly.

But that was the end of the good news as C-F doesn't happen.Doh!

See attached dump for diagnostics.

I haven't got very far at all down the keyboard suggestions, so will go back to that next.

Later Addition

I Forgot one thing when I posted this: when the fglrx .pet processed it reported a missing library. As I cannot now remember the identity of the library and I didn't save anything (so cannot give you any clues) I will try again soon and let you know what happens.

Later, Later Addition

Well, I tried again but with the same end result: the correct resolution and a glxgears result of 2544 fps. But no wobbles.

The missing dependency was libfglrx_gamma.so.1 (see screenshot, attached) so maybe that is the problem.

[tombh]

Thankyou Nick

I love it when things come together! When I first made the driver I posted it over at the ATI fglrx driver thread for kirk to test, but he's running Puppy 4 now. But Papos has just tried it and also found the libfglrx_gamma.so.1 file lacking. And in response he has a compiled a confirmed working version -- ATI-fglrx-8.4 dotpet.

So if you can try this one out, that'd be superduper cos I still need to know that it runs Compiz okay. Again, no rush or anything

[charliet]

Hi folks,

First of all, I'm very impressed with both the graphic visuals, as well as the enhanced usability in wNOP -- I know it's come from many different contributors and it looks and feels great.

It's been a real frustrating thing, though, to figure out how to get Wine going. I downloaded the slackware .tgz file, then ran tgz2pet to create the PET, then installed the PET. Everything seems fine from an installation standpoint -- except I can't find the stupid thing!

It doesn't recognize winecfg, and I've scoured the filesystem looking for the install directory, and I can't find it for anything.

Can anyone shed some light?

Thanks very much,

Charlie T.

[tombh]

Hi there Charlie,

Glad yer liking the wobbly Puppy

Well I've got wine working just fine in my wNOP so it is possible.

Firstly here's a little tip you might not know about, when you're in the terminal and you type the beginning of a word, for example 'wine', when you then press the TAB key bash tries to find all the commands that match that word!

What you'll need to do though is right click on a windows executable and choose to OPEN WITH wine. However, if wine just plain isn't working there is loads of stuff on the forum about getting wine to work. Have you ever used the Google custom Puppy search?

But here is a wine thread to get you started.

Good luck

[nic2109]

Thankyou Nick

I love it when things come together! When I first made the driver I posted it over at the ATI fglrx driver thread for kirk to test, but he's running Puppy 4 now. But Papos has just tried it and also found the libfglrx_gamma.so.1 file lacking. And in response he has a compiled a confirmed working version -- ATI-fglrx-8.4 dotpet.

So if you can try this one out, that'd be superduper cos I still need to know that it runs Compiz okay. Again, no rush or anything

Right; I've tried that and it works, but with one change to your instructions. Executing

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compix-manager

did nothing, so I killed X and ran

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xorgwizard

which worked OK.

There is one odd difference and one bug, so I have actually reverted to your previous version which is clean.

The bug is that when NOT maximised Opera windows are deeper than my screen and underlap the toolbar. This means that neither the bottom nor the bottom RH-corner grab-handles can be reached to re-size it.

The oddity is that the Compiz-Fusion graphics don't display as X is loading. Which is a shame as it look cool.

On my other questions re. snow etc. I have now found lots of them but had to change the keyboard model to get them. The curious thing is that I tried that with a USB Apple keyboard attached and it worked then. And it now works with the built-in laptop k/b which is fine, but unexpected.

I still haven't seen any fish, however. But that's pretty minor.

I have tried the Cairo Dock but without success, and am waiting for a reply from wow to my post on this thread. Feel free to reply either here or there if you can shed light on the question.

Cheers.

[tombh]

That's a bit strange. So what you're saying is that you reverted to my previous fglrx-8.2 dotpet (that had the libgamma bug) and now that works better than Papos' 8.4 dotpet? So it's like we need a combination of the two?

That Opera bug is a show-stopper really isn't it?

Yeah, the Compiz logo on startup doesn't always show, I think it is actually less likely to show up on faster machines because I have to implement a "sleep" command in X startup to give the logo time to show.

Yes, as my grandma always used to say,

"if you want it to rain, hang your washing out to dry, if you want it to snow, change your keyboard"

Wise lady.

Mind you the fish are pretty hard to see even when they are working properly, have you seen what they should look like on youtube?

Thanks again Nick

[Lobster]

I still haven't seen any fish, however. But that's pretty minor.

Might be minor to you. To me it is life and death . . .

[nic2109]

That's a bit strange. So what you're saying is that you reverted to my previous fglrx-8.2 dotpet (that had the libgamma bug) and now that works better than Papos' 8.4 dotpet? So it's like we need a combination of the two?

No; sorry, my wording was clumsy. I have reverted to your original fglrx dptpet - that's the 7.11 version as I could not detect any other differences.

Of course you may be able to expound a long list of improvements. I know that newer is normally better; is that the case here? What are the differences from your perspective? If the Opera window issue can be sorted would you recommend that version?

Now; where are the fish? Well I watched the YouTube video and the way the different screens reduce into a cube which rotates and which has fish inside (I think) is something I have never seen. Which control controls it? I've attached a screenshot showing the CCSM screen with the cube things ticked. The closest I get is when I try the Desktop Cube keys (Ctrl + Alt + down arrow) I get 3 small images of screens side by side with the middle one as my current screen and left and right being what I seen if I scroll left and right to the desktops in either direction.

Is that what should be in a cube? If "yes" then it's not working; but if "no" then which control is it?

[tombh]

Oh right, yeah I get ya -- reverting back to 7.11. Well I don't actually know how the newer ones are better, but seeing as ATI have such a poor reputation with their linux drivers at the moment every little increment helps (or not as the case may be!)

I suppose if the 7.11 works then I may as well include that in the next version of wNOP. But it'd just be nice to let everyone know that it contains all the latest updates. Hey ho.

Hey you need "Rotate Cube", if it's active then the magic should happen with CTRL+ALT+LEFTMOUSEBUTTON

Hey, I'm sure Lobster would like to know if you find any fish

[nic2109]

I'm sure Lobster would like to know if you find any fish

Sorry Lobster - still no fish to be seen.

I've now tried wNOP on 3 other PCs: 2 with Intel graphics, and one with an ATi Rage card. These other boxes worked fine - including Auto config for C-F - but no fish.

And no cube either, except when the screensaver kicks in. And then it's 4 desktops in a solid cube. Neither fish nor gears.

It leaves me wondering whether there's something specific to nVidia graphics that supports this function.

Hey you need "Rotate Cube", if it's active then the magic should happen with CTRL+ALT+LEFTMOUSEBUTTON

Take another look at my screen-shot and you'll see that 'Rotate Cube' is already ticked, so I don't know what else to try.

I'll try and learn to live a fish-less life.

One last observation that you may wish to consider for your next release. I find myself going to the Compiz settings manager again and again to remind myself of the key-bindings for different effects. A crib-sheet located somewhere handy (like on the desk-top) would be a real boon to all of us with poor short-term memories!

[tombh]

There are certainly some effects that are card dependant but I'm almost certain that fishies are not one of them and the cube is definitely not card dependant. I'm sure this is is all just a matter of setting things up properly.

Goto to CCSM->Rotate Cube->Bindings->Intitiate and see what the key binding says. If it says CTRL+ALT+BUTTON1 where BUTTON# refers to all the mouse buttons and that combination does not cause the cube to appear then try setting up a key combination that does work.

Now this has to be the first step to find those elusive fish. Pack yourself a nice lunch, dig up some fresh worms, get up early, find yerself a nice still spot by the side of an eddy, downstream from the rapids and let's do some fishing!

Only once you have mastery over the cube will be able to take the next steps. There are two ways to see inside the cube;
(1) Goto CCSM->Desktop Cube->Transparent Cube->Opacity and reduce some stuff there...
AND/OR
(2) Activate CCSM->Cube Caps. Hopefully the default settings will not have any images assocaited with the caps meaning that the caps will be fully transparent, otherwise you can either remove the pictures from the list or disable them under the CCSM->Cube Caps->Behaviour menu.

Don't give up, we'll find those fish!

--------------------------------------------

I think the mouse buttons are indicated as follows
BUTTON1 - left button
BUTTON2 - right button
BUTTON3 - middle button
BUTTON4 - scroll down
BUTTON5 - scroll up

[nic2109]

Bad news, I'm afraid. It's all gone haywire and I cannot get it back together.

It was working fine (except for my well-documented lack of cubes and fish) and I downloaded and tried out the Cairo Dock. That work OK at first but one of the first things I tried out was the "auto-hide" option combined with placement on the right side.

Disaster! All the desktop icons dispapeared, as did the menu. So I killed and re-started X. It did work but lots was wrong, so I tried to remove the Cairo dock package. That worked but then wNOP was wrecked and it became more like a standard 3.01 look. Even after re-starting.

Gulp!

That's when a backup of the pup_save file would have been handy, so I could get back to a good position..............

Since then I've never been able to re-create the good working setup I had. Sigh.

Never mind my troubles, are you any closer to another release? I know you've been busy with the website and all, but I could do with a fresh start as it's all gone pear-shaped with this version.

[kinjeng]

helo tombh

is Great to have wNOP in my pc, even all my friend don'y believe when i tell them its only under 100 MB distro !!
and i wana make a custom wNOP for my cybercafe, but after puppy version 3.0 i had a difficult problem to remaster it even i try to work arround or try all the thread in forum, or I miss something?

please help me from where i do start
sorry my english its bad
thx before..

regard

kinjeng

+ learn to be always newbie +

[tombh]

@nic2109: Doh! I'm sad to hear that That's the trouble with Compiz-Fusion, it's a sensitive beast, one thing out of place and the whole thing just topples. I had started putting version 1.0 together a few weeks ago, but I've gotten too busy for it at the moment, probably have to wait till the website's finished. I'd still really like to get a more recent bug-free ATI driver working too, I'm sure I could make Papos's bug-free, it might be something to do with the symlinked libGL file, maybe. Well, I suppose there are other things to life apart from Compiz-Fusion -- absence makes the heart grow fonder!

@kinjeng: Yeah remastering can be a little tricky. What method have you been using? And what changes have you been trying to make?

PS. Where is your cybercafe, if you don't mind me asking?

[kinjeng]

@tombh , last night but not least i use the pupremaster.sh from wNOP,
first i use simple way and it's wont work from the new CD i've been build after loading kernel there's error message like this
" unable to determine tty name" continously
the second way i do copy all my /root /etc and all that supossed to chek in, but it seems no confirmation about /var to chek or not coz after cat /temp/var fail it continous to burn the new cd.

I don't know how the cronological about pupremaster.sh , if he can automatic to detec if run from full HD installation why is always to mount /initdr/pup_ro2 ?
and i can't manual to munt pup_301.sfs file to /mnt/initrd/pup_ro2 ?

i don't understand how to edit that script, but i think the cronological is going to
1. make temporary file
2. edit or ad on
3. make iso
4. fire in the hole (burn it)

if just like that the script must be easier to operate and can work with all version puppy
or it just me don't understand what that mean?

last think but not tired ..
i wana try to make dir2pet from all /usr and /etc and maybe /root
can't it work??
haha maybe i just the only who think so desperate haha!

tombh teel me your tricky way before i do that

ps: my cybercafe at magelang city , Indonesia,
15 PC with PII 400 MgH, 256 Ram, 3 GB Hd
Now it work with Muppy 2.17 and Firehydrant 3.0

[nic2109]

sorry my english its bad

regard

kinjeng

Please don't ever apologise for bad English - I am full of admiration for anyone who can make themselves understood in someone else's language.

[tombh]

Magelang City, Indonesia! Puppy is so amazing to bring so many people from around the world together. Yes your English is very good, I can understand you perfectly

I'm afraid I don't have much experience with Puppy's remastering scripts as I just made wNOP manually by editing pup_301.sfs and using the

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mount

,

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mksquashfs

and

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mkisofs

commands.

I suppose my advice would be to maybe start with something a bit simpler. Try using the remaster script on a live

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pfix=ram

boot with a very simple change, like different wallpaper and see if you still have the same problems.

There are definitely people on the forum who know more about remastering than me and will be very happy to help. Is this thread any help? Otherwise use the custom google search to look for other threads or even post a new topic.

Good luck kinjeng