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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Suggestions
Which web browser 2008? Poll broken - Discussion
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darrelljon


Joined: 08 Apr 2007
Posts: 548

PostPosted: Sat 01 Mar 2008, 18:32    Post subject:  Which web browser 2008? Poll broken - Discussion
Subject description: For Community Puppies
 

Which web browser should be used for the next Puppy community release and why? Thanks to MU for pointing out Barry will probably continue to use Seamonkey and to WhoDo as to why Swiftfox isn't viable. As such, I've revised this post and seem to have lost the existing votes. So please vote in here.
Last edited by darrelljon on Sun 02 Mar 2008, 10:07; edited 5 times in total
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13642
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Sat 01 Mar 2008, 19:32    Post subject:  

- I think the title in this thread might be misleading.
Barry is a fan of seamonkey.
He has made clear, that the default Puppy will contain programs he prefers.
So a vote could be valid only for comunity editions, but will have no influence on the original.

- Apart from that, I think seamonkey is a good choice.
Reliable and a full suite.
Loads faster and needs less memory than firefox.
Can easily be replaced by firefox/thunderbird/kompozer in puplets.

- By curiosity, I installed phoenix, the old mozilla 0.5 using Gtk1.
It loads faster than seamonkey, only 3-5 seconds (seamonkey needs around 10).
Fonts are not antialiased, and some stylesheets are displayed wrong.
It also contains unfixed security holes.
But for trusted sites it might be a good choice on very old computers.
http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/phoenix/releases/0.5/
Download, then simply extract somewhere.

I then just edited the startscript "phoenix":
Code:
#moz_libdir=/usr/local/lib/mozilla-1.3a
moz_libdir=/mnt/sda3/_files/phoenix-mozilla/phoenix
export MOZILLA_FIVE_HOME=/mnt/sda3/_files/phoenix-mozilla/phoenix


You also need:
http://puppyfiles.ca/dotpupsde/dotpups/Libraries/libstdc++-libc6.2-2.so.3.pup

UPDATE:
Also try this one:
http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firebird/nightly/latest-0.8/
Supports Gtk2 and Antialiased fonts.
Very fast.
Simply extract and run MozillaFirebird Smile


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Last edited by MU on Sat 01 Mar 2008, 19:55; edited 2 times in total
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WhoDo


Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 4441
Location: Lake Macquarie NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sat 01 Mar 2008, 19:51    Post subject:  

Hi DJ,

I think you'll find that Swiftfox is processor-specific, which lets it out of the equation for a general distro release.

I chose Seamonkey because I haven't seen anything as complete and functional to replace it in a small base version. There are pretenders surfacing, but we are talking about the NEXT version, not 2-5 versions down the track.

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Leachim

Joined: 27 May 2007
Posts: 229

PostPosted: Sat 01 Mar 2008, 19:51    Post subject:  

Firefox is so slow due to it's session management. I disabled session management and now there is no noticeable speed difference to Seamonkey.

I wondered for month why Firefox started up so slow. Both browsers use nearly the same code base. So I tested them in several configurations until I found out that the problem is Firefox' session management! You can disable it in about:config. Just set browser.sessionstore.enabled to false. This will not harm your bookmarks or plugins in any way!
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john biles


Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 1408
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sat 01 Mar 2008, 22:11    Post subject:  

Great tip Leachim! on how to get Firefox running faster.

After a lot of testing of different browsers for TEENpup 2008 I decided to stay with Seamonkey but with a lot of extra features added.
I decided to add more useful apps in place of an extra browser and most users can add Firefox, Opera etc to TEENpup if that's what they want.

So for this vote Seamonkey wins.

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Billwho?


Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 570
Location: still "In The Dog House" East Coast Oz Trialing 4.20

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 00:28    Post subject:  

Seamonkey for me, or failing that Opera. I prefer tp have my browser, E-mail, html editior etc all in one package. Swiftfox is definately processor specific so it can't be used as the default in a general release.
Netscape has reached the end of the road unfortunately, I still have fond memories of a version 5 or 6 install from my windows days so downloaded and installed a copy of the latest from this forum. It only lasted overnight. I was very disapionted. Don't know much about the others.

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cthisbear

Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 3403
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 05:35    Post subject:  

" Firefox is so slow due to it's session management. "

Is that the same in XP?
I could not see that quirk.
Always interesting what you learn here.

Chris.
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10747
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 07:36    Post subject:  

Firefox first and foremost, always. Never Seamonkey, thats just not wanted by Linux users in general. So stand up to the puppy dictators and voice your opinion and overthrow this Seamonkey Government, Together we are strong, apart we are even stronger.
ttuuxxx

Once again, what the hell was I thinking about typing that.lol

PS Swiftfox is cpu specific and should be removed unless your making 10 different version Smile
But i do like swiftfox anyways, also swiftfox isn't allowed by to be put into distros's only users can install it, read the privacy policy statement on the site, I also contacted the Author once about letting me use it in "Fire Hydrant" and he never responded back.
I
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klu9

Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Posts: 345

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 09:17    Post subject:  

I strongly believe that the only sensible choice is My Preferred Browser. It is far better than Your Preferred Browser when it comes to My Personal Criteria.

I therefore humbly nominate My Preferred Browser, and sneer at Your Preferred Browser.

Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz

Maybe have Seamonkey in standard ISO for the general public, but also offer (for us picky so-and-so's):
  • an ISO without Seamonkey
  • Xdelta Patches to add your browser of choice (so that you can just xdelta the "browserless" ISO instead of burning, dotpetting, remastering and burning again).

Personally I prefer Opera; the only thing Seamonkey seems to have over it is a WYSIWYG HTML creator.

So seeing as how this browser war will probably never be resolved, just give me the option of a "browserless" ISO (with maybe just HV3, NetSurf or Dillo) and an Xdelta patch to build Opera into that ISO.

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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10747
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 09:50    Post subject:  

klu9 wrote:
I strongly believe that the only sensible choice is My Preferred Browser. It is far better than Your Preferred Browser when it comes to My Personal Criteria.

I therefore humbly nominate My Preferred Browser, and sneer at Your Preferred Browser.

Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz

Maybe have Seamonkey in standard ISO for the general public, but also offer (for us picky so-and-so's):
  • an ISO without Seamonkey
  • Xdelta Patches to add your browser of choice (so that you can just xdelta the "browserless" ISO instead of burning, dotpetting, remastering and burning again).

Personally I prefer Opera; the only thing Seamonkey seems to have over it is a WYSIWYG HTML creator.

So seeing as how this browser war will probably never be resolved, just give me the option of a "browserless" ISO (with maybe just HV3, NetSurf or Dillo) and an Xdelta patch to build Opera into that ISO.


Klu9 your missing the other thread, If Firefox replaces Seamonkey you'll get Firefox + Sylpheed + Kompozer and it takes around 6MB less space which is great because we have to keep it under 100MB and when we only have 7 or so to play with, this is what we need:) Its a bit smaller in size the the full seamonkey install. Smile
ttuuxxx
Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool Cool

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Leachim

Joined: 27 May 2007
Posts: 229

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 10:57    Post subject:  

cthisbear wrote:
" Firefox is so slow due to it's session management. "

Is that the same in XP?
I could not see that quirk.
Always interesting what you learn here.

I presume that the settings for Linux and Windows are the same. Windows is slow, so I never bothered about Firefox speed under Windows. ^^
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10747
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 11:15    Post subject:  

Maybe Firefox 3 beta and really we should be using 2.12, And today I had over 100 pages open with it and ran just fine the 2.12 version. Plus they did say that theres an easy fix for it. So not to worry.
Its still the best browser on the Planet.
ttuuxxx

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klu9

Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Posts: 345

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 11:15    Post subject:  

ttuuxxx wrote:
Klu9 your missing the other thread,
Which thread?
Quote:
If Firefox replaces Seamonkey you'll get Firefox + Sylpheed + Kompozer and it takes around 6MB less space which is great because we have to keep it under 100MB and when we only have 7 or so to play with, this is what we need:) Its a bit smaller in size the the full seamonkey install. Smile

what's the size with Opera (which has built-in email)+ Kompozer? And is a multi-megabyte WYSIWYG HTML editor really a necessity?

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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10747
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun 02 Mar 2008, 11:23    Post subject:  

klu9 wrote:
ttuuxxx wrote:
Klu9 your missing the other thread,
Which thread?
Quote:
If Firefox replaces Seamonkey you'll get Firefox + Sylpheed + Kompozer and it takes around 6MB less space which is great because we have to keep it under 100MB and when we only have 7 or so to play with, this is what we need:) Its a bit smaller in size the the full seamonkey install. Smile

what's the size with Opera (which has built-in email)+ Kompozer? And is a multi-megabyte WYSIWYG HTML editor really a necessity?


well Mu seems to think WYSIWYG is important, Personally I would kill and WYSIWYG and Gnumeric because the average user doesn't use those 2 applications, I do because I have a website, but I'm one out of 50 on here that does.
I also like Opera, not as much as Firefox but its next in line for me personally.
I was one who released the second latest opera version on here as a pet package.
Anyways here's the link, we've been talking about it for awhile
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=26754

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nutts4life


Joined: 15 Feb 2008
Posts: 263
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu 13 Mar 2008, 11:47    Post subject:  

Do you guys not feel puppy should be looking forward to web 2 apps.

The browser is the most important function of a distro these days. Once you can get on the net you can get to a whole host of apps online.

Including a mail app.

My feelings are, scrap the mail app, calendar and let an online app do that work and concentrate on a fully functional solid browser.

So i vote for internet explorer 5.....
Ok, i'm joking.

It's got to be something like swiftweasel. (If you've never heard of it, it's a branch of iceweasel combined with switfox).

Bascially if the swift fox family to hold all there various chip specific dlls on one install decide at install on which version to install. we are laughing.

If someone needs a mail client then the simplemail plugin for firefox will be fine.

I know this is all a bit 'up in the air' but, see the future.... can you see it? yup you've got it now.

n4l
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