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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
Muppy 008.1 Mini + Standard (updated Jan, 22 2008)
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Sun 13 Jan 2008, 14:52    Post subject:  Muppy 008.1 Mini + Standard (updated Jan, 22 2008)
Subject description: Mini+addon or full CD
 

------------------------------------------
THIS IS OUT OF DATE!

GET THE NEW VERSION HERE:


http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=171213#171213

------------------------------------------

Screenshot:



Full-size view (1680x1050, 400 kb):
http://noforum.de/pics/Muppy-008.1.jpg

Info für deutschsprachige Nutzer:
http://f24.parsimony.net/forum54930/messages/73160.htm


Minisys-Linux-Muppy008.1 (Standard) is a Live-CD based on Puppy 301.
It is 440 MB in size.

Mini-Muppy is ca. 170 MB in size.
The purpose is to have lots of eyecandy and libraries (like accellerated OpenGL),
but being a bit faster than the "full Muppy" on slow computers.
It will be the base for some more "specialized" Muppy versions, e.g. a Server-Muppy (in spring)
It is Muppy 008 with Servicepack 3 and more changes, but the big programs removed.

I removed:
Firefox
OpenOffice
Wine
Java
Tuxracer
Descent 2
Codecs
Minisys
TheGimp
It has less Themes and Backgroundpictures.

These files can be installed as addon-LANGUAGE_081.sfs if you like!

I added: Bluefish HTML-editor 1.0.7.
Gimp upgraded to 2.4.3 in the addon.
Pburn 0.9.2
Pwget
Goggles DVD-Player
Conky Systemmonitor
Gtklogfileviewer
Fox Calculator
Added german localization for Seamonkey, Bootmanager, shutdown-dialog, menuentries, Cups 1.3.5, Networkwizard, Gftp, Anfänger-Hilfe.
Seamonkey has a nice theme.
The Mini uses JWM by default (with the typical Muppy-look, Vista-Theme and colourfull background), but you also can switch to icewm on the fly.
The JWM-Menu is faster than the one from Icewm, if you have many entries.
Seamonkey needs on my slow testmachine (P500, 128 MB Ram) 35 sec. to start, Firefox would need 50 secs.

The Standard-Edition uses Icewm and Firefox as defaults.

As the Mini has so many libraries already, it is not very difficult to install additional
Programs like firefox. Simply use PetGet (or if you are german) the Firefox-Installer.


How fast/slow is it?
The full Muppy runs pretty fast on a IBM Thinkpad P800 with 256 MB.
On a P500 with 128 MB, it is a bit sluggish. Huge apps are really slow , OpenOffice almost unusable, Firefox lets you grumble often.
The Mini behaves slightly better, but still not "perfect".
I also installed Puppy 108 there, and it is noticably faster.
But it meanwhile is so outdated, that you often reach limits.
Like non-working hardware or programs.
On a slow machine, I would install both.
E.g. use 108 for Abiword and such, and Mini-Muppy to install Programs without hazzle
that will not work in 108.


Download:

http://puppyisos.org/isos/2008-01-to-06/
Mirror:
http://puppyfiles.ca/puppyisos/isos/

DE is german.
EN is english.

Mark
Mini-Muppy-008-small.jpg
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Mini-Muppy-008-small.jpg


Last edited by MU on Fri 01 Feb 2008, 00:30; edited 15 times in total
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wetterau

Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 37

PostPosted: Mon 14 Jan 2008, 20:30    Post subject: thanks
Subject description: mini-muppy 008
 

Thanks Mark, mini-muppy 008 working very well on a T23 Thinkpad, 512mb ram. It picked up the graphics sfs and the OO sfs with no problem. The look & feel is nice; I like having a few extra tools, used to program for a living. Good work.
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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Tue 15 Jan 2008, 02:18    Post subject: Re: Mini-Muppy 008
Subject description: less than half size than the desktopversion
 

MU wrote:

I removed:


Please Mark
Can you tell those unfamiliar
what is the base and what is in this version
and what the advantages are for running this OS? Very Happy

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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Tue 15 Jan 2008, 10:26    Post subject:  

The base is Muppy 008, description:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=23397

It is a iso based on Puppy 301, enhanced with more libraries and programs.
The intention of Muppy is to make it even easier to start with Puppy.
It tries to look more attractive by integrating parts of the "ezpup" Theme-collection and other grafics.
The included libraries give you less dependency-problems when you install additional programs like games.

It supports hardware-accellerated grafics out of the Box.
It comes with the mediaplayer "mplayer", that is known to run more stable than Puppys gxine.
Utilities like Pburn (CD-burning), pnethood (access network computers) and gslapt (install packages from Slackware-Linux 12) make the usage easier.

It is available in 2 languages.
For germans, it will be the "first choice" Puppy, as it is much easier to understand than the english one.
The optional build-system "build-a-muppy" even allows you to create your own, customized version of Muppy.
So my patches for localization can be used to create Isos in other languages using that build-system.
Or you can create your own smaller Muppy by deleting some folders in the build-system.

BSB-Software, Bielefeld offers support contracts on request, and can help to migrate your company to Muppy.

A current screenshot of my german Muppy on a 22'' widescreen-monitor:



Full-size (400 kb):
http://noforum.de/pics/Muppy008-1600.jpg

Mini-Muppy looks identical, you just had to install Firefox and Gimp on your own with PSI (Puppy Software Installer), if you want to use them, too.

Mark
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2008, 02:52    Post subject:  

copied over frpm german board:

Message from Sage:
Mark: It would be very helpful if you could summarise this discussion in the main Forum so that we can better understand your strategy?
Build-a-Muppy may be a bridge too far?
Since John has no immediate plans to update MeanPup, maybe you (and he?) could intervene with an ~50Mb Muppy. That would, of course, not include Wine.
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2008, 02:53    Post subject:  

There will be no such small version.
The current is what I tested as best compromize between size and usability.
The main aspect of Muppy is to make Puppy easily usable, even by novices.
This requires a set of additional libs and drivers.
People who look for optimized versions in regard to size and speed, should look at Puppy 1, and maybe 2.
During my tests on a P500 with 128 MB I could see, that 108 is significantly faster than MiniMuppy.
The disadvantage of 108 however is: you have no unicode, and several newer applications will not work. Also hardware requires tweaks, as not always USB is detected. I had to patch image.gz for that reason.
It could however be possible, to build a very usable System on that base for standard purposes.
Office, websurfing, an older gimp - that is a fine system already for old computers as they are often used in schools.

But it is not, what Muppy is intended to become.
A system, where you can install new software without trouble, that can be used in any country.

People who still want to ignore my warnings, can try to build a cut-down Muppy on their own though.
They must download build-a-muppy.
It has subfolders with OpenOffice and other applications.
You can delete those and whatever you like, and then run the 2 buildscripts to generate a new iso.
I would be quite curious about the result, if you open a new thread, I'll gladly help you to solve problems then.
I just will not take the leadership for such a version, as it is not matching the concept that we have ourselves with Muppy (to make it one of the leading systems in germany for Windows-Refugees).

I just have read this message:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=167285#167285

It certainly is true.
Lighthouse will be faster. It is based on Puppy 2. But if you will try to port it to german, the trouble just begins.
And Gimp 2.4 will be a no-go.
That's the price for the speed.
This is the reason, why I did not continue on Muppy 007 (which is faster, too), but started 008 from scratch.

Mark
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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15122
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2008, 04:42    Post subject: May all Beings Benefit (even the fish)  



Thanks Mark Very Happy

Your explanation certainly clarifies.

My requirements for an OS are now reliability.
After all a fast OS that does not work
has a speed factor of zero
Yes there are speed differences amongst the versions
and puplets AND for some people the criteria is speed.

Some mad fish (so I am told) just want to play Descent 2
out of the box (they can do that with the mega size Muppy
or add it with PSI) m m m . . . sounds good . . .

I think Firefox 3 Beta 2 (a bit of working spice) + Muppy might
suit me, whilst waiting for a Dingo Beta
http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/all-beta.html

At the moment I am on borrowed time . . .
My HD started working after being frozen and turned upside down
(I put it in the computer this way by mistake - well . . . I meant to freeze it) Confused

My Mac (G4) on its way to having a Tiger (OS X) installed
is running MAC OS 9.2 - yuk!
but that is another story . . .

Meanwhile I am trying to build my third YinYana shrine using a laptop
(the second one was Puppy powered)
http://www.zen45800.zen.co.uk/shrine2/
running from CD and USB keydrive
(details soon) Cool

Mini-Muppy could be the basis of Vision . . . Very Happy
http://tmxxine.com/wik/wikka.php?wakka=LinuxTmxxineVision
and suitable for a Muppy Puppy Shrine . . . m m m . . .

Will try it out and let you know of my contemplations
OM YA MUPPY HUM

May all Beings Benefit (even the fish) Rolling Eyes

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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2008, 05:06    Post subject:  

Your shrine has very friendly colours, I like it Smile
Feel free to use and modify Muppy as you like, this is why we have made the build-scripts Smile

Mark
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Lobster
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Posts: 15122
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PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2008, 06:04    Post subject:  

glad you liked the colours - the pic is from above

I tried using my program here (needs dotpupping if you have a moment
- I did try - screwed up and just left it working but it may be good for Muppy, Dingo and other puplets. . .)
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=165436#165436

to download
no luck Rolling Eyes
then used gwget from Ian
no luck Rolling Eyes

then remembered can only download from browser
I am on my third attempt . . . Shocked
thank goodness for md5sum

Update:
OK this is my 5th attempt
- have to give up - for now Smile

Update 2:
Ok many more attempts
including downloading Opera (better downloader)
eventually found this command to download
the English version

wget -c --referer=http://puppyisos.org http://puppyisos.org/isos/2008-01-to-06/pfiles/Mini-Muppy-008-EN.iso

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Last edited by Lobster on Thu 17 Jan 2008, 01:24; edited 1 time in total
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 4833
Location: GB

PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2008, 07:32    Post subject:  

Thanks for your epistle, Mark. It clarifies a number of questions. Appreciate you taking the time to explain.
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Tui

Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 380
Location: Wellington New Zealand

PostPosted: Thu 17 Jan 2008, 08:45    Post subject:  

Hi lobster, Yes I like you had a number of tries to get this mini puppy
downloaded but also no good.
My shots at a d/l was with seamonkey with the d/l manager reporting
a complete d/l. - but after a few cd burns this was found not to be
true. My screen shots included also your instruction to use
" wget -c " with the URL I am not sure were the d/l iso was going
to be located - Please explain this part of event.
bugfile_06.png
Description 
png

 Download 
Filename  bugfile_06.png 
Filesize  194.88 KB 
Downloaded  4596 Time(s) 
bugfile_05.png
Description 
png

 Download 
Filename  bugfile_05.png 
Filesize  218.02 KB 
Downloaded  4580 Time(s) 
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Thu 17 Jan 2008, 12:08    Post subject:  

The server is protected against download-utilities to protect from attacs.

Code:
wget -c --referer=http://puppyisos.org http://puppyisos.org/isos/2008-01-to-06/Muppy-008.1/pfiles/Mini-Muppy-008.1-EN.iso


tricks this out.

Or use the mirror in Canada:
Code:
wget -c http://puppyfiles.ca/puppyisos/isos/Muppy008.1/Mini-Muppy-008.1-EN.iso


The file will be downloaded to your current folder, to see that type:
pwd

To change to another folder, type for example:
cd /mnt/hda1/downloads/

This folder must exist of course.
If you wait 4-5 hours, you can get an updated version.

Mark

Last edited by MU on Mon 21 Jan 2008, 05:33; edited 3 times in total
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Thu 17 Jan 2008, 22:26    Post subject:  

I uploaded version 008.1

I had not time yet to test carefully.
Wait 1-2 days if you want me to test them first!


I just tested the german mini without addons.
The rest should work "in theory".
I release it, because I re-ordered my build-system for better modularity, and want to make available
an iso that already includes all the bugfixes from the last weeks.

You have 2 Minis (english and german).

And you have 2 addon-LANGUAGE_081.sfs
These contain OpenOffice, Java, and such.
All that, what else would be in the big iso.

The difference to the big iso is, that like this you cannot run Openoffice from CD.
You must shutdown Muppy, allow it to create a save-file.
Then save the addon in the same partition where the save-file was created.
It then will be offered by the bootmanager to be loaded.

Advantage: the small iso uses less Ram, so it can be loaded completely on older computers, where the big iso had to be mounted from disk.
I don't know though how much Ram is required for that.
Conki says I have 240 MB Ram in usage.
Please tell me your results.

Other changes compared to 008:
Upgrades:
Gimp upgraded to 2.4.3.
Pburn 0.9.2

New:
Goggles DVD-Player (english)
Conky systemmonitor
Fox-Calculator
pwget
system log monitor (gtkviewlogfiles)

Translated to german:
All menu entries
Bootmanager
shutdown-dialog (create save-file)
Network-Wizard
German locale added for:
Cups (1.3.5)
Gftp
Seamonkey
Now has german Anfänger-Hilfe (newbee quick start).

It now has a different default-theme, similar to the one on the screenshot above of my 22'' monitor.
Gtk2 now uses Aero-linista (not on the screenshot).

Several bugfixes.


Attention:

If you have an old msy_save.2fs, it now will be upgraded by Puppy upgrade-script.
I have not tested though, how exact it works.

If you encounter problems, try to start with a new save-file (backup your old one before the upgrade!)

http://puppyisos.org/isos/2008-01-to-06/

** Do not install the old Servicepack in this release! **

** Check the md5sum after download before you burn ** Exclamation
For example:
md5sum MiniMuppy-008.1-DE.iso
It must be the same as the MiniMuppy-008.1-DE.iso.md5.txt.
The server is known to be problematic, but it is 10 times faster to upload than to sourceforge.net.

For people who want to build own Muppys:
The "build"-files will take hours to upload, best is to wait until tomorrow.
The build-office-addon must be extracted in
muppy008.1build/sfs-sources/

Instructions see the Minisys-Linux 008 thread, that covers a lot of topics and has a link-collection.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=23397

Issues:
the rc.shutdown translations must not be saved as unicode (e.g. the "create msy_save.2fs?"-dialogs).
In console-mode, Muppy just can display ISO-characters.

For german that is ok, but I hope we can find a solution for UTF in the console (outside X) somewhen.

Mark
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Fri 18 Jan 2008, 11:15    Post subject:  

I will update the isos today, as I find minor issues.
If you already downloaded, please install the attached dotpup.
** edit: attachment removed **

Fixes:
- pburn starts english.
Must be launched a second time to work german.
Also the first time, the preferences do not show up.
Reason: version-numer in .pburnrc must be set to 0.9.2

- copy /usr/bin/pwget to /usr/local/bin/pwget to get a menu-entry

- When you ran chooselocale, you had no windowmanager.
I added code to .xinitrc that launches jwm then.
I will overwork this code again, so that icewm is started in the big iso.

- added icons for gqview and xmms
- added new startfiles for firefox (seamonkey was launched)
To set firefox as defaultbrowser if you have the addon,
edit /usr/local/bin/defaultbrowser.
Replace "mozstart" with "firefox".

Mark

Last edited by MU on Mon 21 Jan 2008, 04:13; edited 1 time in total
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13644
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Fri 18 Jan 2008, 13:54    Post subject:  

I updated the 2 Isos.
The addons are not updated yet, they only will get 2 new Firefox-startscripts.
You can use the old addons until then and install the patch from my last message.

Currently I upload the updated build-system.
Then the addons.
Then the "full" isos (Minisys-Linux008.1-Standard-LANGUAGE.iso)

This takes several hours, I'll keep you informed about the upload-progress.

They seem to work pretty good so far.
There was one issue reported for the old isos:
When you chose to save your settings to a partition, not to a file, they were not found.
I had no time yet to check that, must do it in the next days.
So you might prefer to choose the default, "save to file".

Screenshot:



Full-size view (1680x1050, 400 kb):
http://noforum.de/pics/Muppy-008.1.jpg

Mark
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