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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Announcements
Pup214R v1.00 - Puppy Linux 2.14 Revisited, is now available
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10839
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Thu 20 Dec 2007, 00:30    Post_subject:  

jamesbond wrote:
Just downloaded 2.14R 1.01 ... thinking whether I should "upgrade" my faithful 2.15CE, and immediately noted one thing: Gxine doesn't play fullscreen (on Xvesa)?

Hey jamesbond basically gxine is not good at all with the 3.0 series and should be replaced with xine-gui which work full screen. or vlc or mplayer which ever you choose.
Actually I would give it maybe a few weeks before replacing 2.15ce since this version is getting better day by day. I only replaced the 2.15ce I had only After I made My "Fire Hydrant".
Any which ways have fun and Merry Christmas

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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Thu 20 Dec 2007, 17:08    Post_subject: Re: re: Grubby little details
Sub_title: good news and bad news
 

prehistoric wrote:
Round two: formatted hda1 and rerenamed /reboot on hda6 back to /boot. This time grubconfig did not complete the install of grub.

Something doesn't make sense here: if you already have Grub installed (to /boot/grub on one partition), the installer should add the entry to it and grubconfig won't run at all! Could it have missed the file? (function find_grub_install in the installer)

Quote:
There is an old problem here, which people have been living with, grubconfig generates menu entries for linux partitions with no vmlinuz. This is obviously not urgent.

I never heard of it before, but it seemed to me like that might happen, from looking through the code -- but only in the "simplegrub" case, where it seems to just search for Linux partitions and add entries for them...Fixed. (see loop starting at line 454)

Quote:
# Linux bootable initrd config begins
title Linux initrd /tmp/boot/boot/initrd-2.6.18.8.tex5.lgc.img on (/dev/hda6)
root (hd0,5)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz root=/dev/hda6 ramdisk_size=282 root=/dev/ram0 rw
initrd /tmp/boot/boot/initrd-2.6.18.8.tex5.lgc.img
# Linux bootable initrd config ends

Ha! The reason the initrd with the funny name is found is that grubconfig searches for initrd*, but I guess it's ok, since that really is the file you want to use for TinyFlux.
What is funny here is that the reason it won't boot is something I mentioned in a previous post that I don't understand: I fixed this in the special Puppy-frugal section I added, but didn't rouch the normal case -- which obviously also needs modifying. Fixed.

Quote:
My own preference here would be to add an entry for Puppy to the existing menu.lst, or even write the entry to a separate file and let the user edit it in. If the system is booting with Grub from an existing Linux installation we should do nothing to prevent that from working.

As I mention above, the installer already works that way: it finds menu.lst, then presents the user with a edit-box containing the proposed new entry and then inserts it.
pup214R-installer-Dec-20th.pet
Description 
pet

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Filename  pup214R-installer-Dec-20th.pet 
Filesize  32.9 KB 
Downloaded  362 Time(s) 

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prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1303

PostPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2007, 10:03    Post_subject: re: grubby little details
Sub_title: perfectly acceptable, almost flawless
 

Hi Dougal,

This time we have a winner. As you observed there was something wrong with the previous test. (Faster than thought. Embarassed ) When I reformatted and did the second install, I either forgot to restore the MBR or used the wrong backup. So, the Grub installation was broken, with an MBR for the hda1 install and everything else on hda6, with TinyFlux.

This time it generated a menu entry which would work, but failed to write it to the menu.lst on hda6. This is a tricky case where I think it is acceptable to have people edit menu.lst.

The only change I would make is to write the proposed entry to a tmp file and change the message to tell the user where to find it. Here's the menu.lst entry, including the previous working entry for the last puppy214R installation.
Code:

title = Puppy 214R (frugal) on hda1
rootnoverify (hd0,5)
kernel /boot/puppy214R/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 PMEDIA=idehd psubdir=puppy214R
initrd /boot/puppy214R/initrd.gz

title Puppy 214R (frugal) on hda1
kernel (hd0,5)/boot/puppy214R/vmlinuz BOOT_IMAGE=Puppy_214R_(frugal)_on_hda1 root=/dev/ram0 PMEDIA=idehd
initrd (hd0,5)/boot/puppy214R/initrd.gz


The BOOT_IMAGE argument was generated by the TinyFlux (PCLinuxOS) installer. It does nothing for puppy, except explain where it is getting the sfs files. I had previously hand edited that entry to make it work.

Your ordeal is over. You can forget Grub in the near future. Thanks for your attention and patience.

prehistoric
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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2949
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Fri 21 Dec 2007, 12:29    Post_subject:  

Dougal
I'm having problems resizing my pup_save, it is installed on an ext3 partition.

I have also booted off another partition and fsck.ext3 reported that my 214R partition is being unmounted uncleanly. This seems to happen every time I shutdown 214R.

I may have run fsckext2 on the partition and pup_save at one point, I don't know if this could be the cause of my problems.
Here's there error when trying to resize
Code:
Forcing filesystemcheck on /pup214_save.3fs before resizing      done
Increasing /pup214_save.3fs by 65536 Kbytes please wait          failed
Dumping last lines of /tmp/bootinit.log...
65536+0 records in
65536+0 records out
resize 1.40.2 (12-Jul-2007)
ext2fs_check_mount_point: no such file or directory while determining whether /m
nt/dev_save/pup214_save.3fs is mounted
Dumping last lines of kernel log...
<4>EXT2-fs warning (device hda3): ext2 fill_super: mounting ext3 filesystem as e
xt2
<4>EXT2-fs warning: mounting unchecked fs, running e2fsck is recommended
<4>EXT2-fs warning (device hda3): ext2 fill_super: mounting ext3 filesystem as e
xt2
<4>EXT2-fs warning: mounting unchecked fs, running e2fsck is recommended

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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2007, 09:39    Post_subject: Re: re: grubby little details
Sub_title: perfectly acceptable, almost flawless
 

prehistoric wrote:
This time it generated a menu entry which would work, but failed to write it to the menu.lst on hda6. This is a tricky case where I think it is acceptable to have people edit menu.lst.

What do you mean, the installer showed you the right entry in the edit-box but then didn't add it?
I think I know how something like that could happen -- it's something I've been needing to find a solution for for a long time:
I need to know where to squeeze in the entry from a script, so it doesn't go in the middle of a different entry (and you don't want it at the far end, after the extra grub options...).
What I currently use is the lines of the type
Code:
#bootable linux...begins/ends

But if grub was installed by a different installer, you might not have such lines... so I need to find a sure way of knowing where to squeeze it in.


Quote:
Your ordeal is over. You can forget Grub in the near future. Thanks for your attention and patience.

Maybe... when I fixed the problem of Linux partitions being added by grubconfig even if they don't have a kernel on them I copied some code for it and forgot to make a little adjustment... which resulted in it not adding any partitions... Fixed.
pup214R-installer-Dec-22nd.pet
Description 
pet

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Filename  pup214R-installer-Dec-22nd.pet 
Filesize  32.97 KB 
Downloaded  353 Time(s) 

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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2007, 09:45    Post_subject:  

HairyWill wrote:
I'm having problems resizing my pup_save, it is installed on an ext3 partition.

Ok, I'll look into it.
I must say, though, that I have recently resized mine and seem to recall that it worked ok... and I don't have the unmounting problem -- just run with pfix=fsck a couple of days ago and it was ok, so maybe it is related to the partition in some way?

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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2348
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2007, 12:08    Post_subject:  

Dougal wrote:

I must say, though, that I have recently resized mine and seem to recall that it worked ok... and I don't have the unmounting problem -- just run with pfix=fsck a couple of days ago and it was ok


I can only imagine what I'd think, if I stumbled upon this site and didn't know a word of Puppy Linux talk; the mind boggles.
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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2949
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2007, 14:09    Post_subject:  

Dougal,
I think this is likely to be my fault. My kernel boot line included
PUPSAVE=ext2,hda3,/pup214_save.3fs
considering both the partition and the pup_save are (I think) formatted ext3, puppy is justified in being confused.

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jcoder24


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 601
Location: Barbados

PostPosted: Sat 22 Dec 2007, 16:39    Post_subject: Re: re: grubby little details
Sub_title: perfectly acceptable, almost flawless
 

Dougal wrote:
so I need to find a sure way of knowing where to squeeze it in.


How about looking for lines that begin with "title" --see copy of my menu.lst below.
Code:
# Start GRUB global section
timeout 15
color light-gray/blue black/light-gray
# End GRUB global section

title Puppy Linux - NOP
rootnoverify (hd0,1)
kernel /puppynop/vmlinuz pmedia=idehd psubdir=puppynop
initrd /puppynop/initrd.gz

title Puppy Linux - VMPlayer
rootnoverify (hd0,1)
kernel /vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 pmedia=idehd
initrd /initrd.gz

title Puppy Linux - Dingo
rootnoverify (hd0,1)
kernel /puppy4/vmlinuz pmedia=idehd psubdir=puppy4
initrd /puppy4/initrd.gz

title GeeXbox
rootnoverify (hd0,1)
kernel /GEEXBOX/boot/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 rw init=linuxrc splash=silent vga=789 video=vesafb:ywrap,mtrr
initrd /GEEXBOX/boot/initrd.gz
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2007, 09:37    Post_subject: Re: re: grubby little details
Sub_title: perfectly acceptable, almost flawless
 

jcoder24 wrote:
Dougal wrote:
so I need to find a sure way of knowing where to squeeze it in.


How about looking for lines that begin with "title"

I actually thought about that last night (I always end up thinking of these things when I can't fall asleep...).
The problem is that I'd rather add it after the last entry (and that it might mess up the comments a bit...).
It's good if people can show me examples of differently formatted grub menus, so I can sure I don't end messing up some funny special option included by some distros...

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prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1303

PostPosted: Sun 23 Dec 2007, 17:43    Post_subject: grub menu.lst
Sub_title: How should Puppy deal with "foreign linux" menu.lst?
 

@Dougal

The suggestion about title lines is about as good as anything I can come up with. This is close to the point where you should stop programming anyway. I can go through a collection of installations and produce a syntactic description of the Grub menu.lst files generated by different systems, yet still fail to deal with special cases.

SuSE linux had, at least at one time, a hash code to tell it if anyone manually edited a configuration file. No matter what you do you would change that code, causing the configuration scripts to abandon that file to manual control.

The most harmless change I can think of is to simply append the Puppy 214R entry to the menu.lst file as a comment. People, even newbies, do a good job of separating code and grouping comments. Removing comment symbols and positioning the entry where desired ought to be within the ability of any Puppy user who would think of doing a hard disk installation of any kind.

Making the operation fully automatic in all cases is the kind of thing that leads to big, powerful installers, like the PCLinuxOS installer. It also pushes you toward the "system du jour" world of endless versioning and updates. When this works it is convenient for the user; when it fails it is incomprehensible to the vast majority. On big Linux systems the feeling of fighting the installer is one of my pet peeves.

I'll try to collect some other examples when I test the Dec 22 pet above. Right now I'm involved in some seasonal activities.

(As I understand it, the tribal elders have assured us that the Sun has responded to entreaties to head north, causing everyone to go out and take part in wretched excess. This is traditional, and more economical than earlier methods of sacrificing virgins. If I have misunderstood and offended people all I can say in defense is that I'm a stranger in this millennium.)

prehistoric
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rerwin


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 1529
Location: Maine, USA

PostPosted: Mon 24 Dec 2007, 23:24    Post_subject: Host misidentification problem from 2.17
Sub_title: Puppy should be consistant and continue to use the MAC address for host identification.
 

Thank you, Dougal and Raffy, for an ideal Puppy -- the stability of pre-2.17 and the improvements since 2.14! I hope to replace 2.17 with it on my day-to-day PC. However, it does retain a problem I identified in 3.00beta, carried over from 2.17. It was about dhcpcd's impact on my old router.

Puppy has always identified itself with the ethernet interface's MAC address, until 2.17. The dhcpcd version used in 2.17 defaults to something for a new standard (ipv6) that impacts some older routers (like mine) that track connections by MAC address. I discussed this at length on the forum, but tempestuous netted it out here: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=143233&search_id=2053334983#143233

Since Puppy has always used the MAC address, by accepting the default, and has never given an option to use the ipv6 standard, I request that the net-setup script continue the practice by adding a parameter recommended by the author (but undocumented) to retain use of the MAC address. The author has violated the rule specified in the man page, by changing the default:
Quote:
-I <ClientID>
Specifies the client identifier string. dhcpcd uses the default client identifier (MAC address of the network interface) if it is not specified.
Use of the MAC address can be indicated by inserting a null client-ID parameter into line 840 of net-setup.sh, resulting in:
Code:
if dhcpcd -d -I '' "$INTERFACE"

EDIT 12/29: While the above change alone appears to correct the problem, for consistency, two other calls to dhcpcd should also have the "-I ''" inserted. Line 861 in net-setup.sh should be:
Code:
dhcpcd -I '' ${INTERFACE}
And for rebooting, line 221 of /etc/rc.d/rc.network should be:
Code:
     dhcpcd -I '' ${INTERFACE}
/EDIT

My original posts started here: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=141355&search_id=515526910#141355.
However, in 3.00 beta2 I found another problem with dhcpcd in that it mistakenly showed my connection as active even though it actually had failed.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=143292&search_id=515526910#143292
So the version in 2.17 & 2.14R is not reliable; I think Barry backed it out of Puppy 3 and replaced it with a later version in Puppy 4, that uses the MAC address. Ideally, the latest version (in 4.00 alphas) would be compiled for the 2.14 kernel and used in 2.14R. But that may go beyond what is reasonable to do.

An alternate solution is to just revert to the 2.14-2.16 version of dhcpcd (1.3.22), if there are no problems with it. I substituted that version in my 2.17.1 system and right now in 2.14R. I do not know what problems others had with it.

Richard

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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2348
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Tue 25 Dec 2007, 02:31    Post_subject: Re: Host misidentification problem from 2.17
Sub_title: Puppy should be consistant and continue to use the MAC address for host identification.
 

rerwin wrote:
Thank you, Dougal and Raffy, for an ideal Puppy -- the stability of pre-2.17 and the improvements since 2.14!


I'm going to try this puppy next, it sounds very attractive to me. I've been enjoying 2.17 but I had a feeling a slightly earlier distribution would suit my old laptop even better. Looking forward to giving it a spin.
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prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1303

PostPosted: Thu 27 Dec 2007, 15:02    Post_subject: example menu.lst generated by Mepis  

@Dougal

Here's a brand new menu.lst from an installation of SimplyMepis 7.0 for your collection of examples from other Linux systems.
Code:


timeout 15
color cyan/blue white/blue
foreground ffffff
background 0639a1

gfxmenu /boot/grub/message

title MEPIS at sda1, newest kernel
root (hd0,0)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz root=/dev/sda1 nomce quiet splash vga=791
boot

title MEPIS at sda1, previous kernel (if any)
root (hd0,0)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz.old root=/dev/sda1 nomce quiet splash vga=791
boot

title MEPIS at sda1, kernel 2.6.22-1-mepis-smp
root (hd0,0)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.22-1-mepis-smp root=/dev/sda1 nomce quiet splash vga=791
boot

title TinyFlux linux 1.0
root (hd0,2)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz BOOT_IMAGE=linux root=/dev/hda3 acpi=on resume=/dev/hda2 splash=silent vga=788
initrd (hd0,2)/boot/initrd.img

title Puppy Linux Fire Hydrant, frugal (in hda1)
rootnoverify (hd0,0)
kernel /puppy301FH/vmlinuz pmedia=idehd psubdir=puppy301FH
initrd /puppy301FH/initrd.gz

title MEMTEST
kernel /boot/memtest86+.bin



The Puppy entry is one I added manually. The entry for Tiny Flux 1.00 was automatically extracted from the previous menu.lst and included when Mepis 7.0 installed Grub.

For completeness, here's the menu.lst generated by Tiny Flux, (PCLinuxOS installer). The Puppy entry here was also manually edited. The Windows entry refers to a system no longer present on hda1.
Code:

timeout 10
color black/cyan yellow/cyan
gfxmenu (hd0,2)/usr/share/gfxboot/themes/pcfluxboxos/boot/message
default 0

title TinyFlux linux 1.0
kernel (hd0,2)/boot/vmlinuz BOOT_IMAGE=linux root=/dev/hda3  acpi=on resume=/dev/hda2 splash=silent vga=788
initrd (hd0,2)/boot/initrd.img

title TinyFlux linux-nonfb
kernel (hd0,2)/boot/vmlinuz BOOT_IMAGE=linux-nonfb root=/dev/hda3  acpi=on resume=/dev/hda2
initrd (hd0,2)/boot/initrd.img

title TinyFlux failsafe
kernel (hd0,2)/boot/vmlinuz BOOT_IMAGE=failsafe root=/dev/hda3  failsafe acpi=on resume=/dev/hda2
initrd (hd0,2)/boot/initrd.img

title Puppy Linux Fire Hydrant, frugal (in hda1)
rootnoverify (hd0,0)
kernel /puppy301FH/vmlinuz pmedia=idehd psubdir=puppy301FH
initrd /puppy301FH/initrd.gz

title windows
root (hd0,0)
makeactive
chainloader +1


I'll pick up a few more examples over the next few days.

prehistoric
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Dougal


Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Hell more grotesque than any medieval woodcut

PostPosted: Fri 28 Dec 2007, 09:48    Post_subject: Re: Host misidentification problem from 2.17
Sub_title: Puppy should be consistant and continue to use the MAC address for host identification.
 

rerwin wrote:
Use of the MAC address can be indicated by inserting a null client-ID parameter into line 840 of net-setup.sh, resulting in:
Code:
if dhcpcd -d -I '' "$INTERFACE"

I've implemented that, I'll have to ask Tempestuous about updating/reverting the dhcp version.

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